Water Car Engineer Was Not Too Far Off

[Marium Syed]

The amount of electricity consumed to tap hydrogen gas from water is more than the energy released when Hydrogen burns. so the overall system efficiency is not that great either.....but it is clean...the only tail pipe exhaust is H2O, steam that is.

Well no, when hydrogen burns it produces water, which is the opposite reaction of the electrolysis reaction. So the same amount of electricity would be produced as consumed,
It isn't clean either. Electrolysis is using electricity for chemical breakdown. Where does the electricity come from? Fossil fuels.

 

[Marium Syed]

I don't really know the agenda of this video as proposing this tech as clean energy and I don't really care, but for all of you, its just fable science, don't put your bets on it.

 

[Donatello]

Well no, when hydrogen burns it produces water, which is the opposite reaction of the electrolysis reaction. So the same amount of electricity would be produced as consumed,
It isn't clean either. Electrolysis is using electricity for chemical breakdown. Where does the electricity come from? Fossil fuels.

My efficiency post was about burning Hydrogen like in a combustion engine. When you are talking about fuel cells, you need Oxygen/air as well.

About your last part, you are missing something, if the electricity can come from renewable sources like Wind, Solar, Hydro, Nuclear etc, then that problem is solved. There are already electric charging stations in Europe that run on Solar/Wind energy.

 

[Marium Syed]

My efficiency post was about burning Hydrogen like in a combustion engine. When you are talking about fuel cells, you need Oxygen/air as well.

About your last part, you are missing something, if the electricity can come from renewable sources like Wind, Solar, Hydro, Nuclear etc, then that problem is solved. There are already electric charging stations in Europe that run on Solar/Wind energy.

I didn't catch the first part but never mind.
If the guy uses renewables the cost of electrolysis is going be much greater and kill the purpose of the project (making things cheaper). The whole electrolysis part is useless in a thermodynamic point of view. I guess you should check out Hess's law
Maybe I'm wrong, the video clip wasn't really informative

 

[Donatello]

I didn't catch the first part but never mind.
If the guy uses renewables the cost of electrolysis is going be much greater and kill the purpose of the project (making things cheaper). The whole electrolysis part is useless in a thermodynamic point of view. I guess you should check out Hess's law
Maybe I'm wrong, the video clip wasn't really informative

Why is the cost going to be greater?

You need electricity to do electrolysis.....with abundant solar/wind/hydro/tidal power, why is it waste?

The whole idea about Hydrogen is not just efficiency, but rather the fact that it is the cleanest fuel out there. No COx and NOx so no green house effect contribution.

 

[syedali73]

The current issue with hydrogen is that it is very difficult to store safely under pressure for something like a car. In event of a crash, if the tank is punctured, you will have odorless and colorless flammable gas...and when it burns, it has no flame color, so you cannot see the danger that is flaring up.

Reminds me of Hindenburg Disaster.

 

[ziaulislam]

Well no, when hydrogen burns it produces water, which is the opposite reaction of the electrolysis reaction. So the same amount of electricity would be produced as consumed,
It isn't clean either. Electrolysis is using electricity for chemical breakdown. Where does the electricity come from? Fossil fuels.

wrong electrolysis is only 33% efficent better to build and operate electric cars running on battery rather than hydrogen fuel cell cars..

unless we can find a source of energy that is very cheap and use that to produce hydrogen

 

[yesboss]

The whole idea about Hydrogen is not just efficiency, but rather the fact that it is the cleanest fuel out there. No COx and NOx so no green house effect contribution.

Maybe i failed to make u understand what was my point . . . . why don't we simply use electricity(batteries) to run the car like Tesla motors do . . . .isn't that clean for the environment . . . . why use hydrogen as a source of fuel, as it would take more energy than it would deliver.

 

[Donatello]

Maybe i failed to make u understand what was my point . . . . why don't we simply use electricity(batteries) to run the car like Tesla motors do . . . .isn't that clean for the environment . . . . why use hydrogen as a source of fuel, as it would take more energy than it would deliver.

The problem is that Batteries don't last very long, you have charge them a well. So electricity is needed there. Plus, making and disposal of batteries is not very environmentally friendly.

 

[yesboss]

The problem is that Batteries don't last very long, you have charge them a well. So electricity is needed there. Plus, making and disposal of batteries is not very environmentally friendly.

But wouldn't we also need batteries in case for the extracting process of hydrogen from water . . . since this process would be giving less energy as an outcome then fed to make it happen, the depletion of energy would require storage of batteries(since we need electricty) and having less or no batteries would mean less range for the vehicle.

 

[Donatello]

But wouldn't we also need batteries in case for the extracting process of hydrogen from water . . . since this process would be giving less energy as an outcome then fed to make it happen, the depletion of energy would require storage of batteries(since we need electricty) and having less or no batteries would mean less range for the vehicle.

No, you can use regular electricity to get hydrogen from water at, say, an electrolysis plant. That hydrogen is then pumped in the car and the car runs on it.

It just like you extract crude oil. Refinery refines that crude oil into petrol/diesel. That petrol is then supplied to petrol pumps. You put that petrol in your car.
Same with Hydrogen. You extract hydrogen from water at whatever location. Ship that hydrogen to the pump. Fill your car at the pump.

 

[yesboss]

Fine. . . . this seems plausible. no batteries involved . . anywhere. . . and if the source of electricity is environment friendly and cheap . . .seems everything is good.

 

[Gauss]

but the hydrogen is enclosed not within some crystal ( or hydrate - like i read in some wiki about researches ) but in tank... okay, triple-layer but a tank still... i fear safety... can this car be used in sunny or humid climates??

i believe the best and simplest way to store hydrogen is in water, plus

there is the issue of developing some natural anti-freeze so that the vehicle can run in below-freezing conditions... and of course, a solution for real-time removal of the anti-freeze so that clean water can reach the electrolysis chamber.

you know we shouldnt think too much about these technological developments. its all business. companies are actively involved in R&D only for the sake of increasing their profits. even green techs are developed not for the environment but to match the demand of environment conscious consumers. as far as any shortcommings are concerned in a proposed technology, these guys who work on them are really smart. they know them better than us and will improve on it in the next versions. they just have to test&experiment different approaches thats why we see less than perfect things introduced. but its actually being done to gather results for the next better version.

indeed... ships and planes running on sea water.

by the way, is it just sea water or something added, because you said "electrolyte/ionic liquid"??

gauss, seems interesting... there is no large battery involved... there is liquid that goes through some membrane which generates electricity which goes into some super capacitors which distributes it to the system that includes four motors to turn the wheels.

sea water is salt water which is electrolyte. of course we can run things on it. if they have made a better battery then good for them.

 

[jamahir]

you know we shouldnt think too much about these technological developments. its all business. companies are actively involved in R&D only for the sake of increasing their profits. even green techs are developed not for the environment but to match the demand of environment conscious consumers.

that's a cynical view... i am sure the designers of the "quant" salt-water-powered car have real innocent ambitions other than of course, as you meant, knowing that these things can be sold.

in that dailymail article for quant, the ceo or someone of that company spoke of seeing the potential of that fuel-cell in powering ships, planes and rail.

s far as any shortcommings are concerned in a proposed technology, these guys who work on them are really smart. they know them better than us and will improve on it in the next versions. they just have to test&experiment different approaches thats why we see less than perfect things introduced. but its actually being done to gather results for the next better version.

right, and the technology seems to be simple enough... i see this a many more times better car than the toyota mirai hydrogen car.

sea water is salt water which is electrolyte. of course we can run things on it.

if they have made a better battery then good for them.

oh, they have avoided a big battery ( like in tesla ) by directly supplying the current from the fuel-cells ( membranes?? ) to some super-capacitors which then distribute the current to the motors and other systems.

they should really bring the car's cost radically down.

okay, must go to sleep now.