Abandoning status as "Islamic Republic"

[Namer Afzal Khan]

Nope our blood money law freed him we didnt have one he wouldve never been free our law provided him the loop because according to that law relatives can pardon a killer which is wrong

Have you ever read the verse of the blood money. If yes please quote it and if no then please read it. I think you don't have the knowledge about this topic and yet you are talking against it. I seriously don't get one thing that secular people are non practising Muslims who keep on criticizing the religion even when they don't have any knowledge about it. I think from now on we should also mention "secular" as a religion on all of the official forms.

I'm not making fun at all. I'm asking a serious question: do you consider the Ottoman abandonment of sharia to be a form of treason to the Ottoman's people or state or not?

You must be talking about post world war 1 era. Atatürk was a secular person. If a ruler does something it doesn't mean that his/her whole nation support his/her decision. Replacing the shariah law with some other law is a crime

And that is why your country is going backward instead of forward,because you(the majority) dont see or want to see whats wrong.
Name one ''Islamist'' country doing well without oil/gas money.

Come on! What type of question is this. Even US can't do anything without oil/gas/money. It has nothing to do with the religion. Why Jinnah didn't name it as "Islamic republic" is similar to asking a question from a Muslim named as let's say Usman "hey usman, why didn't your father named you " Muslim Usman". It shows that your father wanted you to be a secular person."
Here is a solution. We should asked the government to mention "secular" in the religion section of all the official forms.

 

[Zibago]

Have you ever read the verse of the blood money. If yes please quote it and if no then please read it. I think you don't have the knowledge about this topic and yet you are talking against it. I seriously don't get one thing that secular people are non practising Muslims who keep on criticizing the religion even when they don't have any knowledge about it. I think from now on we should also mention "secular" as a religion on all of the official forms.


You must be talking about post world war 1 era. Atatürk was a secular person. If a ruler does something it doesn't mean that his/her whole nation support his/her decision. Replacing the shariah law with some other law is a crime

Have you read about multiple incidents when the influentials are able to flee justice by using this law?Have you read about families using this law as a loop hole to kill in name of honour and go free?Have you read about rapists using this law to flee justice?
This law is anti poor a law for the wealthy to rape,kill,torture and go free by using their financial strength

Have you ever read the verse of the blood money. If yes please quote it and if no then please read it. I think you don't have the knowledge about this topic and yet you are talking against it. I seriously don't get one thing that secular people are non practising Muslims who keep on criticizing the religion even when they don't have any knowledge about it. I think from now on we should also mention "secular" as a religion on all of the official forms.


You must be talking about post world war 1 era. Atatürk was a secular person. If a ruler does something it doesn't mean that his/her whole nation support his/her decision. Replacing the shariah law with some other law is a crime


Come on! What type of question is this. Even US can't do anything without oil/gas/money. It has nothing to do with the religion. Why Jinnah didn't name it as "Islamic republic" is similar to asking a question from a Muslim named as let's say Usman "hey usman, why didn't your father named you " Muslim Usman". It shows that your father wanted you to be a secular person."
Here is a solution. We should asked the government to mention "secular" in the religion section of all the official forms.

We have examples of perfectly functioning secular countries without oil.They are ranked higher than us on gender equality,labour rights,income equality and religeous freedom

Have you ever read the verse of the blood money. If yes please quote it and if no then please read it. I think you don't have the knowledge about this topic and yet you are talking against it. I seriously don't get one thing that secular people are non practising Muslims who keep on criticizing the religion even when they don't have any knowledge about it. I think from now on we should also mention "secular" as a religion on all of the official forms.


You must be talking about post world war 1 era. Atatürk was a secular person. If a ruler does something it doesn't mean that his/her whole nation support his/her decision. Replacing the shariah law with some other law is a crime


Come on! What type of question is this. Even US can't do anything without oil/gas/money. It has nothing to do with the religion. Why Jinnah didn't name it as "Islamic republic" is similar to asking a question from a Muslim named as let's say Usman "hey usman, why didn't your father named you " Muslim Usman". It shows that your father wanted you to be a secular person."
Here is a solution. We should asked the government to mention "secular" in the religion section of all the official forms.

So the theekeydars could get rid of all voices that offend them?

If majority supports something it always isnt the right choice many call Shias kafir in Pakistan should we listen to them and declare Shias kafir in official documents no stupidity of the masses cant be used as an excuse to have draconian laws

 

[Namer Afzal Khan]

Have you read about multiple incidents when the influentials are able to flee justice by using this law?Have you read about families using this law as a loop hole to kill in name of honour and go free?Have you read about rapists using this law to flee justice?
This law is anti poor a law for the wealthy to rape,kill,torture and go free by using their financial strength


We have examples of perfectly functioning secular countries without oil.They are ranked higher than us on gender equality,labour rights,income equality and religeous freedom


So the theekeydars could get rid of all voices that offend them?

If majority supports something it always isnt the right choice many call Shias kafir in Pakistan should we listen to them and declare Shias kafir in official documents no stupidity of the masses cant be used as an excuse to have draconian laws

Laws are just tools and these are used by the people for the betterment of the society. Be neutral for once and just tell me that how is its islam fault if your judiciary is corrupt, your rulers are corrupt, your nation is Bani Israel part 2. They are morally corrupt. So if the person who is going to use the tool is corrupt then how will they be able to use the tool correctly? I have told you before that the diyat rule applies in cases of unintentional murder. The rule of qasas applies for intentional murders. You should differentiate between Islamic law (Quran) and tribal laws. Both are not the same thing. The incidents about which you are telling relates to tribal laws. In Quran a rapist cannot escape penalty by giving money or wheat. Same for Raymond Davis case. The qasas law was applicable but since the government wanted to free Raymond that's why they played with the rule of first. And do you know why?because illiterate people like us who no nothing about Quran did not protested and how could we have protested when with due apologies people like you who does not read the Quran carefully start blaming islam for faults committed by other secular people who were in the government at that time. I mean we can do long march and short march for chief justice or pti but cannot do it for the implementation of laws. You yourself said that influential people can flee punishment by paying bribes so is that islam fault. Bring any other law but as long as bribe taking judiciary and weak rulers remain you will not be able to get justice. As far as the question of prosperity comes then again it has nothing do with being a secular state or an Islamic. Keeping aside the global politics you tell me that is it islam fault that people in our country selling unhygienic meat? Is it islam fault that an officer whose duty to arrest such people takes bribe and leaves them? Is it islam fault that a judge who has to give judgement against such people takes bribe and gives stays or finish cases against such people? Is it islam fault that we try to cheat and sell third class product in the international markets and expect to earn huge foreign exchanges against that? Your attitude is totally biased against Islam and you are not seeing where the actual problem is therefore any further debate on this issue. What's the use when you are not even neutral.

 

[Zibago]

Laws are just tools and these are used by the people for the betterment of the society. Be neutral for once and just tell me that how is its islam fault if your judiciary is corrupt, your rulers are corrupt, your nation is Bani Israel part 2. They are morally corrupt. So if the person who is going to use the tool is corrupt then how will they be able to use the tool correctly? I have told you before that the diyat rule applies in cases of unintentional murder. The rule of qasas applies for intentional murders. You should differentiate between Islamic law (Quran) and tribal laws. Both are not the same thing. The incidents about which you are telling relates to tribal laws. In Quran a rapist cannot escape penalty by giving money or wheat. Same for Raymond Davis case. The qasas law was applicable but since the government wanted to free Raymond that's why they played with the rule of first. And do you know why?because illiterate people like us who no nothing about Quran did not protested and how could we have protested when with due apologies people like you who does not read the Quran carefully start blaming islam for faults committed by other secular people who were in the government at that time. I mean we can do long march and short march for chief justice or pti but cannot do it for the implementation of laws. You yourself said that influential people can flee punishment by paying bribes so is that islam fault. Bring any other law but as long as bribe taking judiciary and weak rulers remain you will not be able to get justice. As far as the question of prosperity comes then again it has nothing do with being a secular state or an Islamic. Keeping aside the global politics you tell me that is it islam fault that people in our country selling unhygienic meat? Is it islam fault that an officer whose duty to arrest such people takes bribe and leaves them? Is it islam fault that a judge who has to give judgement against such people takes bribe and gives stays or finish cases against such people? Is it islam fault that we try to cheat and sell third class product in the international markets and expect to earn huge foreign exchanges against that? Your attitude is totally biased against Islam and you are not seeing where the actual problem is therefore any further debate on this issue. What's the use when you are not even neutral.

The law is the tool they use remove the tool and the loop hole goes away they cant set criminals free if there is no legal cover like this law
Nope the cases i am talking about are legal escape routes that are there cuz mullahs thinks its haram to have a just legal system free of abuse

 

[Darth Vader]

What was the true identity of Pakistan?

la ilaha illallah

 

[Solomon2]

You must be talking about post world war 1 era. Atatürk -

Nothing to do with Ataturk. The tanzimat reforms were enacted in the nineteenth century. Sharia was abandoned generations before the end of World War One.

If after hundreds of years the Ottoman Caliphs decided sharia was no good for Muslims, why seek to bring it back in Pakistan?

 

[M.AsfandYar]

The law is the tool they use remove the tool and the loop hole goes away they cant set criminals free if there is no legal cover like this law
Nope the cases i am talking about are legal escape routes that are there cuz mullahs thinks its haram to have a just legal system free of abuse

You Have NO IDEA HOW Much BISASED YOU ARE. Its Almost Like You are Blind. AND ON TOP OF THAT you are BEHAVING LIKE THIS DESPITE BEING EDUCATED.
Koi Haal NHI.
@Moonlight Knock some sense into him.

 

[Moonlight]

the cases i am talking about are legal escape routes that are there cuz mullahs thinks its haram to have a just legal syst

Hey which case you are talking about? That legally makes you escape from? :o

You Have NO IDEA HOW Much BISASED YOU ARE. Its Almost Like You are Blind. AND ON TOP OF THAT you are BEHAVING LIKE THIS DESPITE BEING EDUCATED.
Koi Haal NHI.
@Moonlight Knock some sense into him.

Let me read the whole conversation of them or maybe you help me to explain in few sentence, what exactly they are arguing about?

 

[Zibago]

You Have NO IDEA HOW Much BISASED YOU ARE. Its Almost Like You are Blind. AND ON TOP OF THAT you are BEHAVING LIKE THIS DESPITE BEING EDUCATED.
Koi Haal NHI.
@Moonlight Knock some sense into him.

There are two rooms one has an emergency exit the othet doesnot
In which room incase of a fire you are more likely to get trapped in?
Ofcourse the one without the exit door our qasas and diyat laws are exactly that escape doors for the wealthy and influentials we had cases after cases of relatives pardoning the criminals and we react like its perfectly fine
We had high profile killers escape because of this law its as escape route if you have money and infpuence you can use this law to escape obviously in a country where 50% earn over 2$ a day its really easy to get away after paying blood money but does it make it right?

 

[Moonlight]

@Zibago @django wait do people really want to implement the ISIS version of sharia? Which has no existance in Islam?
Wow. Well that's surprising for me

 

[Zibago]

Hey which case you are talking about? That legally makes you escape from? :o



Let me read the whole conversation of them or maybe you help me to explain in few sentence, what exactly they are arguing about?

Arguing over qasas and diyat law i call it escape route for wealthy and it is Jatoi and Raman Davis are high profile examples

 

[Hell hound]

@Zibago @django wait do people really want to implement the ISIS version of sharia? Which has no existance in Islam?
Wow. Well that's surprising for me

people here are ready to believe that earth is flat and sun revolves around it.app to phir isis kay nizam ki bat kar rahi hain

 

[Moonlight]

Arguing over qasas and diyat law i call it escape route for wealthy and it is Jatoi and Raman Davis are high profile examples

But that's because of failure of justice system? You can't blame the laws for that? Nai?

 

[Hell hound]

Arguing over qasas and diyat law i call it escape route for wealthy and it is Jatoi and Raman Davis are high profile examples

seikh sahib we can cry all we want but ugly truth is that diyat and blasphemy laws are here to stay.
and mumtaz qadri will also go down as shaeed in our text books.

 

[Zibago]

But that's because of failure of justice system? You can't blame the laws for that? Nai?

Again two rooms one has exit door the other doesnot from which room can you escape with ease?
Thats what this law is a law for people to do honour killing and get away,kill poor people and get away,kill their rivals and get away this loophole should not exist
No one should be allowed to pardon anyone else,s murder its wrong