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What happens when a muslim prays in a public area in US

Seriously, You disappoint me! I didnt think you to be so negative! 1st you people question me why there is no church (no one mentioned it had to be functional) When I show you that...you overcome it with sarcasm! Lovely aint it!

Where did I ask you to show me churches?? I asked whether a Christian or Hindu can practice his faith with out fear in an Islamic country?

Why not you show me where Islam and Shariah says what you cried out? Can you do that for a change? Instead of saying my family, articles from Christian sites which say Grand mufti said tear down all churches (same site few months before that said no churches allowed in Saudi and were crying lack of freedom...Do you not see the hypocrisy in that)...How about people start justifying what they cry after and for rather than just crying like maniacs?!

You are putting words on my mouth.. I never mentioned any christian sites criticizing Islam and why dont you check with your friends whether Saudis allow any churches in Saudi Arabia instead of showing some old non functioning church.. Those churches who you are showing were just before Islam was introduced..
 
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Can you provide us with a verifiable source? No way! Cause it's just another qadiani sitting in the west using a victim card!

Lol. "victim" card. Whatever. To you any source I present is not "verifiable". I bet not even this from amnesty international, You'd prefer daily Ummat news to be a verifiable source.

Human Rights Agencies report another Gruesome Murder of an Ahmadi
Amnesty International and Human Rights Commission of Pakistan reported the incident at Shabqadar (NWFP) Pakistan as follows.

Pakistan: Another Ahmadi Muslim Deliberately Killed By Islamists

A violent mob attacked two members of the Ahmadiyya Community in Shab Qadar, prompting Amnesty International to renew calls on the government of Pakistan to condemn such attacks and take immediate measures to prevent them. On April 19, Dr. Rashid Ahmad and his son-in law, Riaz Ahmad Khan, were attacked as they were about to attend a court hearing in Shab Qadar in the North West Frontier Province; Riaz Khan was stoned to death and his dead body stripped and dragged through the town on a rope. Dr. Rashid Ahmad was taken to a hospital in Peshawar with serious injuries. A third Ahmadi Muslim, Advocate Bashir Ahmad, escaped unhurt.

The three men — senior members of Ahmadiyya Community from Peshawar — had come from the provincial capital to help another Ahmadi Muslim, Daulat Khan, who had been harassed following his conversion to the sect several months ago; local Muslim clergy reportedly called for the death of the convert.

Daulat Khan was arrested on April 5, when members of the Ahmadiyya Community approached the police they were told that he had been arrested “for his own safety”. Later police registered a case against him under sections 107 (abetment) and 151 (disturbing public tranquility by joining an unlawful assembly) of the Pakistan Penal Code.

The three men attacked had gone to Shab Qadar in order to file a bail application on Daulat Khan's behalf; when they entered the court premises, a violent mob attacked the three men with sticks and stones. To Amnesty International knowledge, no one has been criminally charged for the killing and Daulat Khan is still in custody.

During the past year, at least seven Ahmadi Muslims have been attacked and killed with impunity by religious extremists. Though most of these deliberate and arbitrary killings have taken place in broad daylight and before many eyewitnesses, in none of the cases reported to Amnesty International have those responsible for the killings been arrested and charged.

Amnesty International believes that the failure to criminally prosecute those responsible for attacks on members of religious minorities appears to indicate the acquiescence of the authorities with the perpetrators.

“We once again urge the government of Pakistan to unequivocally and publicly condemn such attacks and to take all possible measures to protect the lives and security of members of Pakistan's religious minorities who appear to be at risk”, said Amnesty International.
(Amnesty International April 8,1995)

Quran 33:40

It's definitely high time you sssshhh while you are ahead

Secondly, Not only I, but 99% of muslims don't consider qadianis, muslim. So howl, scream, yell, all you want, nobody is listening. Doesn't change your cult status!

Lol. First of all it doesn't say that the qualification for being a muslim. Stop inventing stuff. You deliberately took the shahada and added the word last to it in your previous comment. Now when I called you out, you reference a totally different verse.

I am not screaming, junior. This is a forum where you type. I do know that the local mullahs in Pakistan are always screaming from their speakers at Ahmadis. They sound like thirsty attention seeking dogs. I don't care whether you consider me a muslim or not, I didn't even mention this. I barely said people like you won't even allow Ahmadis to pray however they want. Because it hurts your feelings? What are you, some endangered specie? or an Emo?

As for the Verses you referenced:

The Holy Quran says: "Muhammad is not the father of any of your men, but he is the Apostle of Allah and Khataman Nabiyyeen--The Seal of the Prophets." (33:41)

The real meaning of Khatam is a seal (see Tajul Aroos, Lisanul Arab, and Qamoos), and the phrase should be interpreted in the light of this meaning. Ibn Khaldun says it is wrong to interpret the word Khatam in this verse to mean the last or the end (see Muqaddama Vol. II, p. 54, Paris). He holds that the word Khatam denotes the consummation and completion of a thing, which he further explains by the words, authenticity, perfection and validity. When a seal is put to a letter it becomes authentic and complete. The seal may be put in the end or in the beginning. According to him, therefore, Khataman Nabiyyeen would mean the truest and the most perfect of prophets and not the last in point of time. It refers to his status and place among the prophets and not to the time of his advent.

USE OF THE WORD KHATAM:

In one of his sayings the Holy ProphetSAW calls his uncle, Hadhrat Abbasra, Khatamul Muhajireen (see Kanzul Ommal, Vol. VI, p. 178). But it does not mean that Abbas was the last Muhajir (refugee) of the whole Muslim world.
Similarly, Hadhrat Alira is called Khatamul Auliya (see Tafsir Safi under the Quranic verse 33:41). Ibn Khaldun says this phrase is understood to mean that Ali was a perfect saint and not the last (see Muqaddama, Vol. II pp. 165-167).
An Arab poet, Hasan bin Wahab, called Abu Tamam (the compiler of Himasa) Khatamush-Shu'ara (see Wafiyatul A'ayan Li Ibn Khallikan, Vol. I, p. 123, Cairo). Obviously Abu Tamam was not the last poet. The word Khatam, therefore, used in such phrases means the best and not the last.

The context of a verse is a most important factor in determining its true meaning. If we look into the context of the words we are further assured of the same meaning.

The verse runs as follows: "Muhammad is not the father of any of your men, but he is the Messenger of God and Khataman Nabiyyeen." God is obviously refuting an objection, viz., Muhammad (peace and blessings of God be on him) has no male issue. Elsewhere we read in the Quran: "Surely it is thy enemy and not thou who shall be childless and without posterity." (108:4)
These words are said to have been revealed when Al-Aas Ibn Wayel called the Holy ProphetSAW Abtar (having no children or posterity) on the death of his son Al-Qasim (see Jalaluddin's Commentary under verse 108:4). As an answer to this taunt of the enemies, God declared in the verse under discussion that the line of his physical male descendants is no doubt cut off by the death of his sons but as Hadhrat Muhammad (peace and blessings of God be on him) is a Messenger of God, he possesses devoted followers who shall form a continuous and long line of spiritual descendants to keep his memory and name and teachings alive for ever and ever.

The followers of a prophet are often described as his spiritual children. The meaning of the word Khataman Nabiyyeen must fit with this context. To say that Hadhrat Muhammad (peace and blessings of God be on him) is the last of the prophets and there shall be no prophet after him does no credit to him. His enemies could at once add an insult by saying that Hadhrat Muhammad (peace and blessings of God be on be him) failed to produce a progeny in the spiritual sense of the word also and thus proved himself (God forbid) barren and abtar in every respect. According to the context, therefore, the Seal of the Prophets must mean that the spiritual descendants of Hadhrat Muhammad (peace and blessings of God be on be him) would be of no mean order. They would, God says, attain to great spiritual distinctions so must so that by following in his footsteps some of them would even become prophets.

The Holy Prophet Muhammad (peace and blessings of God be on be him) is called here the Lord Privy Seal or the Lord Keeper of the great Divine Seal of Prophethood, which not only ratifies and authenticates the office of the previous prophets but also awards the distinctive mark of prophethood to those who make themselves worthy of it. (Haqeeqatul Wahy by Hazrat Mirza Ghulam Ahmad, p. 56) We read in the Bible: "The Lord will make thee the head and not the tail; thou shalt be above only and thou not be beneath." (Deuteronomy 28:13)

To be the tail of a line, therefore, is no credit or distinction. Even if we take the phrase Khataman Nabiyyeen to mean the last of the prophets; we must interpret it as meaning that he is the last in the sense that he has attained a degree of perfection beyond which it is impossible for anyone to go. He has exhausted all the degrees of perfection and none can ever excel or supersede him. He is the Head of the prophets and not the tail.
 
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Cant seethe clip.

But why should anyone pray in a public area ?

it was to record the reaction of the people around.

As far as why would anyone pray in park or on road well if its prayer time and one doesnt want to qaza the nimaz he or she will pray wherever the place is clean

Lets see what happens when a Christian prays in a public area in Saudi Arabia!!

:P do you have this concept of praying anywhere ? :) Churches are not filled even on Sundays.
 
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Why don't you qadiani's just quit calling your self Muslims, and move on with life? You could call your selves qadianis, rabwainas, etc NO one would bother you, no but you have to call yourselves Muslims and invite trouble! Why does it matter to you so much, what other people think about your cult?

In order to stay within the realms of Islam you have to accept a crtical part, which is the Prophet Muhammad P.B.U.H. was the seal of the prophets / the LAST one. NO more after him.

Lastly, this thread is NOT about Qadiani's, so quit derailing the thread! You can go and scream, cry and play your vicitim card on this one: Do I have the right to remain Ahmadi? | Page 18

Here is an excerpt from your holy book by Mirza:

"All Muslims regard my books with reverence and care and benefit from their sublime thoughts except those who are the offspring of prostitutes(bastards); God has put a seal upon their hearts and they do not accept me."
Ruhani Khazain,V.5, Page 547-548; Mirat-o-Kamalat-i-Islam, P. 547; Aeena-e-Kamalat Islam, P.547-548 [Mirza Ghulam translated this Arabic word as "Bastard" in Ruhani Khazain V.11, P.282)

So long beofre PAkistan declared you non-muslim you had declared them "offspring of prostitutes" . You will reap what you sow. I guess it's come back to bite you in the "behind" hasn't it?

Most important point: "How can a man, who claims to get divine revelation, use such vulgar language?"

Yawn. Another old allegation. Been answered a million times, go pick up an Arabic dictionary instead of just copy posting, esteem mullah sahab. If you really want to call yourself that, then go ahead. Lol.

As for the thread you quoted, I can't comment on it because I haven't gone over the certain required posts to be counted a senior member.
 
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Yawn. Another old allegation. Been answered a million times, go pick up an Arabic dictionary instead of just copy posting, esteem mullah sahab. If you really want to call yourself that, then go ahead. Lol.

As for the thread you quoted, I can't comment on it because I haven't gone over the certain required posts to be counted a senior member.
Keep on crying,nobody is listening!

Lol. "victim" card. Whatever. To you any source I present is not "verifiable". I bet not even this from amnesty international, You'd prefer daily Ummat news to be a verifiable source.

Human Rights Agencies report another Gruesome Murder of an Ahmadi
Amnesty International and Human Rights Commission of Pakistan reported the incident at Shabqadar (NWFP) Pakistan as follows.

Pakistan: Another Ahmadi Muslim Deliberately Killed By Islamists

A violent mob attacked two members of the Ahmadiyya Community in Shab Qadar, prompting Amnesty International to renew calls on the government of Pakistan to condemn such attacks and take immediate measures to prevent them. On April 19, Dr. Rashid Ahmad and his son-in law, Riaz Ahmad Khan, were attacked as they were about to attend a court hearing in Shab Qadar in the North West Frontier Province; Riaz Khan was stoned to death and his dead body stripped and dragged through the town on a rope. Dr. Rashid Ahmad was taken to a hospital in Peshawar with serious injuries. A third Ahmadi Muslim, Advocate Bashir Ahmad, escaped unhurt.

The three men — senior members of Ahmadiyya Community from Peshawar — had come from the provincial capital to help another Ahmadi Muslim, Daulat Khan, who had been harassed following his conversion to the sect several months ago; local Muslim clergy reportedly called for the death of the convert.

Daulat Khan was arrested on April 5, when members of the Ahmadiyya Community approached the police they were told that he had been arrested “for his own safety”. Later police registered a case against him under sections 107 (abetment) and 151 (disturbing public tranquility by joining an unlawful assembly) of the Pakistan Penal Code.

The three men attacked had gone to Shab Qadar in order to file a bail application on Daulat Khan's behalf; when they entered the court premises, a violent mob attacked the three men with sticks and stones. To Amnesty International knowledge, no one has been criminally charged for the killing and Daulat Khan is still in custody.

During the past year, at least seven Ahmadi Muslims have been attacked and killed with impunity by religious extremists. Though most of these deliberate and arbitrary killings have taken place in broad daylight and before many eyewitnesses, in none of the cases reported to Amnesty International have those responsible for the killings been arrested and charged.

Amnesty International believes that the failure to criminally prosecute those responsible for attacks on members of religious minorities appears to indicate the acquiescence of the authorities with the perpetrators.

“We once again urge the government of Pakistan to unequivocally and publicly condemn such attacks and to take all possible measures to protect the lives and security of members of Pakistan's religious minorities who appear to be at risk”, said Amnesty International.
(Amnesty International April 8,1995)



Lol. First of all it doesn't say that the qualification for being a muslim. Stop inventing stuff. You deliberately took the shahada and added the word last to it in your previous comment. Now when I called you out, you reference a totally different verse.

I am not screaming, junior. This is a forum where you type. I do know that the local mullahs in Pakistan are always screaming from their speakers at Ahmadis. They sound like thirsty attention seeking dogs. I don't care whether you consider me a muslim or not, I didn't even mention this. I barely said people like you won't even allow Ahmadis to pray however they want. Because it hurts your feelings? What are you, some endangered specie? or an Emo?

As for the Verses you referenced:

The Holy Quran says: "Muhammad is not the father of any of your men, but he is the Apostle of Allah and Khataman Nabiyyeen--The Seal of the Prophets." (33:41)

The real meaning of Khatam is a seal (see Tajul Aroos, Lisanul Arab, and Qamoos), and the phrase should be interpreted in the light of this meaning. Ibn Khaldun says it is wrong to interpret the word Khatam in this verse to mean the last or the end (see Muqaddama Vol. II, p. 54, Paris). He holds that the word Khatam denotes the consummation and completion of a thing, which he further explains by the words, authenticity, perfection and validity. When a seal is put to a letter it becomes authentic and complete. The seal may be put in the end or in the beginning. According to him, therefore, Khataman Nabiyyeen would mean the truest and the most perfect of prophets and not the last in point of time. It refers to his status and place among the prophets and not to the time of his advent.

USE OF THE WORD KHATAM:

In one of his sayings the Holy ProphetSAW calls his uncle, Hadhrat Abbasra, Khatamul Muhajireen (see Kanzul Ommal, Vol. VI, p. 178). But it does not mean that Abbas was the last Muhajir (refugee) of the whole Muslim world.
Similarly, Hadhrat Alira is called Khatamul Auliya (see Tafsir Safi under the Quranic verse 33:41). Ibn Khaldun says this phrase is understood to mean that Ali was a perfect saint and not the last (see Muqaddama, Vol. II pp. 165-167).
An Arab poet, Hasan bin Wahab, called Abu Tamam (the compiler of Himasa) Khatamush-Shu'ara (see Wafiyatul A'ayan Li Ibn Khallikan, Vol. I, p. 123, Cairo). Obviously Abu Tamam was not the last poet. The word Khatam, therefore, used in such phrases means the best and not the last.

The context of a verse is a most important factor in determining its true meaning. If we look into the context of the words we are further assured of the same meaning.

The verse runs as follows: "Muhammad is not the father of any of your men, but he is the Messenger of God and Khataman Nabiyyeen." God is obviously refuting an objection, viz., Muhammad (peace and blessings of God be on him) has no male issue. Elsewhere we read in the Quran: "Surely it is thy enemy and not thou who shall be childless and without posterity." (108:4)
These words are said to have been revealed when Al-Aas Ibn Wayel called the Holy ProphetSAW Abtar (having no children or posterity) on the death of his son Al-Qasim (see Jalaluddin's Commentary under verse 108:4). As an answer to this taunt of the enemies, God declared in the verse under discussion that the line of his physical male descendants is no doubt cut off by the death of his sons but as Hadhrat Muhammad (peace and blessings of God be on him) is a Messenger of God, he possesses devoted followers who shall form a continuous and long line of spiritual descendants to keep his memory and name and teachings alive for ever and ever.

The followers of a prophet are often described as his spiritual children. The meaning of the word Khataman Nabiyyeen must fit with this context. To say that Hadhrat Muhammad (peace and blessings of God be on him) is the last of the prophets and there shall be no prophet after him does no credit to him. His enemies could at once add an insult by saying that Hadhrat Muhammad (peace and blessings of God be on be him) failed to produce a progeny in the spiritual sense of the word also and thus proved himself (God forbid) barren and abtar in every respect. According to the context, therefore, the Seal of the Prophets must mean that the spiritual descendants of Hadhrat Muhammad (peace and blessings of God be on be him) would be of no mean order. They would, God says, attain to great spiritual distinctions so must so that by following in his footsteps some of them would even become prophets.

The Holy Prophet Muhammad (peace and blessings of God be on be him) is called here the Lord Privy Seal or the Lord Keeper of the great Divine Seal of Prophethood, which not only ratifies and authenticates the office of the previous prophets but also awards the distinctive mark of prophethood to those who make themselves worthy of it. (Haqeeqatul Wahy by Hazrat Mirza Ghulam Ahmad, p. 56) We read in the Bible: "The Lord will make thee the head and not the tail; thou shalt be above only and thou not be beneath." (Deuteronomy 28:13)

To be the tail of a line, therefore, is no credit or distinction. Even if we take the phrase Khataman Nabiyyeen to mean the last of the prophets; we must interpret it as meaning that he is the last in the sense that he has attained a degree of perfection beyond which it is impossible for anyone to go. He has exhausted all the degrees of perfection and none can ever excel or supersede him. He is the Head of the prophets and not the tail.
The BS you have posted is called "HEARSAY!"


Oh the same Vatican that employs pedophile priests! Now thats credibility!
 
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You must understand, Ahmedi's or rather Qadianis as I prefer to call them, have a fundamental problem. They consider themselves Muslims. They defintion of a muslim as per the Quran is one who believes that "there is only one GOD, and Prophet Muhammad P.B.U.H. is the last prophet."

As long as they don't call themselves muslims, they are free to do whatever they want. BUT when you start calling yourselves Muslims, and then disrespect our beloved Prophet Muhammad P.B.U.H. by rejecting that he was the last prophet, you are asking for trouble!

A sledge hammer!
What do you want to destroy with a sledgehammer? In the picture - there was only a mosque and a temple. What makes you so angry?

What it has to do with topic we are discussing.. One guy asked whether a Muslim can pray in Vatican, I show him an example..
Long time no see bro :(
You forgot who to debate and whom not to :D
 
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Long time no see bro :(
You forgot who to debate and whom not to :D

How are you mate?? Good to see you around!!

Credibility, of which the Vatican has none.

Please!! every religion have bad apples.. If we are going to discuss about pedophile, then it wont be a rosy picture.. We will have to start from beginning of Islam and I am not interested in insulting any religion.. So let us leave it like that..
 
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How are you mate?? Good to see you around!!



Please!! every religion have bad apples.. If we are going to discuss about pedophile, then it wont be a rosy picture.. We will have to start from beginning of Islam and I am not interested in insulting any religion.. So let us leave it like that..
Good mate :) Being deported to Chennai for a few weeks :( Will quote you soon, about some cashews I had from Kerala (recent trip). Awesome :smitten:
 
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Please!! every religion have bad apples..
I'm not criticizing your religion, I'm talking about the credibility of the Vatican as an institution.

If we are going to discuss about pedophile, then it wont be a rosy picture.. We will have to start from beginning of Islam and I am not interested in insulting any religion.. So let us leave it like that..

IF we start from the beginning of Christianity to date, you will have a lot of answering to do, including why 2,572 pedophile priests (by the vatican's own admission) still exist in the church, in this day and age.

AND then there is the financial scandal (of the vatican) we could talk about.
Vatican bank granted reprieve by Pope Francis after series of scandals | World news | theguardian.com

So please quit with your holier than thou attitude! Thank You
 
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