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Why China will chose India over Pakistan

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I think it is better that we should ask a chinese about whether they will choose India over Pakistan or not?

I am not interested in any Indian's rant about huge economy or any Pakistani's pathetic expert opinion.

So I would ask the chinese members of this forum to give us their opinion.
 
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I think it is better that a we should ask a chinese about whether they will choose India over Pakistan or not?

I am not interested in any Indian's rant about huge economy or any Pakistani's pathetic expert opinion.

So I would ask the chinese members of this forum to give us their opinion.

Foreign Policy and International Relations Changes with Time and Countries Intrest and ECONOMY is the most Important Thing..:)
 
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Foreign Policy and International Relations Changes with Time and Countries Intrest and ECONOMY is the most Important Thing..:)

I said I want a chinese to comment. :disagree:
 
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yes, what is important is self reliance as well as diversification, but that is where our bad luck is, we have no politicians, no leaders to have such foresight and lead us to such destination.

Instead of abandoning China, we have the greatest opportunity to avail their experience and develop ourselves, similarly joint collaboration with other countries, we have God given everything, oil, gas, solar energy, wind energy, hard working people, huge population, country with vast resources, location, sea and what not, all is needed, leaders who can propel us forward.

Exactly. China can be a huge help in attaining self-sufficience. This is also in China's interests, since it would create a big market for Chinese goods and, in an increasingly competitive world, China needs good, strong allies. If we don't step up to the job, China may start looking elsewhere for a strong ally.

Pakistan has a huge advantage over India. We are big enough to be a good export customer, but not big enough to be a threat or competitor.

We need a revolution to get rid of these Oligarchs as well as foreign influence.

Given the utter and complete domination of Pakistani politics by the feudal-military alliance for the last 60+ years, and ongoing, I don't see much hope there.

instead of so much of diplo-political posturing, much better to fix the feud between India and Pakistan and remove the need for the zero sum game..

Agree, but there is no sign of honest friendship from either side and, with India's growing clout and, excuse me, arrogance, things are actually getting worse.

We DONT have a "blood feud " with china. There have been minor skirmishes only ,AFTER 1962 ie 1967 and 1987

As Taimikhan has said, future wars will be about resources. The most precious resource will actually be water and China/India have major issues around that.

China and India will have resource contention and, with burgeoning economies and populations, there will be conflict. Neither country can afford a military conflict, so the only question is, what form will the conflict take?

The ordinary Chinese businessman may see India as a business opportunity, but long term strategists will rightly see it as a competitor. That is why China is friendly to Pakistan, because the ruling elite see and plan long term, instead of for the next quarter. However, as China becomes more democratic, it will become increasingly guided by public opinion and capilatistic demands, which are notoriously short-sighted. Exhibit A: USA.

Agni-5 ICBM Targeted toward China

That's the second time you mentioned the ICBM. So your idea of friendship is to point a gun at someone and say "be my friend or else..."?

What Pakistan's problem is, we are more dependent at our friends in terms of Financial help and support in many other areas.. We mostly rely at them and thus we are kinda burden at them instead of a healthy friend.. So it start to annoy them after some times..

That is exactly what I am saying. Both the US and China are huge countries who can afford to carry a sick friend for a while but, as the race heats up, no one can afford a sick friend. Everybody wants an ally who can push the cart alongside them, not someone who needs to be carried along on shoulders.
 
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I agree with karan on this. The SAARC framework has to become more active and just like India-China relations have turned peaceful despite having boundary issues so too can be the case with Pakistan.

Just like China developed economic relations with the US and India with China, Pakistan should be "proactive" to do the same with India.
 
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I agree with karan on this. The SAARC framework has to become more active and just like India-China relations have turned peaceful despite having boundary issues so too can be the case with Pakistan.

The China/India relationship is still fraught with conflict. When I said that "China will chose India over Pakistan", I meant it in the context of India-Pakistan matters. The short-term capitalistic view will favor India, even though it is against China's long term interests.

Alliances between the major powers will be shifting and fluid. China/India may stand side by side on climate change against the West, India/West may stand against China in terms of military cooperation, etc.

Just like China developed economic relations with the US and India with China, Pakistan should be "proactive" to do the same with India.

True, lasting friendship is only achieved when countries talk as equals and with respect to each other. India's tone is increasingly arrogant.

Even if some Pakistani politician made 'peace', it will not last if the Pakistani public at large feel that we got a raw deal under pressure from India's friends (West).

Once again, the only way to get lasting peace with India is for Pakistan to achieve a position of strength, economically and militarily. Everything always boils down to that.
 
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Once again, the only way to get lasting peace with India is for Pakistan to achieve a position of strength, economically and militarily. Everything always boils down to that.

Hello,I guess Problem with Pakistan is tht it Tries to Seek Too Much Importance Vis a Vis India which is not Possible

Parity Mindset Attitude with India has many times done more harm to Pakistan than any Gain
 
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Well let me talk about President Hu and Primer Wen's headaches when they are waiting to welcome President Zardari,

first of all is how to handle the monetary policy, trying to balance the possibility of economy's 'second-dip' and the risk of inflation out of control in the future (there are inflation right now).

After that comes the worry about the export sector and the exchange rate issue with US, EU.

If they have a sometime to have look at the outside of the mainland China, they hope the EFCA signed with Taiwan will be passed in their legislative yuan in Taipei. The island of Taiwan and little isles spotted on South China Sea always comes to the 'core interest of China'.

and There is also importance that China and Japan settle down their difference on the East China Sea, peacefully.

The US-Skorea naval exercise in the yellow sea maybe just a short noise but NKorea and its nuclear plans will trouble Beijing for at least next ten years.

After all these issues comes the Sub-continient neighbours, and they (hu and wen) would probably hope that afghanistan india and pakistan can live in peace and may the Yankee get out of our back window as soon as possible.

Yes, India is become more and more important in the geo-political map and Pakistan losses more than India in Bush's war on terror. and It seems that China is weighing India over Pakistan by hosting an Indian envoy before President's visit.

China dose not have many choices between india and pakistan. Offend India without a rational reason is foolish. The trade amount between China and India is 40 billion a year,10 times bigger than that between China and Pakistan, but if we compare it with China's 2.8 trillion USD trade amount we don't see it makes a significant difference.

But on the other hand lost Pakistan is geo-politically suicide. Because~ er it is still very difficult to make people in China to believe the indians. Why? Just give one example India is offering China's trust and friendship while banning all the huawei and ZTE's goods for the reasons of 'national security conspiracy'.
 
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As far as I can see, Sino-Pakistan friendship has stood the test of time , has been strong and will remain so. Internet polls have consistently indicated that ordinary Chinese view Pakistan as more trustworhty than any other country. What is most extranordinary is that the goodwill comes about spontaneously, i.e. without any official promotion campaigns in the Chinese media. Keep in mind that the relatiohship was forged at a time when neither country was very stong, and in a country like China that is steeped in Confucian tradition it is unthinkable to go back on a friend.
 
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Hello,I guess Problem with Pakistan is tht it Tries to Seek Too Much Importance Vis a Vis India which is not Possible

Parity Mindset Attitude with India has many times done more harm to Pakistan than any Gain

Please read my posts carefully.

Pakistan must achieve economic and military strength to improve its relationships with all parties -- both friends like China and (current) foes like India.

We must do it for ourselves, regardless of what India does or doesn't do. However, if competition with India helps motivate some people, then so be it. To some extent, I am less bothered by the motivation as long as it achieves the end result.

(hu and wen) would probably hope that afghanistan india and pakistan can live in peace
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It seems that China is weighing India over Pakistan by hosting an Indian envoy before President's visit.
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China dose not have many choices between india and pakistan. Offend India without a rational reason is foolish.

Well there's the difference. Compare this with the American doctrine which is crystal clear to everyone on the planet: "We are unconditionally committed to Israel's security."

Any country that dares to attack Israel knows that it will have a fleet of B2 bombers overhead within a matter of hours.

Internet polls have consistently indicated that ordinary Chinese view Pakistan as more trustworhty than any other country.

I am sorry, but I have no faith in internet polls. Does Chinese TV show Pakistani programs? Do ordinary Chinese know much about Pakistani culture and history? Now I don't expect Chinese media to be as 'open' as the West. In fact, most non-Western cultures, including South Asian culture, are very homogenous, so it is perhaps unfair to compare with Western media.

However, all the Chinese expats I have met knew precious little about Pakistan.
 
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Again, remember this guys. There are no friends or enemies, just interests. Friends and enemies will change according too change in interests. So in the end China, like any other country, will choose to favour the nation who serves their interest best. Right now its Pak. But in the middle-to-long term future, that could change.

What Pak really needs to do is stop worrying about who China will support and focus on its own sovereign interest. If they match with those of the Chinese, you will remain friends. Otherwise you will get new friends.
 
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I hate to say this as a Pakistani but, in the long term, I see China abandoning Pakistan in favor of India. The reason is simple: Paksitan is pursuing the exact same failed policy with China that it did with the US.

Pakistan/China cooperation is strictly limited to military and governmental levels. There is very little people-to-people contact and almost no cultural exchange. The relationship is one of 'colleagues, not friends'.

India, on the other hand, is using its soft power to build a positive image amongst the Chinese masses. As China becomes more democratic, it will tilt more and more towards India.

This is exactly what happened in the US. While the Pakistan military enjoyed a cozy relationship with the Pentagon, India was busy buying politcians and working on a grass-roots campaign within the US.

Clueless as ever, the Pakistani government is pursuing exactly the same myopic and limited relationship with China. And there is no effort from the Chinese side to expand the relationship either.

The other main factor is that, instead of being a strong self-sufficient ally, Pakistan is becoming more and more like a destitute friend who needs to be propped up. Right now, China is facing subtle resistance and resentment from the West and it sees Pakistan as a symbolic gateway to the resource-rich Muslim world. Once China is firmly in the driver's seat, will they want to associate themselves with a perpetually sick friend like Pakistan because, let's face it, the feudal-military alliance leading Paksitan has absolutely no interest in a stable, strong Pakistan. They are strictly interested in a short term strategy of lining their own coffers while they are in power and then running away to some foreign country.

Good write up D.....but there is one key factor that we need to add here.....Pakistan does offer and lucrative Defence and Consumer Retail Market to China ....Consumer Market in Pakistan is something that India May never have access to .....but Chinese don't have any challenge like that in Pakistan....and if China has to keep growing then it will have to stay close to geographically closer Markets as they will drive growth after West fueled growth slows down....

In short in the long term I don't see China Abandoning Pakistan(who wants to be devoid of a lucrative barrier less market) ...but yes there is a possibility of active participation of Pakistan in Chinas foreign Policy...
 
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Developereo

There is no such thing as lasting friendship in international politics. Its only permanent interests. And as long as those interests are aligned friendship remains.

Sometimes leaders do take unpopular decisions in the interest of their country, they might be right or wrong but it has happened. Even the Kashmir issue was apparently a signature away according to Kasuri. So I don't see the problems as intractable as long as both governments have a strong will to follow though on the progress that was made during the Musharraf regime.
 
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I think Pak should work hard & be self sufficient other than depend on allies & aid..If u want to get international respect, u should be strong economically..what the thread starter said is correct, cent per cent !!
 
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The problem is, we shouldn't be looking to China, USA, or anyone for help. Of course treaties are good to a certain extent. I believe that Pakistan has the potential to get back on its own feet. We shouldn't be worried if China backs away from us. We should depend on ourselves, not look left and right. Instead we should ask Allah for help.
:pakistan:zindabad
 
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