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What means ecosystem?

It is your own navigation system, your own data link satellite, your own production line, and everything.

It is a huge value chain ecosystem, and Vietnam for sure doesn't possess that.

Any fundamental difference between the modern Vietnamese military and Saddam's Iraqi army? Practically none.
Too bad we are not china, having just some few billions, unlike you with some 150 billions usd defense budget.

I don't need to convince you, but the history proves we are not a pushover. Just keep your ecosystem intact and let nobody destroy our hightech chain if a conflict breaks out.
 
Too bad we are not china, having just some few billions, unlike you with some 150 billions usd defense budget.

I don't need to convince you, but the history proves we are not a pushover. Just keep your ecosystem intact and let nobody destroy our hightech chain if a conflict breaks out.

Our "150 billion" defense budget is only on the paper, meanwhile there are a lot of stuffs are not included.

For example, we have never included the multi-trillions underground great wall that we have been working for 30 years.

The systematic military race between the superpowers usually cost multi-trillions.

Take another example, the amount of money that the US needs to renew their aging nuclear warheads alone is already no less than trillion.

U.S. to invest $1 trillion in nuclear arsenal > Security & Defence Agenda > Security & Defence Agenda | Library overview
 
Our "150 billion" defense budget is only on the paper, meanwhile there are a lot of stuffs are not included.

For example, we have never included the multi-trillions underground great wall that we have been working for 30 years.

The systematic military race between the superpowers usually cost multi-trillions.

Take another example, the amount of money that the US needs to renew their aging nuclear warheads alone is already no less than trillion.

U.S. to invest $1 trillion in nuclear arsenal > Security & Defence Agenda > Security & Defence Agenda | Library overview
This underground is of not much useful for the survivors if China becomes a nuclear desert. Preventing a nuclear holocaust is more useful.

Just two questions.

Imagine, china is as small as vietnam. Will you ever dare to bully us? What do you think how high is your chance winning a war against vietnam?

Or, if we successfully destroy your hightech ecosystem at the weakest points, will you be able to keep fighting or surrendering immediately?

You keep talking tough, but your military history is full of ugliness. Come back if you won a war against a military power.
 
This underground is of not much useful for the survivors if China becomes a nuclear desert. Preventing a nuclear holocaust is more useful.

Just two questions.

Imagine, china is as small as vietnam. Will you ever dare to bully us? What do you think how high is your chance winning a war against vietnam?

Or, if we successfully destroy your hightech ecosystem at the weakest points, will you be able to keep fighting or surrendering immediately?

You keep talking tough, but your military history is full of ugliness. Come back if you won a war against a military power.

The underground great wall is not used to provide the haven for people against the nuclear winter, it is used to cover China's land based nuclear stockpile.

- The survival rate of the silo based ICBM is only 10% against the pre-emptive nuclear strike.
- The survival rate of the mobile ICBM is still only 30% against the pre-emptive nuclear strike.
- The survival rate of the SSBN based SLBM is at 90% against the pre-emptive nuclear strike.


You should know that the US is by far more ahead than other P5 nations in term the SSBN based SLBM, and their SSBN capability is more than the rest P5 nations combined.

So in order to balance the US overwhelming naval nuclear deterrence capability, we are creating an idea to shelter our land based nuclear missiles underground.

Even the US is impressed by this idea, so they are also thinking to make a similar nuclear underground tunnel located in Colorado.

Doomsday nuclear subway trains will roll beneath the country carrying ballistic missiles under new Air Force plan | Mail Online

This could diversify their nuclear portfolio, so with less money spending on the SSBN, they can spend more money on the SSN which will be used more often in the commonly happened conventional warfare.

BTW, if you want to destroy China's infrastructural ecosystem, then you have to develop the nuclear capability of the US.

However, if anyone dares to launch a such attack against China, then the nuclear winter will inevitably come to this world.
 
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some Vietnam War photos showcased in Perpignan City, France: Visa Pour L’Image

moving tanks through the Ho Chi Minh trail (1972)
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a radio team of the North Vietnamese Army at the battle of Quang Tri (1970)
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a Viet Cong unit
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most foreign visitors go to the Headquarter of National Defence Ministry (Hanoi)
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General Thanh, on September 12th received the new appointed Chief of RoK Airforce, General Choi Cha Kyu.
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Vice Admiral Minh greeted visiting Inspector General KR Nautiyal of Indian Coast Guard Forces in Hanoi on September 8.
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@Zarvan nothing is wrong about Vietnam bought Brahmos from India

we are (Indonesia) interesting in Brahmos too and even we had consider to bought some frigate from India if they can competing with some European firms for the next phase of modernization project in Indonesia, nothing problems with that you can bought weapons from everyone if it deemed necessary, is all about National interest.
madokafc, can you tell me the stance of the government of Indonesia. it appears a bit unclear to me and seems you dance between all tables. on one day you are pro China, the next day you are against it.
 
Our "150 billion" defense budget is only on the paper, meanwhile there are a lot of stuffs are not included.

For example, we have never included the multi-trillions underground great wall that we have been working for 30 years.

The systematic military race between the superpowers usually cost multi-trillions.

Take another example, the amount of money that the US needs to renew their aging nuclear warheads alone is already no less than trillion.

U.S. to invest $1 trillion in nuclear arsenal > Security & Defence Agenda > Security & Defence Agenda | Library overview

Your position is fundamentally flawed. You stated that VN needs to spends trillions of dollars same as china in order to have a proper military ecosystem and if it can't, then can't have an effective ecosystem to defend itself from china.

The ecosystem that china needs is far bigger and far more expensive than what Vietnam needs because of the large chinese territory and the many threats it faces (India, Russia, Japan, USA, Korea, Vietnam, South china sea.

VN on the other hand, only has one enemy and a small territory that is far easier to defend.
Vietnam needs a far smaller and far cheaper ecosystem than china. Vietnam needs a ecosystem tailored to its needs, not a copy of china's ecosystem. Vietnam can concentrate ALL its military resources to face the one threat, china can only deploy an small part of its military against Vietnam since it needs to have most of its forces in the border areas of all those many other threats.

VN does not need a nuclear ecosystem, china does, that's just one of many differences.

Vietnam is steadily building the ecosystem that it needs.

The Vietnam People's Army has utilized satellite communication for the military since 1998, with 4 VSAT stations for the Navy and another five for the air force and army. That was the first step in building the unified command and control system of the 'C3ISR' (Command, Control, Communications, Intelligence, Surveillance and Reconnaissance). The integrated C3ISR network will be finished in a few years. Vietnam has already produced small satellites and is steadily building bigger and bigger satellites to satisfy its needs. Military data link by satellite is already operational since 2008.

Are you aware that VN is building a sophisticated network of radars specifically dedicated to the detection of stealth aircraft as preparation for when china deploys the J-20?

Instead of boasting about the chinese ecosystem (which is way inferior to the one from USA by the way), I suggest you work on fixing all its holes because it has plenty, just to make a point, the chinese radar network in china's coastline (which happens to be the most important area of it) has big gaps between radars that allow US aircraft to penetrate undetected into chinese airspace.
So much for the multi trillion dollar chinese ecosystem, even VN's radar network is better than that.

The fact that you said that there is no difference between Sadam's military and Vietnam's military shows how little you know about the VPA and unlike China's PLA that has a well built reputation for grossly exaggerating its military capabilities, Vietnam on the other hand, keeps utmost secrecy.

I already made the points that I needed to make, I'm not getting into endless debates, I'm in the middle of traveling, I'm done with the subject, ok? Bye Bye.
 
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madokafc, can you tell me the stance of the government of Indonesia. it appears a bit unclear to me and seems you dance between all tables. on one day you are pro China, the next day you are against it.

Their official position is about neutrality and they try to be a mediator in the south china sea conflict, but at the same time, because of recent aggressive actions by chinese ships in the Natuna islands area, they realize that the chinese threat is real and they are starting to focus their military on it.

Lets see what madokafc says, but in my view, it doesn't work to try to be neutral once china has ambitions in your territory. Malaysia is a good case in point, they were very pro chinese and what did they get? They got stabbed in the back with chinese claims and exercises at James Shoal.

I don't think its a good idea for then to buy chinese military equipment from china such as those anti ship missiles, it does create a dependency with a country that will be your opponent (but at least they are getting technology transfer on that, which is actually very funny, the chinese have been delaying that tech transfer because of copyright issues, even that is tech that the chinese pirated from Russia).
 
Their official position is about neutrality and they try to be a mediator in the south china sea conflict, but at the same time, because of recent aggressive actions by chinese ships in the Natuna islands area, they realize that the chinese threat is real and they are starting to focus their military on it.

Lets see what madokafc says, but in my view, it doesn't work to try to be neutral once china has ambitions in your territory. Malaysia is a good case in point, they were very pro chinese and what did they get? They got stabbed in the back with chinese claims and exercises at James Shoal.

I don't think its a good idea for then to buy chinese military equipment from china such as those anti ship missiles, it does create a dependency with a country that will be your opponent (but at least they are getting technology transfer on that, which is actually very funny, the chinese have been delaying that tech transfer because of copyright issues, even that is tech that the chinese pirated from Russia).
no question the chinese are smart and play dirty tricks. they say one thing and do other thing. for them, the southeast asians are dumb. well, now at least Malaysia realises it and offers to host US spy aircraft. a 180 degree return.

http://online.wsj.com/articles/mala...vy-aircraft-military-official-says-1410524618

Indonesia has access to weapon technologies of US, Korean and other western companies. I guess the chinese are very interested to obtain this from Indonesia through backdoors, hence the proposed defence cooperations with Indonesia. Nothing is free in this world, least from the chinese.
 
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Army Corps #1
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Regiment 228 (air defence)...somewhere on the Sino-Vietnam border
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you think you are fighting ww2 by posting these primitive-equipped pics? stupid viets.
Yes, but we have a long history of victories against Asian and Western military powers including China, Mongol, France, America, Thailand, Cambodia and Champa, while China army is famous as loser.

What have you achieved in wars? You were good at civil wars, but against foreigners? You have a long history of terrible performances on battlefields. Yes, you lost even against a third rate army as Burma. Do you think having modern weapons will help you winning the next war? No, you will lose the next war again. As usual.
 
Yes, but we have a long history of victories against Asian and Western military powers including China, Mongol, France, America, Thailand, Cambodia and Champa, while China army is famous as loser.

What have you achieved in wars? You were good at civil wars, but against foreigners? You have a long history of terrible performances on battlefields. Yes, you lost even against a third rate army as Burma. Do you think having modern weapons will help you winning the next war? No, you will lose the next war again. As usual.
look at the ugly shape of your country, then everybody knows how capable you viets are in the history. Look at the territory China occupied, then you will konw what Chines could do
 

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