Turkish Naval Programs

[LegionnairE]

You know,if I or Akritas or anyone else here (who is not Pakistani) said that the Turkish AESA is probably not that good compared to Western ones.....they would tear me to pieces. They'd rush to say I'm jealous etc.

Before I joined the forum,I read many comments on Youtube,where Turks were fighting about the F-35. Some went like this:

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I wouldn't take the Youtube comments very seriously... But I wouldn't take this forum very seriously either so don't mind me

Regarding the AESA radar, if we had everything, we wouldn't be asking for upgrade kits from America.

After the S400 debacle, a lot of sheep started saying "F35 is shit anyway" But you can rest assured if Americans decide to sell, we'll jump on it right away and the same sheep will be singing praises about the F35.

Sheep don't have personalities or any opinions of their own. You can safely ignore them.

 

[MMM-E]

T****

I always said Turkiye did mistake to buy only F-16 from USA ( dependent on 1 country )

Greece has American F-16 , French Mirage-2000 and Rafale
Egypt has American F-16 , French Rafale , even Russian MIG-29M2
S.Arabia has American F-15 and European Eurofighter
The UAE has American F-16 , French Mirage-2000 and Rafale
Qatar has American F-15 , French Mirage-2000 and Rafale , European Eurofighter

Nobody can say Turkiye doesnt have money
Turkiye spent even over $50 billion for 3,6 million Syrian refugees


İn 2019 my thread about F35

Turkish F-35 vs Israeli F-35

Israel has a unique position in the project because it is the only country that is allowed to equip the F-35 with its avionics and software on the other hand Turkish Airforce F-35s always will be dependent on the US the F-35 like as a flying computer The internal programming of the F-35...

defence.pk

F-35 is useless platform which can not take off even without American permission in a conflict against Greece

USA-İsrael saved Turkiye from $40-50 billion to spend for 100 F-35s ( buying,operating cost , maintenance )

instead of American control flying computer F35
better to spend $40-50 billion to develop/produce indigenous projects KIZILELMA , TISU , HURJET and TFX to become real military power


KIZILELMA , TISU , HURJET and TFX becomes reality year by year
sooner or later , Turkiye will become an independent and real military power

Countries like Greece always will be dependent on USA-France

 

[Foinikas]

I wouldn't take the Youtube comments very seriously... But I wouldn't take this forum very seriously either so don't mind me

Regarding the AESA radar, if we had everything, we wouldn't be asking for upgrade kits from America.

After the S400 debacle, a lot of people started saying "F35 is shit anyway" But you can rest assured if Americans decide to sell, we'll jump on it right away.

Exactly! Exactly that! Before Turkey was kicked from the program,I would see countless comments by Turks bragging about the superweapon F-35 and bye-bye Greece Ege is ours etc.

After Turkey got kicked from the program....suddenly the F-35 became too expensive,full of problems,a bad design,a bad jet fighter,good thing that Turkey never bought it,we don't need it,ours is even better etc.

Of course,there were some people who supported the F-35 and believed the government made a big mistake. But they were too few. Most were talking about the drones and the TFX.

 

[LegionnairE]

Exactly! Exactly that! Before Turkey was kicked from the program,I would see countless comments by Turks bragging about the superweapon F-35 and bye-bye Greece Ege is ours etc.

After Turkey got kicked from the program....suddenly the F-35 became too expensive,full of problems,a bad design,a bad jet fighter,good thing that Turkey never bought it,we don't need it,ours is even better etc.

Of course,there were some people who supported the F-35 and believed the government made a big mistake. But they were too few. Most were talking about the drones and the TFX.

This is why, you can't reason with sheep. No matter what happens, shepard is right. If anybody questions the shepard, what do they know anyway? Shepard knows best!

If George Orwell saw these people, he would realize that 1984 wasn't extreme enough.

 

[LegionnairE]

You know what was one of the worst points? When people lost their houses due to the fires and he came with a bus,throwing boxes of tea at them. He was literally tea-bagging them. The people lost their houses and he was giving them free tea.
When covid started,the was telling the people "lemon colonia and garlic protect from the virus". And then fought against the top doctors in Turkey,because they said the Turkish indigenous vaccine was a scam.

I don't think it was a scam, it was just too little too late. I think the mRNA vaccine was the real scam. So many health people are developing heart problems, blood clots etc. and dropping dead all of a sudden.

We should have stuck with the chinese vaccine.

 

[MMM-E]

Turkiye exploring massive UK arms deal involving Planes,Ships and Tank Engines over $10 billion​

Multibillion-dollar deal for Eurofighter Jets, Transport Planes, Frigates and Tank Engines is being discussed as Turkey faces procurement hurdles in the US

The sources said that during their meeting Akar and Wallace explored the possibility of Turkiye purchasing Eurofighter Jets, C-130J transport planes and Type 23 Frigates, as well as Engines for Turkey’s M60 battle Tanks.

The estimated value of such a deal is well over $10 billion, according to the sources.

Eurofighter

C-130J

Type-23 Frigate

Turkey exploring massive UK arms deal involving planes, ships and tank engines

Multibillion-dollar deal for Eurofighter jets, transport planes, frigates and tank engines is being discussed as Turkey faces procurement hurdles in the US

www.middleeasteye.net

 

[aziqbal]

Turkiye exploring massive UK arms deal involving Planes,Ships and Tank Engines over $10 billion​

Multibillion-dollar deal for Eurofighter Jets, Transport Planes, Frigates and Tank Engines is being discussed as Turkey faces procurement hurdles in the US

The sources said that during their meeting Akar and Wallace explored the possibility of Turkiye purchasing Eurofighter Jets, C-130J transport planes and Type 23 Frigates, as well as Engines for Turkey’s M60 battle Tanks.

The estimated value of such a deal is well over $10 billion, according to the sources.

Eurofighter

C-130J

Type-23 Frigate

Turkey exploring massive UK arms deal involving planes, ships and tank engines

Multibillion-dollar deal for Eurofighter jets, transport planes, frigates and tank engines is being discussed as Turkey faces procurement hurdles in the US

www.middleeasteye.net

NO NO NO

and I dont belief this news

why Type 23 when they have I-Class
why Typhoon when they have TFX
why C130J when they have A400

 

[monitor]

NO NO NO

and I dont belief this news

why Type 23 when they have I-Class
why Typhoon when they have TFX
why C130J when they have A400

Its a barter contract by turkey I think. If they buy weapons from UK turkey will get engine development support from UK and other area where Turkish defence industry not yet mature. Beside this upgraded type 23 will replace few old waships from Turkish navy before enough number of I class and TF2000 class join Turkish fleet . C130J is currently best bang for buck even we buy few from UK.
Typhoon is one of the best fighter so its natural choice before TFX join after 2030 .

 

[merzifonlu]

NO NO NO

and I dont belief this news

why Type 23 when they have I-Class
why Typhoon when they have TFX
why C130J when they have A400

The reason for purchasing the C-130J is actually very simple. A400M is a good aircraft, but the number of aircraft is insufficient. We only have 10 of them. In addition, we know the C-130s very well, and we are very familiar with their operation and maintenance.

Others, IMO may be some sort of price to pay for the TFX's engine.

 

[LegionnairE]

The reason for purchasing the C-130J is actually very simple. A400M is a good aircraft, but the number of aircraft is insufficient. We only have 10 of them. In addition, we know the C-130s very well, and we are very familiar with their operation and maintenance.

Others, IMO may be some sort of price to pay for the TFX's engine.

We do need a stop-gap solution until TFX comes alive. We don't want to rush TFX.

 

[merzifonlu]

We do need a stop-gap solution until TFX comes alive. We don't want to rush TFX.

If EF Typhoons to be purchased, i) do not have radar and we are going to integrate our own AESA radar, ii) we can introduce our own domestic missiles, iii) they will be delivered immediately and will be operational within 1 year, then I think it would be logical to purchase EF Typhoons.

Because even if the USA sells the F16V without any problems (IMO, USA will definitely cause problems). Those planes will not come before 5 years.

 

[LegionnairE]

If EF Typhoons to be purchased, i) do not have radar and we are going to integrate our own AESA radar, ii) we can introduce our own domestic missiles, iii) they will be delivered immediately and will be operational within 1 year, then I think it would be logical to purchase EF Typhoons.

Because even if the USA sells the F16V without any problems (IMO, USA will definitely cause problems). Those planes will not come before 5 years.

I haven't the slightest expectation about F16s... If they come, I'll be surprised.

We need more planes. Period. There aren't many other alternatives to Typhoon. It's the only option left.

 

[dBSPL]

The purchase of some C130Js which are curently for sale by UK MoD, and new production Merlin (AW101) helicopters in different configurations is on the agenda. Helicopters for the navy, cargo planes for the air force.

Moreover, the negotiations on the EF T3/T4 procurement are proceeding independently of the F-16 negotiations with the US and the recent second round of negotiations about the F-35 reconciliation committee. According to statements made by both the Foreign Office and the MoD, if the terms of the EF negotiations are agreed, this aircraft will be procured regardless of the outcome of the F-16 purchase. The most important reason for these statements may be that there are a number of negotiating points on the table related to industrial cooperation.

The purchase of a limited number of T1s for OCU purposes is also on the agenda, but the main purpose is to replace the F4E 2020 Terminator jets (a total of 54 jets, some of which are currently decommissioned) with a new block of EFs that can use the entire domestic ordnance group, just like F4Es.

Since the agreement has not yet been finalized, the details have not yet been shared, but probably, there is not only Turkish procurement on the table, a two-way bargaining is ongoing. And it is not unlikely that the visit of the UK defense minister and some air force staff to TAI and BAYKAR facilities and some technical briefings in recent months may be related to this.

In short, there is significant potential cooperation in defense relations with both the UK and Italy. However, all these possibilities aside, if the EF procurement talks are successful, this could create a new era for the future integration of the Turkish and British aerospace industries and increase opportunities for cooperation.

 

[LegionnairE]

The purchase of some C130Js which are curently for sale by UK MoD, and new production Merlin (AW101) helicopters in different configurations is on the agenda. Helicopters for the navy, cargo planes for the air force.

I'm guessing AEW&C version of Merlin for TCG Anadolu ?

The purchase of a limited number of T1s for OCU purposes is also on the agenda, but the main purpose is to replace the F4E 2020 Terminator jets (a total of 54 jets, some of which are currently decommissioned) with a new block of EFs that can use the entire domestic ordnance group, just like F4Es.

This is great news, thank you

In short, there is significant potential cooperation in defense relations with both the UK and Italy. However, all these possibilities aside, if the EF procurement talks are successful, this could create a new era for the future integration of the Turkish and British aerospace industries and increase opportunities for cooperation.

Tempest?

Also any news about the Type 23?

 

[dBSPL]

I'm guessing AEW&C version of Merlin for TCG Anadolu ?


This is great news, thank you


Tempest?

Also any news about the Type 23?

I don't have any information about Type-23s, but I am guessing that this may not be fake news. Like the majority, I believe that such a purchase or grant is not necessary. On the other hand, as you know, we have seen similar initiatives in the past. I won't go back further up to the purchase of Aviso's, but two examples of recent negotiations that have been going on seriously and have somehow didnt come to fruition are the statements of our interest for HMS OCEAN in the British parlement (later, this ship sold to Brazil) around 2020 and the negotiations on the transfer of 2 OHP frigates in the US congress in the 2010s.

The Turkish navy is feeling pressure to expand in order to move in parallel with interests. In 2023 alone, we will commission 1 frigate, 1 patrol corvette, 1 submarine, 1 fast combat support ship and 1 Lhd, but even this pace is not enough, because in order to reach this level of indigenization, and maybe due to some political decision errors, we could not launch significant size platforms than corvettes or support roles in the main platforms of the navy for almost 20 years.

I have the same prediction as you about AW101s. At least 2 or 3 of them are likely to have AEW configuration. It is a really capable platform and I hope there will be an opportunity to buy it under favorable conditions.