Why are we so backward?

[Kompromat]

Pakistani Atheist : Why is Pakistan lagging behind THIS bad, despite having many hardworking and smart citizens?

Where are we Lagging behind ??

I say 'obsession with religion'.

This is our source of power , it will exist forever.

Check out the threads. Every thread from Stephen Hawking's comment of extra-terrestrial to cricket to even movies translates to a discussion on religion.

Stephen Hawkings is NOT a God , (Maybe to you he is) and whatever he says is not Right because its JUST a theory and nothing more than that , there is no Proof of Alien Life out there.

UFO's are test beds for future Technology , they dont come from any outer source.

 

[Ahmad]

theoretically we are obsessed with religion but i dont observe this much is in practice..i mean does ur religion (let it b islam, christianity, etc) stops u from working, thinking rationally, playing ur part in development, etc...
beliefs are one set of thing n acting another..when we use the word beliefs it encompasses everything not just religion--our choice of how we want to live..
we wre backward because our economy is not working well..japanese are really introvert people but we dont call them backward..
i personally think we have "i m right" mentality...we are not ready to change things at grass root level, instead we want every one to praise us..whats wrong if pakistan is compared with india,ghana,US or maldives..nothing will change but we ll learn something from each of these..our grey areas..
that reminds me of max webers theory that things have meanings which we attach to them..why dont we attach positive meaning to things we come across rather than being obsessive..
i think the earlier we recognize our shortcomings the better it is!!

Believe it or not, too much of religion has played its significant part in keeping us BACKWARD, let me say it again, too much obsesion with religion. practicising religion and being religiouse is not something bad, but obsesion with it is bad. what do you think what is the motive of the taliban in pak and afghanistan for all those destruction and death? isnt it religion? war/killing/mistrust between difrerent sects such as shia, sunni, wahabi etc has caused huge distration and devastation for us? off course you want to work hard, but these crucial happenings keep our socieity, economy, sysstem, etc completely paralyzed that there wont be any room for progress and it will create negative energy in all levels of our life including managmet of the country.

 

[Martian2]

Question: How does a country industrialize?

Answer: You need at least four crucial elements.

1) Technological base. Let's say a critical mass of cumulative patents that total at least 100,000.

2) Capital. Taiwan has pumped a minimum of 150 to 300 billion U.S. dollars into building at least 70,000 companies and many factories on Mainland China.

3) People. Managers to operate the factories. Engineers to solve production problems. Scientists with Ph.D.s to conduct research and development for the next generation of products. There are at least one to two million Taiwanese living on Mainland China (e.g. 1 million around Shanghai area; unknown number in Guangdong province which includes Shenzhen near Hong Kong).

4) Time. China has been industrializing for the past 30 years.

If a country has a sufficiently large technological base, capital, people (i.e. managers, engineers, Ph.D.s), and time then industrialization is possible.

Taiwan (10/09)

"Taiwan official statistics indicate that Taiwan firms had invested about U.S. $75.6 billion in China through 2008, which is more than half of Taiwan's stock of direct foreign investment. Many unofficial estimates put the actual number at between U.S. $150 and over $300 billion. Exact figures are difficult to obtain, as much Taiwan investment in the P.R.C. is via Hong Kong and other third-party jurisdictions. More than one million Taiwan people are estimated to be residing in China, and more than 70,000 Taiwan companies have operations there. Taiwan firms are increasingly acting as management centers that take in orders, produce them in Taiwan, the mainland, or Southeast Asia and then ship the final products to the U.S. and other markets."

 

[xenia]

Believe it or not, too much of religion has played its significance part in keeping us BACKWARD, let me say it again, too much obsesion with religion. practicising religion and being religiouse is not something bad, but obsesion with it is bad. what do you think what is the motive of the taliban in pak and afghanistan for all those destruction and death? isnt it religion? war/killing/mistrust between difrerent sects such as shia, sunni, wahabi etc has caused huge distration and devastation for us? off course you want to work hard, but these crucial happenings keep our socieity, economy, sysstem, etc completely paralyzed that there wont any room for progress and it will create negative energy in all levels of our life including managmet of the country.

if u ask me i wont say taliban have anything to do with religion..thay are using religion for their ulterior motives--the lust of power..we all konw they r characterless people having a their own idiot agenda..
regarding conflicts among sects, these are usually played by those having political motives..just like ethnic n linguistic issues
obviously this hinders progress but on the whole i consider many other reasons for our inaction..obsession with everything is bad na devastating, let alone religion..thats why m saying we should give up this stereotype thinking..

 

[Martian2]

Darn it. I just noticed that the U.S. Patent Office finally updated their "patents granted" chart. For 2009, China has passed Italy in the rankings. China is now at #9 with 2,270 patents. Italy has slipped to #10 with 1,837 patents.

I better update my patent rankings soon before people start complaining that it is outdated.

 

[T-Faz]

This is the reason why we are lagging behind

Becuase he went in the opposite direction of what Quaid e Azam had laid out for Pakistan.

* We are starting with this fundamental principle that we are all citizens and equal citizens of one State.
o Presidential Address to the Constituent Assembly of Pakistan on 11th August, 1947.


* The constitution of Pakistan has yet to be framed by the Pakistan Constituent Assembly. I do not know what the ultimate shape of this constitution is going to be, but I am sure that it will be of a democratic type, embodying the essential principle of Islam. Today, they are as applicable in actual life as they were 1,300 years ago. Islam and its idealism have taught us democracy. It has taught equality of man, justice and fairplay to everybody. We are the inheritors of these glorious traditions and are fully alive to our responsibilities and obligations as framers of the future constitution of Pakistan. In any case Pakistan is not going to be a theocratic State to be ruled by priests with a divine mission. We have many non-Muslims --Hindus, Christians, and Parsis --but they are all Pakistanis. They will enjoy the same rights and privileges as any other citizens and will play their rightful part in the affairs of Pakistan.
o Broadcast talk to the people of the United States of America on Pakistan recorded February, 1948.


* As you know, history shows that in England conditions, some time ago, were much worse than those prevailing in India today. The Roman Catholics and the Protestants persecuted each other. Even now there are some States in existence where there are discriminations made and bars imposed against a particular class. Thank God, we are not starting in those days. We are starting in the days when there is no discrimination, no distinction between one community and another, no discrimination between one caste or creed and another. We are starting with this fundamental principle that we are all citizens and equal citizens of one State.
o Presidential Address to the Constituent Assembly of Pakistan on 11th August, 1947.


* The great majority of us are Muslims. We follow the teachings of the Prophet Mohammed (may peace be upon him). We are members of the brotherhood of Islam in which all are equal in rights, dignity and self-respect. Consequently, we have a special and a very deep sense of unity. But make no mistake: Pakistan is not a theocracy or anything like it.
o Broadcast talk to the people of Australia recorded on 19th February, 1948.


* There is no power on earth that can undo Pakistan.
o Speech at a Mammoth Rally at the University Stadium, Lahore on 30th October. 1947.


* Yet this is a truth people so easily seem to forget and begin to prize local, sectional or provincial interests above and regardless of the national interests. It naturally pains me to find the curse of provincialism holding sway over any section of Pakistan. Pakistan must be rid of this evil.
o Reply to the Civic Address presented by the Quetta Municipality on 15th June, 1948.


...and we should be proud to be known as Pakistanis and nothing else.

* We are now all Pakistanis--not Baluchis, Pathans, Sindhis, Bengalis, Punjabis and so on--and as Pakistanis we must feet behave and act, and we should be proud to be known as Pakistanis and nothing else.
o Reply to the Civic Address presented by the Quetta Municipality on 15th June, 1948.


* You are free; you are free to go to your temples. You are free to go to your mosques or to any other places of worship in this State of Pakistan. You may belong to any religion, caste or creed --that has nothing to do with the business of the State.
o Presidential Address to the Constituent Assembly of Pakistan on 11th August, 1947.


* The Constituent Assembly has got two main functions to perform. The first is the very onerous and responsible task of framing our future Constitution of Pakistan and the second of functioning as a full and complete Sovereign body as the Federal Legislature of Pakistan.
o Presidential Address to the Constituent Assembly of Pakistan on 11th August, 1947.


* The first and the foremost thing that I would like to emphasize is this --remember that you are now a Sovereign Legislative body and you have got all the powers. It, therefore, places on you the gravest responsibility as to how you should take your decisions.
o Presidential Address to the Constituent Assembly of Pakistan on 11th August, 1947.


* My guiding principle will be justice and complete impartiality, and I am sure that with your support and co-operation, I can look forward to Pakistan becoming one of the greatest Nations of the world.
o Presidential Address to the Constituent Assembly of Pakistan on 11th August, 1947.


* The Story of Pakistan, its struggle and its achievement, is the very story of great human ideals, struggling to survive in the face of great odds and difficulties.
o Address to the people in Chittagong, 23rd March, 1948.


* We should have a State in which we could live and breathe as free men and which we could develop according to our own lights and culture and where principles of Islamic social justice could find free play.
o Address to Civil, Naval, Military and Air Force Officers of Pakistan Government, Karachi October 11, 1947.


* We should begin to work in that spirit and in course of time all these angularities of the majority and minority communities will vanish.
o Presidential Address to the Constituent Assembly of Pakistan on 11th August, 1947.


* The exploits of your leaders in many a historic field of battle; the progress of your Revolution; the rise and career of the great Ataturk, his revitalization of your nation by his great statesmanship, courage and foresight all these stirring events are well-known to the people of Pakistan.
o Reply to the speech made by the first Turkish Ambassador to Pakistan at the time of presenting Credentials to the Quaid-i-Azam on 4th March. 1948.


* Think 100 times before you take a decision, But once that decision is taken, stand by it as one man.
o In 1937, following elections held under the new government of India Act


* I have always maintained that no nation can ever be worthy of its existence that cannot take its women along with the men. No struggle can ever succeed without women participating side by side with men. There are two powers in the world; one is the sword and the other is the pen. There is a great competition and rivalry between the two. There is a third power stronger than both, that of the women.
o Speech at Islamia College for women March 25, 1940.

* No nation can rise to the height of glory unless your women are side by side with you. We are victims of evil customs. It is a crime against humanity that our women are shut up within the four walls of the houses as prisoners. There is no sanction anywhere for the deplorable condition in which our women have to live.
o Speech at a meeting of the Muslim University Union, Aligarh March 10, 1944.


* Our object should be peace within, and peace without. We want to live peacefully and maintain cordial friendly relations with our immediate neighbours and with the world at large.
o Lahore, August 15th, 1947.


* My message to you all is of hope, courage and confidence. Let us mobilize all our resources in a systematic and organized way and tackle the grave issues that confront us with grim determination and discipline worthy of a great nation.
o Eid-ul-Azha Message to the Nation October 24, 1947.

I have lived as plain Mr. Jinnah and I hope to die as plain Mr. Jinnah. I am very much averse to any title or honours and I will be more than happy if there was no prefix to my name.


Anyone who calls himself a Muslim is a Muslim and that anyone who says otherwise is conspiring against the Muslim cause.

What a man, laid out everything for us and the Mullahs, gangsters and shameless thugs are running the country.

 

[pak-marine]

Why is Pakistan lagging behind THIS bad, despite having many hardworking and smart citizens?

I say 'obsession with religion'.

Check out the threads. Every thread from Stephen Hawking's comment of extra-terrestrial to cricket to even movies translates to a discussion on religion.

if an indivisual or a group beleives in certain religion and is obsessed with it than what is wrong with that ? secondly its their right where we are going wrong is we mix state and religion toghether.

They just dont go toghether , the day Pakistani nation beleive that primary thing is Pakistan and pakistan than comes all ,religion , sects etcc ... that day half of our problems are sorted.

.

 

[Lilo]

The IMF data only extends to 2015.

For South Asia, in 2015, Pakistan ($1,363.91) will be in good shape and will still have the third highest per-capita income after Sri Lanka ($2,537.82) and India ($1,681.91).

With the exception of India, all South Asian economies will grow between 4.5-6.5%. India's GDP will grow a little faster at roughly 8%.

Economically, the relative ranks of South Asian countries will not change. However, I suspect that you already knew this. All South Asian countries are third-world countries and in the same boat.

I'm going to go out on a limb and attempt to answer the more interesting question that is implicit in the question, "Why are we so backward?" Another way of asking the same question is the one that the Indians have been trying to answer: How do we catch China?

The short answer is that you can't. ..........

................
Patents granted by the United States for the year 2008.

1. U.S. 92,000 patents
2. Japan 36,679
3. Germany 10,086
4. South Korea 8,731
5. Taiwan 7,779
6. Canada 4,125
7. U.K. 3,843
8. France 3,813
9. Italy 1,916
10. China 1,874
...
Hong Kong 717 (Patent office counts Hong Kong as a separate entity)
India 672
Singapore 450
Russian Federation 181

There are 70,000 Taiwanese companies on the Chinese Mainland. It is my guess that many Chinese exports incorporate not only Chinese patents, but also Taiwanese patents. The Taiwanese were a perennial #4 in U.S. patents received until they were passed by South Korea in 2008.

While the current number of Chinese patents appears to be insufficient to support a large high-tech export base, the combination of Greater China (i.e. Chinese, Taiwanese, and Hong Kong) patents should suffice.

Greater China's 10,370 patents (i.e. China's 1,874 + Taiwan's 7,779 + Hong Kong's 717) are greater than the number of German patents at 10,086.

Taiwan (10/09)
"Significant migration to Taiwan from the Chinese mainland began as early as A.D. 500. ..... There are a number of small political parties, including the Taiwan .... in China, and more than 70000 Taiwan companies have operations there. .... In keeping with our one China policy, the U.S. does not support Taiwan ...""

Pakistan right now in the middle of a democratic dividend with some 70% of its population aged 15 or below. But its projected to grow on a average of 4-5 % over the next five years.
Taking into account the population growth rate of 1.5-2% and inflation of some 5%(an optimistic figure) its a bleaker picture. Frankly its a phase of stagnation for a country with such high population growth rates.
Heard of "make hay while sun shines" ? - well the sun is shining now, where is Pak ?

If you want to bring in china in a patently southasian discussion which you originally wanted i can oblige by pointing out that though i acknowledge the enormous amount of funding the communist chinese are sinking into their research (and some real progress in fields like material science and Chemical engineering ), they are yet to come up with a block buster drug or an innovative product with a global brand value.
Dont you think thats odd?

However below article can throw some light behind the Chinese research boom.

Rampant cheating hurting China’s research ambitions

Another link comparing the quality of chinese papers with the rest
http://www.scimagojr.com/countryrank.php

China has 1.2 million research documents published (1997-2008) for which it got 4 million citations.India has 0.4 million research documents published for which it has 2 million citations (taking into account the pitiful research expenditure of Indian govt its like a miracle) .So which do you think are of greater quality ?

Why is the ratio for self-citations:total-citations so high for china ?
While even india has far lower ratio of self-citations:total-citations.

Further on if you wish to add up Taiwan's contribution to Communist China's research it will look as odd as clubbing a home country's research with the research contribution by its overseas population settled on foreign shores.

 

[khanz]

I think there are few main problems with why we are backward but it's not due to religion main problem is illiteracy another is our crooked government they were always too busy infighting and filling their pockets than working for the development of pakistan.

 

[Destructlord]

Who said Pakistan is backward?! Actually I have always seen Pakistanis as very intelligent people, only thing that keep Pakistan from being a developed country are some traitrous elements whom are usually connected to Saudi intelligent service, they actually want to unstable the Pakistan and turn it to their own battleground with some unknown enemies!

 

[Ahmad]

Who said Pakistan is backward?! Actually I have always seen Pakistanis as very intelligent people, only thing that keep Pakistan from being a developed country are some traitrous elements whom are usually connected to Saudi intelligent service, they actually want to unstable the Pakistan and turn it to their own battleground with some unknown enemies!

By saying backward, i think he means pakistan is among the 3rd world or developing countries. Usually it is not nice to use the term backward anyway.

 

[mehru]

that again depend on how u look at things..
there are people who say we were born of evolution (Quran says everything was created from a drop of water) but many may not believe in darwinism..but religion apart, i dont beleve in this
again some people provide religious roots for big bang (heaven and earth were once same) n others may deny it again on religious grounds..ita a matter of how u percieve things..
i dont understand how it obstructs research n progress..in fact it should promote research spirit..

No actually it doesn't. You see people will not dare challenge religious beliefs which often contradicts Science and that's why they will never accept anything that our religion doesn't certify or which doesn't agree with our religion. Like in the case of evolution, people don't believe it. Why? Because we strongly believe that humans didn't evolve rather they the human race was started from Adam and eve. In a sense it stalls our innovative thinking. Pakistanis like to mix religion with everything. With knowledge, with national interests, with the Govt setup and almost everything.
However i don't think it's the main reason for our backwardness as Khanz pointed out that illiteracy is the main reason and i agree with him.

 

[nakodo]

pakistanis cannot be like americans, turks, british or the chinese---those people have a back bone---they have dignity and identity---they have courage and honor---they cherish and honor their responsibility---pakistanis on the other hand are clueless and totally at a loss of what these words and charadcters mean.

Funny you left out India esp when replying to

Pakistanis cant be like Turks, Americans, British, Chinese, Indians, Nigerians, etc.

Anything the matter?

 

[Kompromat]

Actual problem is with our educational system where as those who are "Munafiqeen" blame the Religion for all issues that we are currently facing.

We must deal with our Educational problems on emegency basis moreover we need to build an industry base and a technical institutional system.

Regards:

 

[Ahmad]

Actual problem is with our educational system where as those who are "Munafiqeen" blame the Religion for all issues that we are currently facing.

We must deal with our Educational problems on emegency basis moreover we need to build an industry base and a technical institutional system.

Regards:

Here you go, religion played its part again, just becaue people have different opinion from you, you call them munafiq.