A JF-17 equipped with Aselpod & SOM cruise missiles ?

[HRK]

The Indian battlegroup is becoming increasingly covered with surface to air threats such as the short range Strelas, Osa and Barak-8s. These will provide effective protection against basic bombing and strafing runs over formations.
To be able to stay out of the range of these weapons we need stand off munitions with visual or IR guidance that a forward air controller can designate for the pilot or the pilot himself can pick out from the ground and stop whilst still keeping away from these threats.

Other then guidance package (absence of Electro-optical guidance or IR guidance) I don't think there is any serious shortcoming in C-802, it offer greater range (~180 KM) & heavier warhead (~ 200 Kg) then Maverick

 

[Blue Marlin]

We have limited stocks of the AGM-65B which arent exactly young.
And no, the clearance in the inner wing stations is not enough. Clearance is NOT just vertical but horizontal as well. In addition, the weapon needs to be able to separate from eh aircraft cleanly.

dont the chinese have somthing in their treasure trove to replace the maverick? or will uncle sam be happy selling you more advanced mavericks. mind you, all you got to do is wait for hillary to be presidant and then work on convincing congress they will be used for the wot and hay presto oh and use cfs to pay for them.

as for the raad and the jf-17 well your stuck with using them vintage mirages then for many years to come as you are insisting the jf-17 is to small. pakistans long range sow weapons is in under the belly of a 20+ year old mirage.

 

[SQ8]

Other then guidance package (absence of Electro-optical guidance or IR guidance) I don't think there is any serious shortcoming in C-802, it offer greater range (~180 KM) & heavier warhead (~ 200 Kg) then Maverick

The C-802 is overkill for the requirement of blowing up tanks.

dont the chinese have somthing in their treasure trove to replace the maverick? or will uncle sam be happy selling you more advanced mavericks. mind you, all you got to do is wait for hillary to be presidant and then work on convincing congress they will be used for the wot and hay presto oh and use cfs to pay for them.

as for the raad and the jf-17 well your stuck with using them vintage mirages then for many years to come as you are insisting the jf-17 is to small. pakistans long range sow weapons is in under the belly of a 20+ year old mirage.

The Chinese have the shorter range systems that are suited to helicopters and other hide in the sand systems.
There are laser guided options available but the best solution is in fire and forget systems where one can tackle multiple targets in the same pass.

 

[Blue Marlin]

The Indian battlegroup is becoming increasingly covered with surface to air threats such as the short range Strelas, Osa and Barak-8s. These will provide effective protection against basic bombing and strafing runs over formations.
To be able to stay out of the range of these weapons we need stand off munitions with visual or IR guidance that a forward air controller can designate for the pilot or the pilot himself can pick out from the ground and stop whilst still keeping away from these threats.

what about the pars missile or the brimstone.

the indian have this area covered with the nag missile

 

[SQ8]

what about the pars missile or the brimstone.

the indian have this area covered with the nag missile

The brimstone is the ideal weapon, but both it and PARS would be cut of by India whose purchasing patterns are aimed more at cutting off sources for Pakistan rather than an actual procurement strategy.

 

[Blue Marlin]

The Chinese have the shorter range systems that are suited to helicopters and other hide in the sand systems.
There are laser guided options available but the best solution is in fire and forget systems where one can tackle multiple targets in the same pass.

in shorter range i will assume you mean the hj-10
but think of it like this, you want an infrared homing missile, who said anything that they are all air to ground?the aim-9 is perfect all it needs is a simple software update. its only taking out radar installations and not over kill like the c802 like what hkr said. you will be making good use of and old missile. heck your intrested in either the pl-10 or a darter you can use tech from that to make your own concoction.
or you can use pl-5-7-9-10 pr the piranha maa-1

The brimstone is the ideal weapon, but both it and PARS would be cut of by India whose purchasing patterns are aimed more at cutting off sources for Pakistan rather than an actual procurement strategy.

they aint that stupid to buy 2 missile types for the same job and even worse to cut out the competition.
if so then they are hell bent and obsessed with you guys. also think of it asa good thing to. it will preasure your leaders to use your own resources and make siad missile but you have the problem of your leadership even considering investing in a missile where it can be purchased else where but with difficulty.

 

[Piper]

The brimstone is the ideal weapon, but both it and PARS would be cut of by India whose purchasing patterns are aimed more at cutting off sources for Pakistan rather than an actual procurement strategy.

This is ridiculous strategy. India will bankrupt itself if such is a case and still not be successful as gaps will always be there like Italy, China, UK, Turkey, Russia, S. Africa, Ukraine and a few others covering the complete spectrum of arms sales market. There there are the third party transfers like one of the countries or private entities acting like major arms brokers and acquiring tech on behest of Pakistan from not so scrupulous sources in Israel, France, UK doing some nominal customization and downselling to Pakistan.

India may try to undercut some strategic sales like F-16s and Rafales but there too if you guys had the money then problems becomes suddenly very less.

It is my considered opinion that the only constraint Pakistan suffers from is cash power. It looks for soft loans and heavy discounts which is not very attractive in current economic situation. Furthermore purse strings are further constrained as Pakistan has maxed out it's credit with Chinese and Gulf when it comes to military procurement and aid from West is being strictly controlled at targeted parameters. The other thing is burgeoning debt servicing which takes out a large portion of FX.

 

[RAMPAGE]

@Oscar

What about the H-2 and H-4s? What happened to those?

 

[T-123456]

Pakistan has maxed out it's credit with Chinese

Even if,China needs Pakistan to have a strong military,if the only option for China is to finance Pakistans Military then it will do so,no doubt about that.

 

[Piper]

Even if,China needs Pakistan to have a strong military,if the only option for China is to finance Pakistans Military then it will do so,no doubt about that.

There are limits, still depends on concessions Pakistan makes.

 

[SQ8]

in shorter range i will assume you mean the hj-10
but think of it like this, you want an infrared homing missile, who said anything that they are all air to ground?the aim-9 is perfect all it needs is a simple software update. its only taking out radar installations and not over kill like the c802 like what hkr said. you will be making good use of and old missile. heck your intrested in either the pl-10 or a darter you can use tech from that to make your own concoction


they aint that stupid to buy 2 missile types for the same job and even worse to cut out the competition.
if so then they are hell bent and obsessed with you guys. also think of it asa good thing to. it will preasure your leaders to use your own resources and make siad missile but you have the problem of your leadership even considering investing in a missile where it can be purchased else where but with difficulty.

Their vision with Pakistan is inherently myopic in terms of their defence procurement. I doubt that they wont attempt it.

The Aim-9 does not have a warhead large enough to kill tanks.. the Brimstone is essentially the ideal weapon for Pakistan's CAS needs.

This is ridiculous strategy. India will bankrupt itself if such is a case and still not be successful as gaps will always be there like Italy, China, UK, Turkey, Russia, S. Africa, Ukraine and a few others covering the complete spectrum of arms sales market. There there are the third party transfers like one of the countries or private entities acting like major arms brokers and acquiring tech on behest of Pakistan from not so scrupulous sources in Israel, France, UK doing some nominal customization and downselling to Pakistan.

India may try to undercut some strategic sales like F-16s and Rafales but there too if you guys had the money then problems becomes suddenly very less.

It is my considered opinion that the only constraint Pakistan suffers from is cash power. It looks for soft loans and heavy discounts which is not very attractive in current economic situation. Furthermore purse strings are further constrained as Pakistan has maxed out it's credit with Chinese and Gulf when it comes to military procurement and aid from West is being strictly controlled at targeted parameters. The other thing is burgeoning debt servicing which takes out a large portion of FX.

The issue has to do with what weapons Pakistan wants and what weapons are available to it. That does not always coincide. However, there is no disagreement with money talks.

@Oscar

What about the H-2 and H-4s? What happened to those?

They are there and are upgraded from their basic forms we had them in some ten-12 years ago. Which is why something like the SOM is superfluous for Pakistan's need.

 

[T-123456]

There are limits, still depends on concessions Pakistan makes.

Why would there be any limits and if so,could you explain what these are?
Take a look at the neighbours of China and the situation in the SCS,Pakistan is the only real ally of China incase of a war with whome ever.

 

[Quwa]

Indeed, Ra'ad needs a centreline and aircraft clearance. For JF17, the SOW weapons would be C802, and other REK on GPBs.

So ... we would basically have to secure or design an ALCM around the JF-17's weight and clearance limitations? And this is not something on the roadmap because we will use the Mirages for strategic LACM strikes, but use JF-17 for conventional stand-off range attacks via PGBs?

In the case the Mirages are no longer air worthy, we'd either need a new Ra'ad launch platform, or a lighter and smaller ALCM?

@Blue Marlin I told you man, one cannot take any of this stuff for granted. Pakistan's SOW programs are 'good enough' as per the PAF's parameters, not ours, and the PAF's SOW strategy for JF-17 centers on glide bombs and other PGBs. LACM isn't on the roadmap!

 

[Basel]

Their vision with Pakistan is inherently myopic in terms of their defence procurement. I doubt that they wont attempt it.

The Aim-9 does not have a warhead large enough to kill tanks.. the Brimstone is essentially the ideal weapon for Pakistan's CAS needs.



The issue has to do with what weapons Pakistan wants and what weapons are available to it. That does not always coincide. However, there is no disagreement with money talks.


They are there and are upgraded from their basic forms we had them in some ten-12 years ago. Which is why something like the SOM is superfluous for Pakistan's need.

Turkey is working on many projects like ER version of Mizrek missiles and their version of Maverick missile, so in this department they can help Pakistan to develop a good solution.

So ... we would basically have to secure or design an ALCM around the JF-17's weight and clearance limitations? And this is not something on the roadmap because we will use the Mirages for strategic LACM strikes, but use JF-17 for conventional stand-off range attacks via PGBs?

In the case the Mirages are no longer air worthy, we'd either need a new Ra'ad launch platform, or a lighter and smaller ALCM?

@Blue Marlin I told you man, one cannot take any of this stuff for granted. Pakistan's SOW programs are 'good enough' as per the PAF's parameters, not ours, and the PAF's SOW strategy for JF-17 centers on glide bombs and other PGBs. LACM isn't on the roadmap!

you forgot that JFT is capable of carrying CM-400AKG 200+km range weapon with supersonic speed and ability to hit moving targets.

 

[Blue Marlin]

Their vision with Pakistan is inherently myopic in terms of their defence procurement. I doubt that they wont attempt it.

The Aim-9 does not have a warhead large enough to kill tanks.. the Brimstone is essentially the ideal weapon for Pakistan's CAS needs.



The issue has to do with what weapons Pakistan wants and what weapons are available to it. That does not always coincide. However, there is no disagreement with money talks.


They are there and are upgraded from their basic forms we had them in some ten-12 years ago. Which is why something like the SOM is superfluous for Pakistan's need.

im sure china has missiles similar to this, even if they dont it wont take them long to come up with one. the cm-400 is a chinese missile made for pakistan. the brimstone is VERY expensive £100,000 per unit you dont have that kind of money. or develop a longer range variant of the hj-10 if your looking for an ir guided long range missile made to destroy tanks. the aim-9 was an idea from the fact that you said you wanted an ir guided agm