27 Feb 19: PAF shot down two Indian aircrafts inside Pakistani airspace: DG ISPR

[The Raven]

I think the Su-30MKI made it back to base, but badly damaged, which would be consistent with radar track data the PAF discussed with Alan Warnes, which certainly convinced him. In addition, the size and twin engines of the Su-30, as well as firing the AMRAAM at max envelope parameters, would certainly suggest the aircraft was damaged but just about flyable enough to limp back to base.

 

[SQ8]

I think the Su-30MKI made it back to base, but badly damaged, which would be consistent with radar track data the PAF discussed with Alan Warnes, which certainly convinced him. In addition, the size and twin engines of the Su-30, as well as firing the AMRAAM at max envelope parameters, would certainly suggest the aircraft was damaged but just about flyable enough to limp back to base.

Plenty of narratives exist - all coming from a fog of war which unfortunately will never be lifted.
1. The AMRAAM missed but the MKI fled either way back in fear
2. The AMRAAM hit and the aircraft went down - backed up by the Mi-17 SAR theory
3. The AMRAAM hit and the aircraft made it back to base(what base?) - and possibly crashed on landing.

There are "inside" pictures which either are correct or unauthentic showing burnt bodies and ejection seats tossed away but it is not verifiable.
However, no serious analyst has given ANY credible support to the Indian claim of the F-16 and likely wont regardless of obscure Italians, Swedes or NRIs they drag into writing articles for them on facsimile blogs.

 

[Ali_Baba]

I think the Su-30MKI made it back to base, but badly damaged, which would be consistent with radar track data the PAF discussed with Alan Warnes, which certainly convinced him. In addition, the size and twin engines of the Su-30, as well as firing the AMRAAM at max envelope parameters, would certainly suggest the aircraft was damaged but just about flyable enough to limp back to base.

I think the Su30MKI got blasted to bits and the AMRAAM wreckage was pulled out of the arse of the downed Su30MKI. Only way they found the missiles wreckage so quickly.

Range has no bearing on the explosive effect of the warhead, max-envelope is a range based constraint, not a warhead.

The fact that India ordered 12 replacements Su30MKIs for 11 known crashes, is the proof me that "Avenger 1" got blasted to hell. The fact that the Indians got a random Su30MKI and then pretended to say that was Avenger 1 during a flyby with a Mirage tells me that the Su30MKI Avenger 1 plane got blased to hell.

The fact that 2 Indian Airforce offices somehow "crashed into a tree" driving in the middle of the night tells me that the pilots went down with their aircraft.

 

[The Raven]

I think the Su30MKI got blasted to bits and the AMRAAM wreckage was pulled out of the arse of the downed Su30MKI. Only way they found the missiles wreckage so quickly.

Range has no bearing on the explosive effect of the warhead, max-envelope is a range based constraint, not a warhead.

The fact that India ordered 12 replacements Su30MKIs for 11 known crashes, is the proof me that "Avenger 1" got blasted to hell. The fact that the Indians got a random Su30MKI and then pretended to say that was Avenger 1 during a flyby with a Mirage tells me that the Su30MKI Avenger 1 plane got blased to hell.

The fact that 2 Indian Airforce offices somehow "crashed into a tree" driving in the middle of the night tells me that the pilots went down with their aircraft.

You misunderstood. I made no reference to the association between blast effect and range. My point about the max envelope firing solution was the fact that if the AMRAAM was at the end of its kinematic flight envelope, i.e. effectively coasting and bleeding energy, and it would reduce the chance of a direct impact on a manoeuvring target, and given the Flanker's twin engine and size, it could limp back to base, depending on the damage.

But whatever happened, whether the Flanker made it back to base or crashed, I agree that they clearly lost a Flanker, given the number of orders for attrition replacements, the scrambling of the SAR mission (they may have been unsure whether it crashed or would make it back to base), and the rather pathetic attempt at convincing the global audience with the charade of the "Avenger" call sign. The global fighter pilot community all know they lost a Flanker that day.

 

[graphican]

You misunderstood. I made no reference to the association between blast effect and range. My point about the max envelope firing solution was the fact that if the AMRAAM was at the end of its kinematic flight envelope, i.e. effectively coasting and bleeding energy, and it would reduce the chance of a direct impact on a manoeuvring target, and given the Flanker's twin engine and size, it could limp back to base, depending on the damage.

But whatever happened, whether the Flanker made it back to base or crashed, I agree that they clearly lost a Flanker, given the number of orders for attrition replacements, the scrambling of the SAR mission (they may have been unsure whether it crashed or would make it back to base), and the rather pathetic attempt at convincing the global audience with the charade of the "Avenger" call sign. The global fighter pilot community all know they lost a Flanker that day.

If damaged Su-30 had made it to the base, they would not have flown a helicopter to look over the jungles.

 

[Pak-Canuck]

If damaged Su-30 had made it to the base, they would not have flown a helicopter to look over the jungles.

Exactly, that's what Allan Warnes concluded.

 

[The Raven]

If damaged Su-30 had made it to the base, they would not have flown a helicopter to look over the jungles.

Maybe, or they weren't sure whether it had crashed or made it back to base, especially if coms were being jammed.

 

[StructE]

If damaged Su-30 had made it to the base, they would not have flown a helicopter to look over the jungles.

Exactly, there was no reason for the helicopter to be airborne at that time.

 

[raja786]

I have even better proof then this on indian news channel one of there expert admetting that there were 2 jets shot down by PAF. If required I'll post that video link.

I think the Su-30MKI made it back to base, but badly damaged, which would be consistent with radar track data the PAF discussed with Alan Warnes, which certainly convinced him. In addition, the size and twin engines of the Su-30, as well as firing the AMRAAM at max envelope parameters, would certainly suggest the aircraft was damaged but just about flyable enough to limp back to base.

Nope my friend it was shot down and both pilots were killed.

 

[ghazi52]

Finally after 2+ years Indian Armed Forces & public have located the "Hole" in the roof of a building after surgical strike.

The ONLY problem is that the building belongs to Indian Air Force & its IAF's Air Station Jammu.

 

[raja786]

Here is that proof on Feb 27th PAF shoot down 2 jets. Who will deny this.

Watch from 25min onwards.

 

[GriffinsRule]

Here is that proof on Feb 27th PAF shoot down 2 jets. Who will deny this.

Watch from 25min onwards.

Quiet sensible analysis

 

[raja786]

This video

Quiet sensible analysis

Sure it is, but it only came after Pakistani response.

 

[ejaz007]

I have even better proof then this on indian news channel one of there expert admetting that there were 2 jets shot down by PAF. If required I'll post that video link.

Nope my friend it was shot down and both pilots were killed.

Are you sure both pilots died?

 

[raja786]

Are you sure both pilots died?

Yes they died it was reported later on in indian media that 2 su30 pilots died in road traffic accidents. In early hours on 27th few photos and videos were on YouTube and Twitter but they got deleted, I dont know if anyone has them one can see 2 burned bodies.