800 million living on 20 Rp a day

[blain2]

in light of the euphorea about this being the Indian century etc.,, this is something to be tackled as well. A Rp 8 difference between the 800 million and another 300 million is what splits the two classes between the poverty line and those above it...but in the scheme of things, what difference do 8 rupees make?

A THIRD OF US LIVE ON Rs 20 A DAY

Sutirtho Patranobis, Hindustan Times
New Delhi, August 10, 2007

What can Rs 20 possibly fetch? For 836 million Indians,
Rs 20 per day, or Rs 600 a month, buys them their daily
sustenance.

Technically, a large chunk of these 836 million Indians -
77 per cent of the country's population - are above the
poverty line at Rs 12 per day.

But the reality is that they remain dismally poor, comprising
largely of STs, SCs, OBCs and Muslims, according to the
report on Conditions of Work and Promotion of Livelihood in
the Unorganised Sector. This is the the first authoritative
study on the state of informal or unorganised employment in
India, compiled by the National Commission for Enterprises
in the Unorganised Sector (NCEUS), a government-affiliated
body. If people do not earn, how will they spend or save,
asks Dr Arjun Sengupta

The report is based on government data for the period between
1993-94 and 2004-05.

A staggering 394.9 million workers, or 86 per cent of India's
working population, toil in the unorganised sector, which
means they work without a social security cover.

Nearly 80 per cent of these workers are among those who live
on less than Rs 20 per day.

NCEUS chairman Dr Arjun Sengupta said: "These are the
discriminated, disadvantaged and downtrodden. People who
live on Rs 20 or less per day are the real poor and vulnerable."

Sengupta told HT that Rs 20, which signifies consumption pattern,
is an indicator of the person's income and saving. "If people do
not earn, how will they spend or save?" he added.

Agriculture, the report found, was a fertile ground for poverty,
especially for small and marginal farmers, 84 per cent of whom
spent more than they earned and were often caught in debt traps.

 

[blitz]

Nice to know. Now will you give us a percent for Pakistan, and also the future trajectory for both economies ?

Thanks

PS: This century has just started, and so have we. So yes, this will be India's century.

[Yes i know i am going off topic, but all cosmetic denials aside, we all know here whats the motive behind such threads always is]

 

[blain2]

Nice to know. Now will you give us a percent for Pakistan, and also the future trajectory for both economies ?

Thanks

PS: This century has just started, and so have we. So yes, this will be India's century.

[Yes i know i am going off topic, but all cosmetic denials aside, we all know here whats the motive behind such threads always is]

Unlike you guys I will be very clear as to what my motive is (I usually do not post this type of stuff but this was an eye opener for myself). It is to show that despite the 100s of other threads being opened up about India being this or that, the bottom line is that 80% of India has not changed for the better. Pakistani population living under the poverty line is around 28%. Social upliftment is going on in both countries however amongst all this talk of military prowess, the real issue is not the number of tanks, aircraft etc...rather its the upliftment of the vast majorities in both countries.

Also its not very sportsman like when you can't even accept the facts on the ground, yet your countrymen spare no chance to post similar articles all over the board pertaining to Pakistan. This article was my effort to put a bit of reality in front of you all as well...Pakistan is not alone in this boat. You guys have a long way to go as well.

Regards

 

[blitz]

But Blain, there is a difference from whats posted about Pakistan, and what is posted about India. More than 90% of the posts about Pakistan are political or defense related. Almost half the posts on this same forum about India are related to 'oh so poor sick Indian masses'.

Its a self-gratifying cycle for some Pakistani members here. Despite being told countless times that YES, Indians know about their poverty, some people just keep posting the same things to please themselves.

As for world power and all that drama, no one, not even Indians say that they are one. Its the future that they are optimistic about, and there is every reason to be.

 

[blitz]

Also, you very slyly evaded the question. You gave the percent for below poverty line for Pakistan. The article is not about what percent of Indians are below, but who are barely above the poverty line. Below poverty line number is 25% for India. Now what is the number of Pakistanis earning 1 Rupee above your poverty line ? Then adjust exchange rate for both the currencies. Lets see.

And lastly, what is this article doing in 'Indian strategic issues' thread ? Shouldn't it be in the 'social' or 'economic' discussion threads ?

Like i said, these are self-gratifying posts.

 

[Marathaman]

Thanks for reminding us about something we know already.

 

[anand]

There is something wrong with report.....

As far as my knowledge goes, 34.7 % were living below 1$ per day i.e. 65% living above 1$ (Rs. 40) per day as per world bank and UN (data is for year 2004). As far as definition of poverty line is concerned which is based on calorie intake, Rs. 12 may be correct. Also it is said there are 300 million middle class people in India. how can you call a person belonging to middle class if he/she is earning Rs. 20 per day. Just checked Hindustan Times, it says "Third of us live on Rs. 20 per day", which means 33% not 80%. I think reporter has messed up the figures and data.
Anyway, even if 33% or whatever it may be, we have a long way to go, before we can chear about our progress. But those who criticse India for its poverty must remember that we have come from an era when more than 60% were living below poverty line. We are slowly making progress towards eradicating poverty.

 

[blain2]

Also, you very slyly evaded the question. You gave the percent for below poverty line for Pakistan. The article is not about what percent of Indians are below, but who are barely above the poverty line. Below poverty line number is 25% for India. Now what is the number of Pakistanis earning 1 Rupee above your poverty line ? Then adjust exchange rate for both the currencies. Lets see.

And lastly, what is this article doing in 'Indian strategic issues' thread ? Shouldn't it be in the 'social' or 'economic' discussion threads ?

Like i said, these are self-gratifying posts.

Hmm rather touchy, are'nt we??

I did not "slyly" evade the question because I really do not know the number of those slightly above the poverty line in Pakistan (maybe they are 80 million?? Just guessing), however regardless of whatever that number is, I can guarantee that its nowhere close to 800 million. Its just the massive size of the population in an around the poverty line that caught my attention.

800 million living in poverty and you do not think that this is an issue of strategic importance (national cohesion, ethnic tensions, wealth disparity all have implications for a nations security)?

Let me know where you want me to move it and I will do so.

 

[blain2]

Thanks for reminding us about something we know already.

Doing nothing different than what you guys do on every single other thread about Pakistan. Reminding us (in your own ways) about how the world is about to end for Pakistanis and Pakistan (that is pretty much all I see coming from the Indians on this board, I am sorry to say that)...so in turn,I say learn to take criticism (one that is based on facts at least) before you offer it to others.

 

[blain2]

There is something wrong with report.....

As far as my knowledge goes, 34.7 % were living below 1$ per day i.e. 65% living above 1$ (Rs. 40) per day as per world bank and UN (data is for year 2004). As far as definition of poverty line is concerned which is based on calorie intake, Rs. 12 may be correct. Also it is said there are 300 million middle class people in India. how can you call a person belonging to middle class if he/she is earning Rs. 20 per day. Just checked Hindustan Times, it says "Third of us live on Rs. 20 per day", which means 33% not 80%. I think reporter has messed up the figures and data.
Anyway, even if 33% or whatever it may be, we have a long way to go, before we can chear about our progress. But those who criticse India for its poverty must remember that we have come from an era when more than 60% were living below poverty line. We are slowly making progress towards eradicating poverty.

Very originial...report not to your liking, then "someting wrong with report"..



Never mind, just read the report and move on.

 

[Adux]

Blain,

Every report in this forum, as anti-indian, most of the indians waste their time defending thier positions, but we have lobby'srollseyes: ) here who keepon putting up new topic. Its quite unfair. But then again, Pakistan is in deep troubles now, for reasons which India and Indians holds the view of well-deserved, especially with Terrorist.

You will never see a harsher-critic of Indians than me, But you gotta ask the right questions.

 

[blain2]

I don't agree for a second that every report here is anti-Indian. People post India-specific stuff after seeing constant wise-*** comments about Pakistan and all things to do with Pakistan being posted by the Indians. In a way, its our way of telling you guys that maybe you should also look inward as problems abound in India too.

 

[Marathaman]

Doing nothing different than what you guys do on every single other thread about Pakistan. Reminding us (in your own ways) about how the world is about to end for Pakistanis and Pakistan (that is pretty much all I see coming from the Indians on this board, I am sorry to say that)...so in turn,I say learn to take criticism (one that is based on facts at least) before you offer it to others.

Yeah. India is a poor country. We've heard that for 60 years already thank you very much. We'd rather focus on the positives.
India is quite stable on the whole and doing better than ever since Independence.

As far as Pakistan is concerned.....well....I don't really need to say much.

So, please don't compare.

 

[blain2]

Yeah. India is a poor country. We've heard that for 60 years already thank you very much. We'd rather focus on the positives.
India is quite stable on the whole and doing better than ever since Independence.

As far as Pakistan is concerned.....well....I don't really need to say much.

So, please don't compare.

Why should I compare? Comparison should be done on the basis of equality to start of with, its rather shameful on your part to even suggest a comparison of country with 10 size the population and resources of Pakistan.

The fact that so many of you are here constantly trying to barrage us with all the on-goings in India is an indication that you guys do compare yourselves with Pakistan.

The magnitude of problems on both sides speaks for itself. At least Pakistanis here do not hide the problems...they are open for all to see which means that people realize that there are problems which have to be dealt with...quite unlike the attitude of Indians (very aptly demonstrated by you in the statement "we'd rather focus on the positives"...well would'nt we all like to do that??). Your focus on the positives and getting the "feel good" vibe does not take away from the fact that there are massive problems in India (just like by order of magnitude, Pakistan has issues).

Given the circumstances, Pakistan like India has done quite ok and I remain very optimistic about my country's future (like you all about India).

 

[Chrome9]

Blain I think the fact that India has embarked on the media war speaks for itself, the "Incredible India" being portrayed is quite a 180 degrees flip of what India really is. You see Indian drama's, the houses they live in, the constant media bombardment of rich dynamic nuclear Indian elite families which are in another world to te majority of India whilst being in the same country speaks for itself. Bollywood films have pretty much lost their faith in depicting real life scenarios. The India being portrayed to the gullable westener is one of a highly Industrialised advance society.
Unfortunately the ground realities are very different to what is being portrayed on BBC.
Though I regard this as a win for India and a loss to Pakistan, for every ARY Digital there is 10 different types of Sahara. For every Geo there is 13 kinds of dhoordashan.
India is growing and getting better no doubt about it, but when Blain injects a dose of reality Indians shouldn't see it as an insult but they should look at it as what it is.....reality.