Type-99G and Type-96G in the national day parade

[jwh]

Generally people call such illegal acquisition of technologies, and making them domestic as photocopying !

In case of national security, it is nonsense to disscuss if this technical acquisition is legal or illegal. But most importantly you must make it domestic, it sounds like photocopy, but if you don't have a high level of domestic industry, you can not make.

 

[jwh]

No one is best at everything, and if sometimes someone is at par with others qualitatively its not economical to produce it locally.

so undermining something based upon the point that something it uses is imported from outside doesn't mean its not good.

In my opinion there are 5 hubs of technology in the world:-

1)USA
2)Germany
3)Russia
4)European Union Including Britain and excluding Germany
5)Japan

and mind you japan is a super power when it comes to technology, most of the technologies which are being used by the USA have their roots in japan, means they were innovated and developed by japan but USA used it and made changes to it according to its requirements.

so any statement which mentions that japan can't produce something which could compete with chinese is absolutly false.

Domestic production of tanks are vital to a country's security. In case of war you can not depend on some foreign countries to supply you with important components e.g tank gun, fire control, engine.

 

[SinoIndusFriendship]

No one is best at everything, and if sometimes someone is at par with others qualitatively its not economical to produce it locally.

so undermining something based upon the point that something it uses is imported from outside doesn't mean its not good.

In my opinion there are 5 hubs of technology in the world:-

1)USA
2)Germany
3)Russia
4)European Union Including Britain and excluding Germany
5)Japan

and mind you japan is a super power when it comes to technology, most of the technologies which are being used by the USA have their roots in japan, means they were innovated and developed by japan but USA used it and made changes to it according to its requirements.

so any statement which mentions that japan can't produce something which could compete with chinese is absolutly false.

It is saddening to see our Pakistani friends underestimating Chinese/China. If you've ever been outside of Pakistan, you would know your ordering is WAY OFF, as well as you left out 2 major science & tech hubs:

1) China (even if you don't factor in Taiwan or HK or Singapore)
2) South Korea

Let me tell you this, most of overseas Master & PhD are Chinese. Even in my undergraduate class most were Chinese.... many top students were Chinese...... many top researchers were Chinese....

But 'somebody' was way under-represented. I agree that shchinese is overly arrogant at times. Some people will say I am overly arrogant -- but, let me say this: "What I say is only a glimpse of what I know/can do"

 

[SinoIndusFriendship]

In case of national security, it is nonsense to disscuss if this technical acquisition is legal or illegal. But most importantly you must make it domestic, it sounds like photocopy, but if you don't have a high level of domestic industry, you can not make.

There does NOT exist a "universal copy machine". As you elucidated, there requires a high-level of domestic capability, if not then you would see much more nations able to do the same....

..... yet this is just a distraction. As you were correct to point out, in terms of national security and the welfare of your citizens, issues of "pride" and "face" is irrelevant. Don't let you ego control you.

 

[SinoIndusFriendship]

Let me add, that in my opinion China and Chinese have not reached their true potential, not even close. There are many NEW areas to explore, invent & develop.

All talk will achieve little, we must apply. Let's wait until 2020 before further embarrassing ourselves.

 

[abbasniazi]

It is saddening to see our Pakistani friends underestimating Chinese/China. If you've ever been outside of Pakistan, you would know your ordering is WAY OFF, as well as you left out 2 major science & tech hubs:

1) China (even if you don't factor in Taiwan or HK or Singapore)
2) South Korea

Let me tell you this, most of overseas Master & PhD are Chinese. Even in my undergraduate class most were Chinese.... many top students were Chinese...... many top researchers were Chinese....

But 'somebody' was way under-represented. I agree that shchinese is overly arrogant at times. Some people will say I am overly arrogant -- but, let me say this: "What I say is only a glimpse of what I know/can do"

Brother you are absolutly right, i,ve never been abroad, but i was lucky to be taught by foreighners in pakistan, i studied in an army institution for 11 years and had some chinese friends also.

as far as my list of technological hubs is concerned, i insist on the same list.and the reason is that the countries i mentioned have already proven themselves as technological hubs for decades, whereas china is in the process of mastering even those technologies which have been introduced by these countries.

furthermore, i didn't underestimate the chinese weapons rather i asked people not to under estimate japanese expertise.

lastly, i'd like to request you not to doubt my loyalty for my country or to those who are friends to our nation, but degrading or undermining those who are capable of matching us or our friends would be like living in a fools paradise.

 

[SinoIndusFriendship]

Brother you are absolutly right, i,ve never been abroad, but i was lucky to be taught by foreighners in pakistan, i studied in an army institution for 11 years and had some chinese friends also.

as far as my list of technological hubs is concerned, i insist on the same list.and the reason is that the countries i mentioned have already proven themselves as technological hubs for decades, whereas china is in the process of mastering even those technologies which have been introduced by these countries.

furthermore, i didn't underestimate the chinese weapons rather i asked people not to under estimate japanese expertise.

lastly, i'd like to request you not to doubt my loyalty for my country or to those who are friends to our nation, but degrading or undermining those who are capable of matching us or our friends would be like living in a fools paradise.

At least you were honest about your experiences. Please, do yourself a favor and learn Chinese, study in China at higher institution, read scientific publications (both in Chinese and English language journals). It will open up your eyes!

I am not picking on you, as I noticed this same misjudgement from other members (Indian, Pakistani, "Western"). And many of these developments were NOT 'invented', many were in fact "BORROWED" from ancient Chinese inventions --- and I also will say MANY WERE INDEED invented by Europeans or Americans or Japanese.

Also, I NEVER underestimate the Japanese (as some do). China does NOT underestimate Japan either, and nearly ALL Chinese will openly speak the truth: That Japan and America and Germany/France are ahead of them in many areas.

For me, it is different because I study with "supposedly" the best-of-the-best. And to be honest, when I was a young man in University, I too looked up to and thought these great scientists were so great.

Now my knowledge and skills have surpassed nearly all of my former mentors in numerous fields. And my skills and knowledge are only increasing daily. I am mentally secure in myself, yet I am not arrogant. I can recognize the truth, and I can recognize phonies.

I have 'hinted' on a diverse topics here, with the intent of teaching and opening up people's minds. However, there are many things I have kept secret as it is not the proper time to reveal. Let's leave it at that.

 

[ice_man]

i love the fact that all INDIANS feel that CHINESE EQUIPMENT IS CRAP...well the question is Russian equipment isn't better either and there isn't much in terms of INDIAN indigenous equipment!

so yes CHINESE tanks are better in terms of being a real thing and not just a dream on the drawing board like the LCA!!

 

[SinoIndusFriendship]

Actually, in a way I shouldn't mind people underestimating us. As it will give us an element of surprise.

 

[ice_man]

self deleted!

 

[shchinese]

i think JF-17 would be better to be compared with LCA

but the difference is while LCA could barely fulfilled IAF need,JF-17 already done so and also saw export prospect

a more comparable Chinese aircraft is the L-15 trainer.

Hongdu L-15 - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

and i have never underestimate chinese tanks.but note that other asian country produce excellent mbt as well.comparing tanks of different bloc is quite difficult since it is made to follow one country doctrine(Japan has no intention to invade other country so it wouldn't be surprised if it's mbt lack operational range)

this is not because they don't want such operational range, it is because the engine simply can't afford to have such performance. is there any intention for your mentioned Korean tanks to invade other countries? clearly no, but still its operational range is far better than the type-90.

it is also funny to hear words like "comparing tanks of different bloc is quite difficult" as you were even trying to compare type-10 which is a light tank with the type-99.

 

[tomluter]

Japanese 90 tank,there is no digital information system on board.it can not sure the integrated operations when tank formation on the battlefield.

Its armor protection is weak, it did not use the module armor technologies. to strengthen the protection, it have to depend on the additional armor, but it will increase vehicle weight, mobility capability is limited.

Type 90 tank has another design weakness, its unit pressure reaching 87 kPa, which determines the nature will limit its mobility. and the 90 tank cannot across the wetlands, even in the shallow water covered with reeds. and It has not experience tested in the forest zone, and its "forest mobility" was questioned.
The point is that its driver must pay attention to chose the right tracks to cross carefully, it will waste lots of attention of its driver on the battlefield.

there are lots of shortages,
such as liquid-gas suspension led the vessle shake in the rolling terrain, or after braking and shooting. the next shoot will been affected.

The 90 tank has an advanced fire control system technologies, but has an old basic design philosophy.It is not based on "first-hit" but "2nd-hitting."

chaotic switching arrangement,which will inconvenience the crew to operate it .

90 tank 's toothed claw steel tracks is weak ,even has the phenomenon of lateral skid, poor than their type 74 tank.

Its operational performance in the night-time is not satisfactory.

The sight of the gunner is too high, left sight is impossible. When the tanks take the left fighting echelon,they have to ture the turret to catch the left sight.

----------
Weapon system is an integrated Engineering, single advantage technology may not sure the whole system is a successful weapon system.
sorry,poor English.

 

[batmannow]

In case of national security, it is nonsense to disscuss if this technical acquisition is legal or illegal. But most importantly you must make it domestic, it sounds like photocopy, but if you don't have a high level of domestic industry, you can not make.

I AM , BACKING you man!
yes everything , is fair in love , & in WAR!
THE WORLD IS MOVING FAST, 70s 80s 90s & thn 2000 has been gone!
right now , our GREAT FRIEND CHINA, is heading towards in a victorious ECONOMIC situation, & time is comming faster , when all the remaing , so called "SUPER POWERS" like USA , WILL be begging investment from , china.
now, the world is on line!
i mean its just on our finger tips, & the key bord , doesnt recognize any , chinese or japanese or US finger impresions?
so the , TECHNOLOGY to steel is , the father of techs here, for now!
the probleum is UNCLE SAM & UNCLE TOM simply cant accept thier horrible economic defeat , from the IRON HANDS of great china.

they had done thier EXPLOITATION of the resourses, & the technology, which they never mind!
i think , chinese defence sector will going to take over , from them very soon, & i wish them good luck.

 

[tomluter]

all in all,
contrast to the S.korean,the Japanese tank manufacturing capacity is better.
And the diesel engine technology that over 1000 horsepower, contrast for the Europe technology such as MTU,Japanese was limited.
About the Type10 tank,improved?maybe lot, but there are not radical innovations than their old gen-3 tank. In despite of its video was popular on the web.
About the 10 tank's "fascinating" hydropneumatic suspension system, as a matter of fact, all of European new tanks have that, but the US tanks dont use that, because they think its reliability and the cost.

 

[xkasx]

Slightly Off Topic..

I wonder why our Indian members always laugh and call Chinese weapons cheap and useless when in reality they have a defeat to their name against China..

And I'm pretty sure deep down they know China isn't in their reach :p