Abbotabad Report | Discussions, analysis & recommendations.

[muse]

The Spokesman Pakistan - EJAZ HAIDER-Restructure the intelligence set-up

This article was not allowed to publish and we all know by whom!

It won't go down well here either, unfortunately

 

[Contrarian]

The influence of the Military/ISI will reduce the day the Federal Government starts providing Governance to the masses. The absence of Governance by Political and Civilian Institutions is the core reason why the Military continues to enjoy powerful influence in the State.

Many would argue otherwise...that Military/ISI never gave the Federal Government enough time to mature and start improving, constantly interfered, took the biggest chunks of budget, curtailed their powers and lastly - intervened every few years with Marshal Law.

 

[Jango]

The Spokesman Pakistan - EJAZ HAIDER-Restructure the intelligence set-up

This article was not allowed to publish and we all know by whom!

Nothing too much eye popping in that article. One thing that's worth mentioning though.

First, the current one is obviously not working. Second, as things stand, the control of national intelligence input is with the army chief, not the prime minister and/or the president and most definitely not the interior minister. The report is very clear on how the ISI controls national intelligence. It is, within one body, both MI6, dealing with foreign or external intelligence gathering and MI5, assuming the task of a counter-intelligence and security agency.

Now what is the reason that ISI is both MI6 and MI5? IMO there are 2 reasons:

1- Musharraf rule. The IB was then also essentially under a Army Chief...so was the ISI. This created blurred lines.

2- Incompetence of IB. The role of IB under BB and Nawaz Sharif is there for all to see. Then in the last 5 years, the IB was non-existent as well. It had turned into a personal jageer of PPP...stuffing all of their jiyalas in that place.

The report that alot of people here are believing as Godspell, also says that the role of CI was reluctantly taken up by ISI due to absence of any other agency.

Hence, the civilian side does not go scotch free, as I said before.

 

[sputnik]

Would like to quote user name Jibran who replied on tribune site abt Pakistan:
You didn’t feel humiliation:
1. when you fed your men to take over kashmir via kargil
2. when you gave visas to the most notorious terrorist
3. when 50,000 of your people, men, women, and children were butchered in broad daylight
4. When foreigners were beheaded
And you feel humiliated:
1. When the wanted terrorist meets justice
2. When drones bring justice to the terrorist sanctuaries

Very true,

 

[Bratva]

Nothing too much eye popping in that article. One thing that's worth mentioning though.



Now what is the reason that ISI is both MI6 and MI5? IMO there are 2 reasons:

1- Musharraf rule. The IB was then also essentially under a Army Chief...so was the ISI. This created blurred lines.

2- Incompetence of IB. The role of IB under BB and Nawaz Sharif is there for all to see. Then in the last 5 years, the IB was non-existent as well. It had turned into a personal jageer of PPP...stuffing all of their jiyalas in that place.

The report that alot of people here are believing as Godspell, also says that the role of CI was reluctantly taken up by ISI due to absence of any other agency.

Hence, the civilian side does not go scotch free, as I said before.

Sole purpose of MI is CI, There is dedicated wing in ISI since it's inception and DG of wing is referred as DG(C), so when you say ISI reluctantly took CI role, it is hard to swallow, CI is inherent part of ISI.

So what MI is doing for CI duties? Why ISI and MI don't co-operate since both are brothers in arms?

IB is referred as Eyes and ears of Intel community why? Because IB has the most elaborate setup of communication interception and phone tapping, there secondary role is to physically send people in field.

Even there was a report in DAWN, in 2004-2005 era, that IB did communication interception on behalf of ISI in initial years of WoT, because americans invested heavily in IB capabilities and sidelined ISI .

 

[Bratva]

Criticised all agencies: Pasha said all the intelligence agencies must be held to account for their failure including Military Intelligence, Air Force Intelligence, Naval Intelligence, Intelligence Bureau, Criminal Investigation Department and the Special Branch.

None of the said agencies re-aligned their task in the aftermath of 9/11. Very little coordination exists for terrorism-related information sharing with military intelligence services, he disclosed. The police should have a comparative advantage with respect to internal security since it has tentacle down to the district level.

The CID, Special Branch and the police have advantage over the ISI because of their spread, area coverage and local knowledge but nothing was done by them, he said.

Source: http://www.defence.pk/forums/pakist...g-musharraf-agencies-media.html#ixzz2YjQ1csDF

 

[muse]

After the leak, what next?
Mosharraf Zaidi
Thursday, July 11, 2013




[After the leak, what next?]

The Abbottabad Commission report is now in the public domain. Its authors, the members of the commission, should be seen as national heroes. The level of detail, the intricate analysis, the bold and fearless judgements and the searing truthfulness of the assessments in the report merit more than one reading of the report. It is a great report.

So what happens next?

The only way to answer that question is to examine what has been happening thus far.

When PM Nawaz Sharif took office, it was obvious his priorities lay in addressing domestic economic and social concerns. Pakistan needs electricity and jobs. The PML-N government wants to deliver these things. A rare confluence of policy needs and political will. What could go wrong?

As it turns out, plenty. For starters, the "extremist infrastructure" that the Abbottabad Commission report had recommended be "disbanded" is living la vida loca. The Lashkar-e-Jhangvi enjoys virtual impunity to kill Hazara Shias as it pleases. The mischievously named Tehreek-e-Taliban Pakistan, which is actually just the Pakistani Al-Qaeda affiliate, has so much freedom that it advertises changes in personnel, as was evidenced by the appointment of a new spokesperson.

I use the politically correct term spokesperson here out of habit and principle, as if there may one day be a female TTP spox. The situation is beyond absurd. This is a group that has declared war on Pakistan, declared war on the people of Pakistan, declared war on the constitution of Pakistan: the very constitution that declares, quite rightly, God Almighty, to be The Sovereign. And the national conversation has veered toward, "Why did the TTP change spokespersons?" Maybe it's because they know how easily manipulated and how keenly subservient our evening chatter can be?

It would be cute to reference Kafka here, if it weren't for the thousands of body bags in which Pakistani mothers have welcomed home their solider sons, Pakistani wives have welcomed home their slain policeman husbands - all while the Pakistani government, including both civilian and military leadership, have presided over a rapid descent into complete state dysfunction.

Hypernationalists get very upset with this kind of rhetoric. And of course, the term 'complete state dysfunction' is rhetorical. There isn't complete dysfunction yet. In his testimony, the Grand Mufti of Hypernationalist Pakistanis, Gen Shuja Pasha, says that Pakistan "is a failing state, if not yet a failed state".

And if we examine the ways in which the state is not failing, it is easy to see. The lights are on in Bahria Town and DHA. They are off in Laalu Khet and Miranshah. The water in your tap could kill you, and that same water kills thousands of Pakistanis every year. Pakistan has a polio problem - one of only three countries on the planet with this problem. If you are in Lyari, duck. If you are in Fata, relocate. If you are in Islamabad, try not to vomit.

Of course, the state still works for the District Management Group and the various ancillary civil service groups that have learnt how to compete for the spoils of maladministration. And, just to be entirely fair, let us also remember that the state works very well in Rawalpindi, in most cantonments, and save the frequent successful terrorist attacks, at our naval, air and army bases.


Apologists of the military establishment will remind us that this is because the forces have discipline and integrity. But it sure doesn't hurt that they have most of the money, and all the guns (save the ones that terrorist Fedayeen attackers and the hordes of contractors like DynCorp, XE, and others have - all of whom entered Pakistan on the watch of the most patriotic Pakistani of us all, Gen Musharraf).

If the tone of this piece seems intemperate, those capable of concentrating beyond the 12 minutes of uninterrupted analysis on television should try their reading skills on the Abbottabad Commission report.

Nobody will accuse the report's authors of being anything other than faithful and patriotic Pakistanis. Well, maybe nobody. I am hesitant because I recall the blasphemy case on Akhtar Hameed Khan, the daylight assassination of Hakim Saeed and the regular attacks on the character and integrity of anyone that dares to express their intolerance for a Pakistan that fails to live up to even the most basic requirements of what Iqbal and Jinnah would expect.

Nevertheless, Ambassador Ashraf Jahangir Qazi, Gen Nadeem Ahmed, IG Abbas Khan and Justice Javed Iqbal are not ordinary people. They have all been part of the broader Pakistani establishment, to varying degrees. That it is their steady and credible hands that have drafted the report is the best inoculation against the stupidity of large swathes of our TV-ratings-driven national conversation.

Virtually every aspect of national public life gets brushed under the carpet in Pakistan. The Abbottabad Commission report essentially lifts the carpet that has carefully been laid over the country by myriad narrow private interests, all claiming to act in the greater good. No greater good could have been done by the commission than the report they have produced.

The 337-page report is not difficult to read. But it will take time. You must read it. Someone – and I don't expect it will be the Ministry of Information (though it should be) – has to translate this report into Urdu. And then, someone should do an audio book of the report, and play it on the radio, over, and over, and over again.

The words incompetence and negligence appear far more frequently than the word complicity. This is very likely the correct balance - though complicity cannot be rule out in getting Bin Laden into Pakistan, helping him move around over nine years and ensuring his safety in Abbottabad for the final six years of his life (all facts ascertained by the Abbottabad Commission). Nor can complicity be ruled out in the US Navy SEALs operation that killed him. We already know about Shakil Afridi - no doubt there were more.

The question remains, what will happen next? If the recent past is any indicator, we can be assured, not very much.

Consider the situation in foreign policy. PM Nawaz Sharif had known for many months that the PML-N would likely win the election. It is over a month since he took oath. Our embassy in Washington DC is still without an ambassador. Perhaps he has yet to find someone old enough for the job.

Consider the response to the report by the previous government. Only two of 32 recommendations have been acted on. Neither will serve to fix anything that is broken. On the most important recommendations, there has been only silence.

What should happen? PM Sharif needs to appoint at least three blue-ribbon commissions through an act of parliament. One of them must simply be a monitor for the implementation of the Abbottabad Commission report. The other two must deal with structural and across the board government reform (the first recommendation of the commission), and national security policy (the fourteenth recommendation of the commission).

The leak of the Abbottabad Commission report could be a seminal moment in Pakistani history. But only if PM Sharif wants it to be. He's the boss.

The writer is an analyst and commentator. Site Offline

 

[Jango]

Sole purpose of MI is CI, There is dedicated wing in ISI since it's inception and DG of wing is referred as DG(C), so when you say ISI reluctantly took CI role, it is hard to swallow, CI is inherent part of ISI.

So what MI is doing for CI duties? Why ISI and MI don't co-operate since both are brothers in arms?

If you mean Military Intelligence by MI, then no, it isn't MI's job to be running after LeJ and SSP. MI's duties are for within the Army, snooping up on the likes of Hizbut Tehrir and their likes within the Army.

I am talking in terms of foreign and local intelligence.

ISI is supposed to be doing the foreign stuff, while IB is supposed to be taking care of internal situation, with ISI giving a helping hand. But right now ISI is taking the lead role while IB is the little brother. This shouldn't be the case.

 

[Bratva]

If you mean Military Intelligence by MI, then no, it isn't MI's job to be running after LeJ and SSP. MI's duties are for within the Army, snooping up on the likes of Hizbut Tehrir and their likes within the Army.

I am talking in terms of foreign and local intelligence.

ISI is supposed to be doing the foreign stuff, while IB is supposed to be taking care of internal situation, with ISI giving a helping hand. But right now ISI is taking the lead role while IB is the little brother. This shouldn't be the case.

WoT has muddled the the lines what agency should do what in such asymmetric warfare. IIRC, MI is actually running after SSP,LeJ, remember last year 5 MI operatives including a Major killed in an undercover ops when their identities were busted

and MI mission objective also states, " gathering the offensive counter-insurgence intelligence, identifying and eliminating sleeper cells, foreign agents and other anti Pakistan elements within Pakistan, and investigation of military espionage"

 

[Jango]

WoT has muddled the the lines what agency should do what in such asymmetric warfare.

That is in a nutshell what I am saying since this report came out.

We need a radical restructuring of the intelligence setup and make new way to bring about intelligence sharing. A platform under the PM which has all the agencies present.

 

[Bratva]

That is in a nutshell what I am saying since this report came out.

We need a radical restructuring of the intelligence setup and make new way to bring about intelligence sharing. A platform under the PM which has all the agencies present.

Radical restructuring requires across the board consensus which is impossible to achieve, Military is adamant to restructure and like to run things ad hoc basis, If civilians tries bring radical restructure, hawks in establisment won't let this happen.

In a country where it get 11 years to compile and implement a law which legalize technical evidence( WoT started 2001, law passed late 2012)

And Do we see any betterment since 2 May incident or since this report was handed over to government? hence it can be safely concluded, radical restructuring is done at snail pace or everyone is waiting for dust to settle so they can go back to their old ways

 

[Capt.Popeye]

That is in a nutshell what I am saying since this report came out.

We need a radical restructuring of the intelligence setup and make new way to bring about intelligence sharing. A platform under the PM which has all the agencies present.

Unfortunately; that is precisely what the ISI has been resisting so far. Of all the agencies, it has had the most capability (though the Abbottabad Commission has been quite scathing on this account) while the other Agencies have come through as abysmal performers (in the Commission Report). So who will bell the cat? Of getting the Agencies to work in coordinated coherent fashion. Who will convince/command them to submit to one centralised control?

However; @nuclearpak, the Commission Report also looks at the sheer lack /or absence of coordinated policy and decision making at the highest levels; which is actually a more critically important issue than even the Intelligence failure(s).

@nuclearpak, please vet this post.

 

[Developereo]

After all, the guy who processed the land record of OBL house was a normal corrupt land official, the registrars, the other small time officials. All of them were common Pakistanis, not a guy with 2 stars on his shoulder.

What's the more realistic scenario? OBL's buddies came up to these officials and said

A- "We are hiding OBL. As a fellow Islamist you must help us".

or

B- "Here's PKR 50,000. Keep your mouth shut and stamp these documents, no questions asked".

The fact is that much of the blame can be laid on nothing more sinister than the culture of corruption, which is entirely due to the civilian government.

 

[Jango]

What's the more realistic scenario? OBL's buddies came up to these officials and said

A- "We are hiding OBL. As a fellow Islamist you must help us".

or

B- "Here's PKR 50,000. Keep your mouth shut and stamp these documents, no questions asked".

The fact is that much of the blame can be laid on nothing more sinister than the culture of corruption, which is entirely due to the civilian government.

Yup. Very true.

You give anyone some money and job done.

Just a couple of days back, I went to the Kacheri to get some bonds signed by the magistrate, the secretary type guy said, 'urgent ya late'. I said what do you mean? He said 'urgent ka 500, late ka 200'. The guy next to me whispered to himself, 'rishwat mang raha hai'. In the end I pulled off some contacts and got the job done in 200.

Now Imagine if a terrorist does this. Problem solved. It's too easy to live illegally in Pakistan.

 

[Hyperion]

@nuclearpak, kindly make this sticky. I feel as if this is one of the few topics worth discussing, in our present circumstances.