Why didn’t the Hindus of India ever defeat an invading army!

[Talwar e Pakistan]

And the wierd thing is first line of defense were also Pakistanis

Specifically noth Punjab, where even now martial clans are concentrated there

Invading armies first had to subjugate the various hill forts and tribes that inhabited the Safed Koh range before moving onto Pothohar (North Punjab), but mostly avoided entering the plateau. Over time, the tribes along this route began to become more geopolitically aware and pragmatic, often seeing greater advantages in siding with invading armies rather than resisting them. The tribes of Pothohar and Safed Koh following the Ghaznavid invasions would henceforth mostly side with invading forces.

 

[Talwar e Pakistan]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1436412029569572866

Many invading armies were indeed actually defeated, it's just that while the defending party may have been able to win some battles, they would often ultimately lose the war.

 

[Titanium100]

And the wierd thing is first line of defense were also Pakistanis

Specifically noth Punjab, where even now martial clans are concentrated there

This exactly.. If the Punjabs didn't accept Islam around 900 AD Ghori and Gnazavi plus all that wouldn't have happened but they accepted Islam as their neighbouring kins did a century before them in Afghanistan, Balochestan, Sindh and couple of others the key for their conversions were the Pashtuns accepting it first and than the Punjabs followed suit they always had inter-changable culture even pre-Islam KPK borders Punjab. Once the Punjabs accepted Islam than happened Gazanvi and Ghori periods and finally Muslim India but make no mistake it was solely due to the Punjabs accepting Islam paving the way and occupying big share of the Ghori, Delhi sultanate, Mughal and other various islamic empires in India.. The Punjabs were the backbone followed by the Pashtuns and Tajiks in the conquests of India

 

[Maula Jatt]

Invading armies first had to subjugate the various hill forts and tribes that inhabited the Safed Koh range before moving onto Pothohar (North Punjab), but mostly avoided entering the plateau. Over time, the tribes along this route began to become more geopolitically aware and pragmatic, often seeing greater advantages in siding with invading armies rather than resisting them. The tribes of Pothohar and Safed Koh following the Ghaznavid invasions would henceforth mostly side with invading forces.

So these invasions started getting successful cause these clans started joining them in these invasions for the loot, geopolitics?

 

[Indus Pakistan]

As recent events have shown, the country with which Pakistan shares the most in common with in terms of race, genetics, culture, heritage and shared history is Afghanistan. In fact for most of recorded history, Pakistan and Afghanistan were one nation, one civilisation.

This is something I kept saying for years on PDF for which I was vilified and ostracized. The fact is Pakistan has more to do with Afghanistan as you said then with Ganga India. The British lumped us with Ganga and even after 70 years we are still slave to Ganga in our minds.

It is time for Pakistan to see that our future is to west and specifically Afghanistan - Central Asia. This is region which gave us our genes, our culture, our dress, our cuisine and our religion.

 

[Maula Jatt]

This is something I kept saying for years on PDF for which I was vilified and ostracized. The fact is Pakistan has more to do with Afghanistan as you said then with Ganga India. The British lumped us with Ganga and even after 70 years we are still slave to Ganga in our minds.

It is time for Pakistan to see that our future is to west and specifically Afghanistan - Central Asia. This is region which gave us our genes, our culture, our dress, our cuisine and our religion.

Thier culture is pretty pathetic, that's why we don't wanna look at them as an inspiration...

 

[Indus Pakistan]

There was never really an "Indian identity" until the British created it. Also the Khyber pass was not seen as a border. The regions of East Afghanistan were ethno-culturally linked with the regions across the Khyber Pass.

Which is the point I made. Khyber was never the border. It only was made border by British. The Gandhara kingdom covered Kabul to Potohar region. The Durrani Empire included most of Afghanistan and Pakistan.

 

[Talwar e Pakistan]

So these invasions started getting successful cause these clans started joining them in these invasions for the loot, geopolitics?

Invading forces were often successful regardless of the support of the local tribes, disparate tribes were of little match to actual organized armies but would still force invaders to spend considerable time and casualties trying to subjugate them.

The primary motivation for siding with invaders included the opportunity to loot as well as a chance to gain better post-invasion geopolitical footing, often by being able to declare independence from Delhi-based polities, an example being how the Gakhars were able to carve out a formidable Kingdom in Pothohar by siding with Nader Shah in his invasion of the Mughal Empire.

It was for these same reasons why the tribes of our region primarily sided with the British during the Indian mutiny.

This British excerpt for example names the opportunity to loot Hindustan and a "dislike for the Poorbeah (Easterners/Hindustanis)" as the main motives for Punjab and "the Border" regions (KPK) siding with the British during the Indian mutiny.

The situation was so bad during the Mongol invasions that the Delhi Sultanate would often send massive armies to ravage and devastate the region so that it would be incapable of supporting any invading force.

 

[PAKISTANFOREVER]

This is something I kept saying for years on PDF for which I was vilified and ostracized. The fact is Pakistan has more to do with Afghanistan as you said then with Ganga India. The British lumped us with Ganga and even after 70 years we are still slave to Ganga in our minds.

It is time for Pakistan to see that our future is to west and specifically Afghanistan - Central Asia. This is region which gave us our genes, our culture, our dress, our cuisine and our religion.

Bro, I think things are changing now and people are beginning to realize this reality. It was the British who tried to make us something we were not. Nowadays, even the most diehard libtard in Pakistan will not claim that Pakistanis and indians are the "Same" people or anything else as retarded as that.

 

[Maula Jatt]

Invading forces were often successful regardless of the support of the local tribes, disparate tribes were of little match to actual organized armies but would still force invaders to spend considerable time and casualties trying to subjugate them.

The primary motivation for siding with invaders included the opportunity to loot as well as a chance to gain better post-invasion geopolitical footing, often by being able to declare independence from Delhi-based polities, an example being how the Gakhars were able to carve out a formidable Kingdom in Pothohar by siding with Nader Shah in his invasion of the Mughal Empire.

It was for these same reasons why the tribes of our region primarily sided with the British during the Indian mutiny.

View attachment 778745
View attachment 778746

This British excerpt for example names the opportunity to loot Hindustan and a "dislike for the Poorbeah (Easterners/Hindustanis)" as the main motives for Punjab and "the Border" regions (KPK) siding with the British during the Indian mutiny.

The situation was so bad during the Mongol invasions that the Delhi Sultanate would often send massive armies to ravage and devastate the region so that it would be incapable of supporting any invading force.
View attachment 778752
View attachment 778753

Lol, so this historical dislike for gangus is still going on
But now potoharis and kp people (majority of our army hail from these regions) have nuclear, jets and submarine
And sided with Americans and now Chinese to get back at gangus

I can't help but feel India vs Pak is basically historical beefs repeating themselves

North punjabis and Pashtuns just carrying out Thier historical beef with gangus

This time gangus have rest of India with them and Pak has its south

But the power centers of both countries are carrying Thier historical beef into the 21st century
This is hilarious
Partly religion but mostly historical/cultural beef?

Also I am hearing janjua clan in here what was the history of kokhars? same crap
Gangus (or the overlord empire that controlled them at the time) killing them and to get back at gangus all these clans supporting invasions

Oh I see kokhars, so at the time we were non-muslims

I wonder how these conversions happened ?
I feel intermingling with the Pashtuns (who were probably muslims) to get back at the Hindustani- Muslim empires

Created bonds which slowly led to a religious conversation?

 

[Talwar e Pakistan]

As recent events have shown, the country with which Pakistan shares the most in common with in terms of race, genetics, culture, heritage and shared history is Afghanistan. In fact for most of recorded history, Pakistan and Afghanistan were one nation, one civilisation.

I would say that is true for the historical region of Afghanistan (Suleiman range and adjacent regions such as Kandahar) which is very different to the modern nation-state of Afghanistan which was the result of Barakzai conquests and the great game between Russia and the British. As a whole, we have strong links with the Pashtuns and Dards of Afghanistan but little in common with other ethnic groups of Afghanistan such as Uzbeks, Turkmen, Tajiks, etc... which when combined comprise nearly 60% of Afghanistan's population.

 

[PAKISTANFOREVER]

I would say that is true for the historical region of Afghanistan (Suleiman range and adjacent regions such as Kandahar) which is very different to the modern nation-state of Afghanistan which was the result of Barakzai conquests and the great game between Russia and the British. As a whole, we have strong links with the Pashtuns and Dards of Afghanistan but little in common with other ethnic groups of Afghanistan such as Uzbeks, Turkmen, Tajiks, etc... which when combined comprise nearly 60% of Afghanistan's population.

Agreed. What I meant was that out of all the countries on this planet, it is Afghanistan that the share the most in common with in terms of race, genetics, culture and heritage. Around 40% of Pakistanis have a racial/genetic link with 45% of Afghans.

 

[Indus Pakistan]

I would say that is true for the historical region of Afghanistan (Suleiman range and adjacent regions such as Kandahar) which is very different to the modern nation-state of Afghanistan which was the result of Barakzai conquests and the great game between Russia and the British. As a whole, we have strong links with the Pashtuns and Dards of Afghanistan but little in common with other ethnic groups of Afghanistan such as Uzbeks, Turkmen, Tajiks, etc... which when combined comprise nearly 60% of Afghanistan's population.

Essentially Afghanistan south and east of the Hindu Kush which actually is naturally flows into the Indus Basin.

 

[INS_Vikrant]

Neither Delhi Sultanate Nor the Mughals ruled over the entire Indian sub-continent. What's your point?

They did Indirectly, through tribute paying vassal states and client kingdoms.

 

[Leishangthem]

There were 3 kinds of invaders in Indian history.
1) Ghori / Ghazni / Taimur types - They came on raids, looted cities, took gold and women and went back. They caused a lot of temporary distress
2) Delhi Sultanate / Mughal - They came, conquered, but settled, co-opted and reigned here. They did not take away the wealth out of India. Indians were okay with them as long as they took care of the population.
3) European imperialist - British / Portuguese / French - They came, conquered, settled but worked for foreign shores taking away as much wealth as possible. These did the most damage and are the most hated of the invaders.


Age of industrialization began only after India had already been conquered by British. The British did not allow industrialization to happen in India as it did not suit its economic interests.


Any proof that China is the biggest spice exporter?

Babur and to some extent Humayan was a foreigner. Akbar onwards were fully Indian as they were born and bred here.
Anytime, India is united, internal conflicts would dissipate and economic progress would happen. Mughals were successful in uniting most of India and hence credit can be given to them for it.

Age of industrialization began only after India had already been conquered by British. The British did not allow industrialization to happen in India as it did not suit its economic interests.

You clearly don't get it,regardless of whatever excuse you pull next but It's British that created the kolkata,Bengalore etc cities and India had one of the most extensive railway lines and infrastructure in asia for that era,courtesy of the British,suddenly India became the largest manufacturer of textiles after the British brought the industry and their trade links.

Any proof that China is the biggest spice exporter?

China exported spices worth a total of 928 million $ & imported 36 m $ worth.
This is 3 times more than India's spice export.

I can see multiple papers citing India' s economy in 1700s as 25% of world economy. Maybe you can provide the sources where we don't have wealth that you are claiming. Educate us with sources if you think we are wrong.
https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&sou...ChAWegQIBhAB&usg=AOvVaw3zViU4mvJ_w5mo9XR-5zw6
https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&sou...Vaw2rqIu_gD80D9Yq7EUWk7Tz&cshid=1631562463792

Do tell me ,was back then India was even a nation? or a civilization state united as one? how can one certain all that?
There's no real trade figures of India verifying anything near the trade and export as the likes of china did,the link you quoted are all messy ,they said 25% of global manufacturing but for the another link it was misquoted as 25% of global GDP......The 25% is likely global textile production,and that's it.

For what source do you seeK> read books like Gate to China and use the footnote source if you want,and various data based on legit facts and stats from old records,not hearsay.
Here's a simple measuring stick. according to whitman-" Opium sales in China made up for 25-35% of Britain‟s global visible trade deficit.28 It was necessary for these revenues streams to derive from China, because trade within India would not benefit an increase in the balance of trade. Indian opium had great strategic importance in the trade triangle between China, Britain, and India because it served a double purpose. It generated and transmitted revenue from China to India, which helped supply India‟s increasing silver needs. " Opium export was the largest export industry for India back then.So not just Britain but India depended on China in a way for sustaining its economy as unified British raj.Opium meant for china made 31 % of industrial output in India.
. Opium was the single largest contribution in generating India‟s export surplus. The contribution of opium to both total revenues and exports indicates the degree in which opium revenues serviced the cost of imperialism in India . Opium revenues generated more revenue than customs and stamp taxes combined, which were the fourth and fifth largest sources of revenue.

"However, the majority of the revenues that serviced the cost of imperialism in India did not come directly from India to Britain, but rather were proceeds from trade with China"-Whitman.