Turkish Naval Programs
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Quasar
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what we gonna get is a platform which will meet our strategic priorities as stated by Admiral Murat Bilgel to USNI Proceedings
TR.1
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I think 8 in Milgem and 4 in TF2000.
$400 Million for a Frigate in 2020?
While a Kamorta Class Covertte costs $550 Million for Today's Batch!
A P17A is Budegted $1.5 Billion today for Commissioning in 2018.
That Budget would only get 1 TF 2000 if the Specs are to be believed.
Quasar
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dr_okuz from WAFF
some substantial info about our Meko s and multiple engagement capability
1. Not only Barbaros-B but also Barbaros-A also getting Mk41 VLS + SmartSMk2 combination. And unlike Grik meko new 3-D SmartS radar can provide "interrupted guidance" for ESSM, which means time share illumination of ESSM missile, each STIR radar can guide 4 ESSM missile. Which also means each Barbaros class can simultanously engage 8 target, while grik Hydra Class can guide ony 2 missile with any given time. So Barbaros Class has 4 times effective than coldwar era tech Hydra Class.
2. Turkish MEKO Class equipped with Harpoon Block-II missile, which can attack totally complex scenerious, is much more superior than Grik Harpoon Block-1C. In short Turkish MEKO is better than Hydra on ASuW
3. Turkish MEKO can carry latest S-70 Seahawk, which is techinally better than, grik seahawk; and Turkish frigate can fire Mk54 torpedos, in short Turkish MEKO ASW capability musch superior than Grik Hydra Class
4. Turkish MEKO Class, has military SATCOM capability, HF over IP communication system, Link16 and Link11 CAVLIS; upgraded ASELSAN GPS/INS suite, Warship-AIS which is indigneous, etc.. So Turkish MEKO has better communication-identification suite.
4. And we have complete modernization for MEKA200 TrackI
.Upgrade of SeaZenith, with ASELSAN optics, and radar digitaliziation (which is done)
.Upgraded communication navigation suite.
. Most importantly new ASELSAN WARSHIP EW SYSTEM that includes:
*Active Phased Array Jammer (2 jammers, with 2 transmitter array)
*Expandble Jammer and launcher system
*MKE 130mm chaff-flare launchers
*New ESM system
*Laser Warning Device, that is used in Milgem
*IRST that is showed in IDEF-11
*Floating decoy
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
First if you have sufficent timely presice computer system (time share for spesific duties) and make complex wave form to transmitters, you can midcourse guide ESSM/SM-2 Missile, while you would need Mk99 FCS for illumination. This case is AEIGS!
Second, if your radar proccessing system is not that "smart" you can do some other things. If you have good CMS system like GENESIS that control 3D and FCS radars you can do multiple engagement with out need of "mid-course links"
In this case, you detect-track and find engagement envelope for multiple target; than you can fire ESSM missile for each target with intertial guidance only, missile accelarte to direction, than you can switch missile terminal illumination one-by one controlled by GENESIS; but this has limitation comparing to AEIGS.
ICWI is another thing, I used on purpose but it is not the thing that are used in APAR radar, where radar itself send pencil beams both for midcourse and terminal homing, on interrupted time share. This is the spesific for that Radar, also used in Austaralian OHP modernization.
Our MEKO's multiple engagement is different, let say it can fire 2 missile to one target, if the first missile is failed, than STIR can guide other missile which is on the way.
So, multiple engagement is related with "system" rather than radar if the radars are not AESA; so you cannot find a document related to Smart-S Mk2 radars with multiple engagement. Similarly you cannot find a document that states SPY-1 Radar can engage multiple target, so it cant, but as a system AEIGS can.
http://www.network54.com/Forum/248068/thread/1355236379/last-1355260424/Greek+Meko+vs+Turkish+Meko
some substantial info about our Meko s and multiple engagement capability
1. Not only Barbaros-B but also Barbaros-A also getting Mk41 VLS + SmartSMk2 combination. And unlike Grik meko new 3-D SmartS radar can provide "interrupted guidance" for ESSM, which means time share illumination of ESSM missile, each STIR radar can guide 4 ESSM missile. Which also means each Barbaros class can simultanously engage 8 target, while grik Hydra Class can guide ony 2 missile with any given time. So Barbaros Class has 4 times effective than coldwar era tech Hydra Class.
2. Turkish MEKO Class equipped with Harpoon Block-II missile, which can attack totally complex scenerious, is much more superior than Grik Harpoon Block-1C. In short Turkish MEKO is better than Hydra on ASuW
3. Turkish MEKO can carry latest S-70 Seahawk, which is techinally better than, grik seahawk; and Turkish frigate can fire Mk54 torpedos, in short Turkish MEKO ASW capability musch superior than Grik Hydra Class
4. Turkish MEKO Class, has military SATCOM capability, HF over IP communication system, Link16 and Link11 CAVLIS; upgraded ASELSAN GPS/INS suite, Warship-AIS which is indigneous, etc.. So Turkish MEKO has better communication-identification suite.
4. And we have complete modernization for MEKA200 TrackI
.Upgrade of SeaZenith, with ASELSAN optics, and radar digitaliziation (which is done)
.Upgraded communication navigation suite.
. Most importantly new ASELSAN WARSHIP EW SYSTEM that includes:
*Active Phased Array Jammer (2 jammers, with 2 transmitter array)
*Expandble Jammer and launcher system
*MKE 130mm chaff-flare launchers
*New ESM system
*Laser Warning Device, that is used in Milgem
*IRST that is showed in IDEF-11
*Floating decoy
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
First if you have sufficent timely presice computer system (time share for spesific duties) and make complex wave form to transmitters, you can midcourse guide ESSM/SM-2 Missile, while you would need Mk99 FCS for illumination. This case is AEIGS!
Second, if your radar proccessing system is not that "smart" you can do some other things. If you have good CMS system like GENESIS that control 3D and FCS radars you can do multiple engagement with out need of "mid-course links"
In this case, you detect-track and find engagement envelope for multiple target; than you can fire ESSM missile for each target with intertial guidance only, missile accelarte to direction, than you can switch missile terminal illumination one-by one controlled by GENESIS; but this has limitation comparing to AEIGS.
ICWI is another thing, I used on purpose but it is not the thing that are used in APAR radar, where radar itself send pencil beams both for midcourse and terminal homing, on interrupted time share. This is the spesific for that Radar, also used in Austaralian OHP modernization.
Our MEKO's multiple engagement is different, let say it can fire 2 missile to one target, if the first missile is failed, than STIR can guide other missile which is on the way.
So, multiple engagement is related with "system" rather than radar if the radars are not AESA; so you cannot find a document related to Smart-S Mk2 radars with multiple engagement. Similarly you cannot find a document that states SPY-1 Radar can engage multiple target, so it cant, but as a system AEIGS can.
http://www.network54.com/Forum/248068/thread/1355236379/last-1355260424/Greek+Meko+vs+Turkish+Meko
BordoEnes
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If we summarize;
- 4 AAW GENESIS II Destroyer / Frigate equiped with Long Range Air Defence missiles (TF-2000)
- 8 Milgem Light Frigate / Corvette (First designed for a dedicated ASW Warship, then turned back to multipurpose warship since Greece badly failed on their U-214 submarine programme and has no modern submarine force today and tomorrow)
- 6(?) ASUW TF-100 Frigate equiped with SOM-Naval & Atmaca missiles AND VLS-41 (ESSM & SM-2)
- 4 MEKO 200 Track 2 A-B Multipurpose Frigate Upgraded with GENESIS and VLS-41 Launchers
- 2 MEKO 200 Track 1 Multipurpose Frigate
- 8 Perry Frigate Upgraded with GENESIS and VLS-41 Launchers.
Now such a navy ^^^ above supported with tens of most modern U-214 & U-209 (Excluding Ay class) submarine force, LPD and LHDs, tens of Seahawks and support vessels, ATR-72 & CN-235 (MSA & MPA) Aircrafts, LSTs, LCTs, etc.... etc.... is not being built for defence only.
We have an aim and everyone will see it in near future.
From BabyBeach WAFF
- 4 AAW GENESIS II Destroyer / Frigate equiped with Long Range Air Defence missiles (TF-2000)
- 8 Milgem Light Frigate / Corvette (First designed for a dedicated ASW Warship, then turned back to multipurpose warship since Greece badly failed on their U-214 submarine programme and has no modern submarine force today and tomorrow)
- 6(?) ASUW TF-100 Frigate equiped with SOM-Naval & Atmaca missiles AND VLS-41 (ESSM & SM-2)
- 4 MEKO 200 Track 2 A-B Multipurpose Frigate Upgraded with GENESIS and VLS-41 Launchers
- 2 MEKO 200 Track 1 Multipurpose Frigate
- 8 Perry Frigate Upgraded with GENESIS and VLS-41 Launchers.
Now such a navy ^^^ above supported with tens of most modern U-214 & U-209 (Excluding Ay class) submarine force, LPD and LHDs, tens of Seahawks and support vessels, ATR-72 & CN-235 (MSA & MPA) Aircrafts, LSTs, LCTs, etc.... etc.... is not being built for defence only.
We have an aim and everyone will see it in near future.
From BabyBeach WAFF
selvan33
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no. russia getting 4 mistral class at a cost of $3.4 billion. each unit costs $850 mill.
Ir.Tab.
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http://www.desan-shipyard.com
Distressed Submarine Rescue Ship (MOSHIP) !!!
Specification
Length 88.60 m
Breadth 17 m
Draught 6 m
Displacement 4000 Tons
(approx.)
Speed (max) 18+ kts
Cruising Range 4500+ mile
Seismic Survey Ship
Distressed Submarine Rescue Ship (MOSHIP) !!!
Specification
Length 88.60 m
Breadth 17 m
Draught 6 m
Displacement 4000 Tons
(approx.)
Speed (max) 18+ kts
Cruising Range 4500+ mile
Seismic Survey Ship
cabatli_53
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Desan Shipyard
Distressed Submarine Rescue Ship (MOSHIP) !!!
Specification
Length 88.60 m
Breadth 17 m
Draught 6 m
Displacement 4000 Tons
(approx.)
Speed (max) 18+ kts
Cruising Range 4500+ mile
Seismic Survey Ship
Construction of Turkey's own designed seismic vessel worth 100 million Euro is commenced in Istanbul shipyard.
Ir.Tab.
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Privately Owned Turkish Shipyard will be main contractor, also responsible for design, construction, integration and tests and final performance of Turkish LHD program.
According to Under-secretariat for Defence Industries (SSM), 1- SEDEF Gemi İnşaatı A.Ş., 2- RMK Marine Gemi Yapım Sanayi A.Ş. And 3- DESAN Deniz İnşaat Sanayi A.Ş. are the bidders.
I only found RMK Marine concept which is not new in PDF. But not bad to compare it with Mistral:
The LPD project of RMK marine in comparison with Mistral will be bigger :
Mistral dimensions:
Length: 199 m
Beam: 32 m
Draught: 6.3 m
RMK LPD dimensions:
Length: 200 m
Beam: 34 m
Draught: 7 m
Mistral:
Displacement: 21,500 tonnes (full load)
RMK LPD:
Displacement: 25,000 tonnes (full load)
RMK LPD will have the following capabilities:
Platform for 4 x 35 ton Helicopter (simultaneous operations)
Hangar for 6 x Sea Hawk or 4 x Merlin Helicopters
2 Vehicle Decks For 90+ Vehicles (13 x Main Battle Tanks, 27 x AAVs, 21 x APCs, 30+ Misc.); Total Parking Area 2800 m2
Vehicle Decks are Suitable for the Stowage of Sea Hawk and Attack Helikopters
Vehicle Lift SWL : 30 Ton
Helicopter Lift SWL : 15 Ton
Welldock For 4 x LCMs or 2xLCACs
Stb. And Port Davits For 2 x LCVPs
Deck Crane 30 Tonnes @ 12m
Stern Ramp/Door - SWL : 60 Tones
Side Ramp/Door - SWL : 60 Tones
The Landing Platform Dock vessel has the following weapons and sensors configuration:
2 x 40 mm gun
2 x CIWS
3 x 12,7 mm stabilized machine gun
Search and Surveillance Radar
Electro Optical Director
Fire Control Radar
Chaff Decoy
Electronic Support Measure System (ESM)
But I did not find any time schedule in the official site of RMK marine shipyard
BordoEnes
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I think the Turkish navy should completly change its requirments. For example we are currently give huge money to 16 ASW YKTB, 8 ASW Ada-Class Corvette for what? Greeces entire fleet of submarines is ancient and they are canceling there purchase of U214 seeming that the Shipyard is now trying to sell it to Egypte and Poland. Russias Black sea fleet dont have submarines and as for other neighbouring nations they either have not big submarine fleet, Doesnt even have submarine fleet or are ancient/Low tech submarines.
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