Vietnam Defence Forum

[Carlosa]

Keep status quo for at least 1 decade and boost the cooperation, push the economic development paces.
A full lift of arm ban from USA would be the most wanted signal I expect early this year 2015.

That also the signal help Vietnam get more cooperation ( incl. investment and trade ) from US allies and US themselves.
2 years afterward would be more valuable than over 20 year of normalization relation with China.

Yes, I also expect a full lifting of the embargo this year.

VN needs to play for time and keep growing the economy so that it can afford a bigger military budget and in the meantime to keep working on the key military programs which are always very long term projects like build subs under license, learn the tech, keep improving the ballistic missiles, long range cruise missiles, undercover nuclear program, hire some key Russian scientist and you are covering all the basis to eventually have a nuclear deterrent.

That's the way to go @Viet bro, then you can have your strategic underwater toys.

Keep status quo for at least 1 decade and boost the cooperation, push the economic development paces.
A full lift of arm ban from USA would be the most wanted signal I expect early this year 2015.

That also the signal help Vietnam get more cooperation ( incl. investment and trade ) from US allies and US themselves.
2 years afterward would be more valuable than over 20 year of normalization relation with China.

@Viet : nuclear powered subs are the max I could dream of,
the purpose: 1 nuclear powered sub gives practical unlimited time of operation underwater.
an easier option: AIP sub is acceptable too.
a Virginia-class sub ( 7,900 long tons ) even provide much more than some Kilo class subs provide.

Of course, getting Virginia class, getting the proper weapons

AIP technology will keep getting better, the 2nd generation Russian AIP has twice the power of the best western AIP. If you are talking a Viet made sub, nuclear power is not feasible, but AIP could be ok. VN started to make cruise missiles under license, step by step it can get there, in 2017 VN will start to make Yakhont under license, much to learn from those programs.

 

[Viet]

Carlosa, we used to have a great navy. back then, for example we fielded 500 to 1,000 warships against the Ming army in a single battle. in the great battle of Ham-tu pass of 1407, chinese historians told, the vietnamese warships extended up to more than ten li (1 li= 500m, 10 li= 5km) in the battle order.

 

[Carlosa]

Carlosa, we used to have a great navy. back then, for example we fielded 500 to 1,000 warships against the Ming army in a single battle. in the great battle of Ham-tu pass of 1407, chinese historians told, the vietnamese warships extended up to more than ten li (1 li= 500m, 10 li= 5km) in the battle order.

Different times bro, ships are a bit more complicated to make these days, have to accept the reality of how things are now, but still, Vietnam is rearming and it will get much better, but still, Vietnam is an small country with an small economy, it can't match China but it can build up enough to give them a bloody nose if needed. That's all that can be done.

Look at Spain, used to be the most powerful empire around 1500 ad, later was the british, now we are a shadow of what we used to be. Countries rise and decline, its the wheel of history.

 

[BoQ77]

Different times bro, ships are a bit more complicated to make these days, have to accept the reality of how things are now, but still, Vietnam is rearming and it will get much better, but still, Vietnam is an small country with an small economy, it can't match China but it can build up enough to give them a bloody nose if needed. That's all that can be done.

Look at Spain, used to be the most powerful empire around 1500 ad, later was the british, now we are a shadow of what we used to be. Countries rise and decline, its the wheel of history.

There's another way to enlarge a country without invasion. Asean community is going to be unique.
It's not surprise to appear " Asean defence ministry" one day.

 

[kaku1]

Keep status quo for at least 1 decade and boost the cooperation, push the economic development paces.
A full lift of arm ban from USA would be the most wanted signal I expect early this year 2015.

That also the signal help Vietnam get more cooperation ( incl. investment and trade ) from US allies and US themselves.
2 years afterward would be more valuable than over 20 year of normalization relation with China.

@Viet : nuclear powered subs are the max I could dream of,
the purpose: 1 nuclear powered sub gives practical unlimited time of operation underwater.
an easier option: AIP sub is acceptable too.
a Virginia-class sub ( 7,900 long tons ) even provide much more than some Kilo class subs provide.

Of course, getting Virginia class, getting the proper weapons

I dont think bro, your dream of Virginia class and Tomahawk is realistic.

I am again saying, why not Akula?

 

[Carlosa]

I dont think bro, your dream of Virginia class and Tomahawk is realistic.

I am again saying, why not Akula?

Nuclear subs for Vietnam are not realistic at all, way too expensive for Vietnam, plus Vietnam doesn't have the expertise to deal with the nuclear power plants of the subs. The Vietnamese civilian nuclear program has beed delayed because of that same reason.

I think Vietnam should go for Amur 1650 with Brahmos VLS.

There's another way to enlarge a country without invasion. Asean community is going to be unique.
It's not surprise to appear " Asean defence ministry" one day.

I'm not sure about that, ASEAN can't even agree on a SCS policy against china. Each country pulls in their own direction and some of them are heavily influenced by China.

 

[kaku1]

I think Vietnam should go for Amur 1650 with Brahmos VLS.
.

I dont think, that is suitable too.

Because, for an SSK, it will be nightmare to handle that much buoyancy force generated by VLS launch.

Even that is same reason, Russian Navy never gone to Amur 1650, even Indian Navy rejected the Amur way back in 2011.

The best solution for submarine for VN would always be european, the Russians are a generation behind in SSK against Europeans. And if Japs ready to export, then Soryu is world best currently.

 

[BoQ77]

Nuclear subs for Vietnam are not realistic at all, way too expensive for Vietnam, plus Vietnam doesn't have the expertise to deal with the nuclear power plants of the subs. The Vietnamese civilian nuclear program has beed delayed because of that same reason.

I think Vietnam should go for Amur 1650 with Brahmos VLS.

I'm not sure about that, ASEAN can't even agree on a SCS policy against china. Each country pulls in their own direction and some of them are heavily influenced by China.

At the time of signing Kilo contract, no one expect that'd happen. 2 - 3 billion. wow !!!

That's why the need for a solid ASEAN community would help them to avoid facing themselves to China.
A lion prefer to chase a single buffalo over facing a ready group of buffalos.

 

[Carlosa]

I dont think, that is suitable too.

Because, for an SSK, it will be nightmare to handle that much buoyancy force generated by VLS launch.

Even that is same reason, Russian Navy never gone to Amur 1650, even Indian Navy rejected the Amur way back in 2011.

The best solution for submarine for VN would always be european, the Russians are a generation behind in SSK against Europeans. And if Japs ready to export, then Soryu is world best currently.

I think the best European solution is the Scorpene, but its weak in terms of the missiles, just the Exocet. The Club in the Kilos is so much better. Also, the AIP of the Scorpene is not doing that great.

I don't think the Japanese would sell the Soryu to Vietnam, they would worry about VN letting the Russians take a look at it.

At the time of signing Kilo contract, no one expect that'd happen. 2 - 3 billion. wow !!!

That's why the need for a solid ASEAN community would help them to avoid facing themselves to China.
A lion prefer to chase a single buffalo over facing a ready group of buffalos.

Ha ha, nice man!!! Those bulls have some mighty horns.

I dont think, that is suitable too.

Because, for an SSK, it will be nightmare to handle that much buoyancy force generated by VLS launch.

Even that is same reason, Russian Navy never gone to Amur 1650, even Indian Navy rejected the Amur way back in 2011.

The best solution for submarine for VN would always be european, the Russians are a generation behind in SSK against Europeans. And if Japs ready to export, then Soryu is world best currently.

How about the Indian Scorpenes? Are they also going to use Exocet? It would be nice to integrate Club / Brahmos (using the torpedo tubes).

 

[kaku1]

I



How about the Indian Scorpenes? Are they also going to use Exocet? It would be nice to integrate Club / Brahmos (using the torpedo tubes).

Nope, Indian Scorpene would be armed with Exocets and even P-75I would use exocets, if Scorpene again is chooses.

 

[Viet]

There's another way to enlarge a country without invasion. Asean community is going to be unique.
It's not surprise to appear " Asean defence ministry" one day.

do you believe to snowfall in Saigon?
will you give your home key to a burglar?
do you believe to China peaceful rise?

a cambodian rep for VN? the likelyhood that such thing happens to close to zero. Even in the highly integrated European Union, there is no such post called european defence minister. No country in the world should rely on others if it comes on national defence interest.

Different times bro, ships are a bit more complicated to make these days, have to accept the reality of how things are now, but still, Vietnam is rearming and it will get much better, but still, Vietnam is an small country with an small economy, it can't match China but it can build up enough to give them a bloody nose if needed. That's all that can be done.

Look at Spain, used to be the most powerful empire around 1500 ad, later was the british, now we are a shadow of what we used to be. Countries rise and decline, its the wheel of history.

just saying we need to rely on our strength. normally we know our strength and weakness, so we know very well about china´s strength and weakness. the chinese know their strength, but not their weakness. More, they are not interested of knowing vietnam strength and weakness. arrogance at best. That is our chance to give them a bloody nose.

I dont think, that is suitable too.

Because, for an SSK, it will be nightmare to handle that much buoyancy force generated by VLS launch.

Even that is same reason, Russian Navy never gone to Amur 1650, even Indian Navy rejected the Amur way back in 2011.

The best solution for submarine for VN would always be european, the Russians are a generation behind in SSK against Europeans. And if Japs ready to export, then Soryu is world best currently.

whatever be, our navy needs more submarines. india operates soon Scorpène, why shouldn´t we follow?

 

[Carlosa]

do you believe to snowfall in Saigon?
will you give your home key to a burglar?
do you believe to China peaceful rise?

a cambodian rep for VN? the likelyhood that such thing happens to close to zero. Even in the highly integrated European Union, there is no such post called european defence minister. No country in the world should rely on others if it comes on national defence interest.


just saying we need to rely on our strength. normally we know our strength and weakness, so we know very well about china´s strength and weakness. the chinese know their strength, but not their weakness. More, they are not interested of knowing vietnam strength and weakness. arrogance at best. That is our chance to give them a bloody nose.


whatever be, our navy needs more submarines. india operates soon Scorpène, why shouldn´t we follow?

I very much agree with you, can't depend on ASEAN or anybody else, if someone else wants to help, that's a bonus, but can't expect or depend on them.

Definitely need a second batch of subs, in my opinion that's more important than heavy frigates, etc. Also need some SU-34 / SU-35.

 

[Viet]

Vietnam VHF band acquisition radar Nebo-UE

S-75 anti aircraft missile

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[BoQ77]

The second C-295M of Vietnam Airforce , would be 8902
@Carlosa

 

[Viet]

invention that helps the infantryman: electric brush for cleaning of tank barrel. Usually a barrel cleaning process goes through several stages of washing with soapy water, oiling diesel, then at the end using a scarf/fabric to clean the barrel. all manual labor, sometimes lasting 3 hours. now the machine helps.