Zhuhai 2018

[Path-Finder]

No HJ12 this year?

 

[Kompromat]

Yes.

The LRIP J-20s are not fully equipped. Basically they are training vessels to develop tactics and strategies for the deployment of this asset in the service of the Chinese air warfare doctrine.

The test data will be fed back to the program. The full rate production models will be equipped with the full array of combat capabilities. The LRIP jets will be upgraded later on and sent to operational squadrons.

LRIP aircraft are not given clearance to push the envelope on the jets to cut the risk factor. Any crashes on this stage will seriously impede the development.

Pilots flying the J-20 at this stage would all be test Pilots tasked with validating various types of equipment and software under operational conditions. Once they are certified by the Air Force, the serial production of those systems will commence.

So yeah Pilots wouldn't have a clue about the true extent to which the J-20 can be pushed. Every maneuver carried out at the airshows takes year to hone since each new aircraft behaves differently. Then it takes time to teach those maneuvers to the Pilots, then it takes more time to perfect those maneuvers under an acceptable flight safety envelope.

J-20 would be a very maneuverable aircraft. Its not a car which you can just take to the road and do doughnuts.

You mess with the jet without knowing what you're doing and it'll put you in a coffin.

Pardon, but that is not correct for sure. Indeed, the display was not on par with the F-22's but to assume "the Pilots don't have a clue about how far this jet can be pushed" since "training has barely started" is ridiculous. Do you really think the PLAAF and its pilots don't know quite exactly what they can do with the current J-20s??

 

[azesus]

Deino please do not abuse your moderator privileges by forcing your self assuming lack of common sense onto others, it is getting irritating on the quality of this forum.

 

[Yongpeng Sun-Tastaufen]

Dont forget that the F-22 also has 2D thrust vectoring ... its shows are unmatched by any other aircraft. Once J-20 gets those J-10 TVCs, the J-20 will appear on par with F-22

F-22's TVC is not efficient. F-22 combat radius reduced from 1000+ km to about 700 km because of TVC that's why F-35 got TVC deleted.

 

[SME11B]

F-22's TVC is not efficient. F-22 combat radius reduced from 1000+ km to about 700 km because of TVC that's why F-35 got TVC deleted.

Wiki says f-22 combat radius is about 850km.

 

[Yongpeng Sun-Tastaufen]

Wiki says f-22 combat radius is about 850km.

F-22 combat radius 800 km. Still far short of expectation because of TVC.

The F-22 has a comparatively shorter range - with a combat radius of 800km, while the J-20's large internal fuel tank can sustain a longer combat radius of 1,100km.

https://www.businessinsider.com/her...ompares-to-chinas-j-20-stealth-fighter-2018-7

 

[Deino]

Deino please do not abuse your moderator privileges by forcing your self assuming lack of common sense onto others, it is getting irritating on the quality of this forum.

Care to explain your post or where did I abuse my moderator privileges by forcing anyone?? I only noted that I strongly disagree with @Horus in his opinion that not even the pilots would "have a clue about how far this jet can be pushed" since "training has barely started".

Do you really think the PLAAF would have introduced this type already after several years of testing and show it at a public airshow if the pilots would not know what this aircraft can do?? In fact it is plain wrong: Training has not just started yet but maybe operational service. No airforce would fly an untested aircraft at a public display. I'm 100% for sure - and IMO that's common sense - that the PLAAF and these pilots know their aircraft and its performance but also limitations quite well.

If that disagreement alone is some sort of abuse I'm not sure how you define a forum with discussions?

 

[Akasa]

That was done on purpose.

The training has barely started. Even the Pilots don't have a clue about how far this jet can be pushed.

Just compare the Farnborough air show and Paris airshow performance of the JF-17s.

The biggest reason, aside from the fact that this is merely an airshow, is that the J-20 lacks the proper engines and thrust vectoring that allows it to compete kinematically with the F-22.

Sure, the pilots might've been conservative, but the jets wouldn't have matched the F-22's maneuverability even if the pilots weren't.

Lynx ATV 40mm telescoped ammunition gun. Capable of penetrating 150mm of homogeneous steel armor at 1500m.View attachment 518660
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Ridiculous.

 

[khanasifm]

Quick question : has anyone seen anything on j-11/15/16 series in the show ??

China is not sharing any info on j series which are alteration /copy of su-xx correct

 

[ozranger]

Quick question : has anyone seen anything on j-11/15/16 series in the show ??

China is not sharing any info on j series which are alteration /copy of su-xx correct

There was a J-15 model indoors.

 

[LKJ86]

The video of J-20s on the way to Zhuhai: https://m.weibo.cn/6407434127/4305658134027092

 

[LKJ86]

J-20 display was not on par with what i saw F-22 raptor doing at air shows....
J-20 was more like Air Bus A-330 performing....heavy and gentle, nothing agressive

That was done on purpose.

The training has barely started. Even the Pilots don't have a clue about how far this jet can be pushed.

Just compare the Farnborough air show and Paris airshow performance of the JF-17s.

Pardon, but that is not correct for sure. Indeed, the display was not on par with the F-22's but to assume "the Pilots don't have a clue about how far this jet can be pushed" since "training has barely started" is ridiculous. Do you really think the PLAAF and its pilots don't know quite exactly what they can do with the current J-20s??

We should know the difference between what J-20 can do and what J-20 can be allowed to do by PLAAF.
Yang Wei, the chief designer of J-20, has said that what J-20 can do at the airshow is based on the will of PLAAF, just like at Zhuhai Airshow-2016.

 

[lcloo]

China is not known to disclosure detail information for military hardware for her owned domestic use. Any disclosure as those shown by J20, especially on the final day of Zhuhai Air Show, has to be approved by the central military committee. What was shown were matters already known by the J20 watchers over the years, including the number of missiles in internal weapon bays.

Chinese military are not stupid, they know there are a horde of foreign spies and local collaborators present during the air show ( and elsewhere in cyberspace) taking pictures and asking challenging questions. PLAAF would not show the full capabilities nor making statements to such effect, after all J20 is not for export, there is no need to do marketing effect like most western aircraft manufacturers do.

 

[yusheng]

 

[Kompromat]

The only point i was raising was that test Pilots are prohibited to push the envelope on the test examples for safety reasons. The Pilots are still getting used to the new aircraft. It takes time before they're allowed to safely perform dangerous maneuvers because airshow crashes are very embarrassing.

For instance, the J-10s are now allowed to perform full throttle maneuvers only after years of training.

We should know the difference between what J-20 can do and what J-20 can be allowed to do by PLAAF.
Yang Wei, the chief designer of J-20, has said that what J-20 can do at the airshow is based on the will of PLAAF, just like at Zhuhai Airshow-2016.