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Turkey’s S-400 vs F-35 dilemma in 2019

F-35 vs S-400; If Turkey had to choose one, which one should it choose?

  • F-35

  • S-400


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132 not 232.



What would it means for turkish reputation if Turkey cancel the S400 deal.




unfortunatly canceling the deal is not an option it seems too late! not because of some concepts like reputation or trust but because of the current political will! the quetion can be asked the other way around as well ''What would it means for Turkish reputation as a NATO member if Turkey is denied to have the JSF? you may love or hate Erdoğan but frankly speaking we have to give it to him he is a pragmatic leader and he knows how to step aside last second when he is on a collision course with a stronger power be it domesticly or internationaly and once in a while he even saves his face while he is doing it.
 
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unfortunatly canceling the deal is not an option it is too late! not because of some concepts like reputation or trust but because of the current political will! the quetion can be asked the other way around as well ''What would it means for Turkish reputation as a NATO member if Turkey is denied to have the JSF? you may love or hate Erdoğan but frankly speaking we have to give it to him he is a pragmatic leader and he knows how to step aside last second when he is on a collision course with a stronger power be it domesticly or internationaly and once in a while he even saves his face while he is doing it.

Who cares about Nato, what has Nato ever done for Turkey anyway??

Oh they protected Turkey from the Soviets big deal. Cold War was stupid, Turkey should have never participated in it. Usa and the soviets were two sides of the same coin.

Look how you have nato members backing a pkk state and you have the usa threatening to confiscate F35s which Turkey worked on as a partner.

Right way is to go your own way too bad Turkey is not strong enough to go its own way yet.
 
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Top US general in Europe: Don’t give Turkey F-35 if they buy Russian system
WASHINGTON — The top uniformed officer in NATO and the head of American forces in Europe said Tuesday that if Turkey goes through with its decision to buy a Russian air defense system, he would recommend the Pentagon refuse to give Ankara its planned purchase of the F-35 Joint Strike Fighter.

Testifying in front of the Senate Armed Services Committee, Gen. Curtis Scaparrotti said it would be his “best military advice" that sales to Turkey of the F-35 be cut, should that nation buy the S-400 air defense system.

“If they accept the S-400 to establish it in Turkey, there is first the issue that it’s not interoperable with NATO systems, nor is it interoperable inside of our integrated missile defense system. The second has to do with the F-35. It presents a problem to all of our aircraft, but specifically the F-35, I believe,” Scaparrotti said.

“My best military advice would be that we don’t then follow through with the F-35 — flying it or working with an ally that is working with Russian systems, particularly air defense systems, with one of our most advanced technological capabilities,” he added.

Concerns about Turkey’s decision to procure the S-400 are nothing new. Officials in the U.S. and Europe believe Russia could gain a dangerous amount of information on the fifth-generation fighter should the systems be linked.

But Scaparrotti’s statement is particularly notable, as he also serves as supreme allied commander of NATO. His comments come weeks after the Munich Security Conference, where U.S. Vice President Mike Pence warned Turkey that “we will not stand idly by while NATO allies purchase weapons from our adversaries. We cannot ensure the defense of the West if our allies grow dependent on the East."

Turkey plans to buy 100 Joint Strike Fighters over the course of the program, and its first F-35 pilots have already begun training alongside U.S. pilots at Luke Air Force Base, Arizona. Turkish companies play a key industrial role in the program as one of the producers of the center fuselage and the maker of the cockpit display.

As a result of the planned S-400 procurement, the Pentagon launched a large study into whether it would be possible to remove Turkey from the F-35 industrial base.

Asked about the industrial base, the general said: “For them I would underscore this is a huge decision for Turkey. I have talked to them, as all of our leadership has.” He added that there is a team on the ground today talking with the Turks about the issue.

“I would hope they would reconsider this decision on the S-400, one system, but potentially forfeit many of the other systems and one of the most important systems we provide them," he said.

One such system besides the F-35 that could be impacted should Russia buy the S-400 is the Patriot missile defense system, which Turkey was recently cleared to buy.

Valerie Insinna in Washington contributed to this report.
 
Who cares about Nato, what has Nato ever done for Turkey anyway??

Oh they protected Turkey from the Soviets big deal. Cold War was stupid, Turkey should have never participated in it. Usa and the soviets were two sides of the same coin.

Look how the you have nato members backing a pkk state and you have the usa threatening to confiscate F35s which Turkey worked on as a partner.

Right way is to go your own way too bad Turkey is not strong enough to go its own way yet.

totally agree with the last part!however, Even when we became ''strong enough'' trust me we will still be part of some millitary or economic coalition since we are not alone in this planet and always in interaction with other countries or political entities with whome we have temporarily over laping or conficting interest and since the same is true with the rest, millitary or economic coalitions are inevitable among nations. What may deffer is the roles we have played relative to our strengths.
 
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Ruşen Çakır is one of the several Turkish journalists who really knows deep inside Turkish İslamists maybe just only he.
He gained huge observation further more he lived and spent time in most conservative districts such as Fatih while pursuing his career in his young ages.
Also he knows foreign languages and has global perspective. I recommend you following him. He might be a socialist point of view but always he is always an objective.
 
Yes it is very obvious that you lack those cells. Say the deliveries of 100 F35As will be done 2028. Another batch of 100 order will be delivered untill 2040 for example.

Why would we starve when we organize the budget thoroughly? As if we will pay the whole money today.

On the other hand, we have the money to spend on the Patriots!.

What exactly is the threat of S400 to F35? Russian S400 in Syria have definitely come into contact with Israeli F35's, and I recently saw an article that marine F35's flew some missions over Syria probably within range of Russian S400. There are tactics to detect stealth aircraft through high band radar, the Russians aren't stupid they already know how to do it. If anything this is an opportunity for the Americans to get a look in the S400 system.
Wtf is the threat, if we buy it the Russian aren not going to suddenly find a super flaw in the plane that allows them to make them all self destruct.
 
What exactly is the threat of S400 to F35? Russian S400 in Syria have definitely come into contact with Israeli F35's, and I recently saw an article that marine F35's flew some missions over Syria probably within range of Russian S400. There are tactics to detect stealth aircraft through high band radar, the Russians aren't stupid they already know how to do it. If anything this is an opportunity for the Americans to get a look in the S400 system.
Wtf is the threat, if we buy it the Russian aren not going to suddenly find a super flaw in the plane that allows them to make them all self destruct.

This happens when it comes to Turkey always. They are very reluctant in selling patriots to Turkey but very eager to sell Thaad to Saudis. Purely political. By the way Erdoğan said a few minutes ago that we might join the S500 process.

 
This happens when it comes to Turkey always. They are very reluctant in selling patriots to Turkey but very eager to sell Thaad to Saudis. Purely political. By the way Erdoğan said a few minutes ago that we might join the S500 process.

ok we havent received any ToT concernig S - 400 but now saying that we might join the S 500 process? :devil: and after a year we will see another tweet by same people saying'' We are fooled''
 
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Turkey should work with Russia

-- Nuclear Power Plant
-- TURKSTREAM Gas pipe line
-- S400 Air Defense System with Turkish Radar software and IFF System
-- maybe also S500 in near future
-- also Russia is ready to work with Turkey to develop TFX Fighter Jet and Turbofan Engine
-- and Russia support Turkey in the Eastern Mediterranean and Syria

Turkey needs S400 to protect national interests in the Eastern Mediterranean against the US backed Greece-Egypt-Israel alliance and in Syria against the US backed PKK/YPG Terrorists


so Turkey is global partner of F35 program since 1999 and Turkey invested $1,25 billion for F35 program
but the US is threatening Turkey to block the sale of F-35

President ERDOGAN said that Turkey will resort to international arbitration if the US blocks the sale of F-35 to Turkey
so if F-35s comes to Turkey , then no any problem or the US will pay billiions of dollars penalty to Turkey

then SU-57 Fighter Jet with Turkish design cockpit , electronics , source codes , software , IFF System , SPEWS-II self protection Electronic Warfare Suite and air to air missiles - cruise missile and smart Bombs

Greece,Egypt,Israel,Iran and Saudi Arabia are potential threats to Turkey in the region
I prefer Turkish control S400 + SU-57 instead of American control F35 against Greek F-16s , Egyptian Rafales and Israeli F-15s-F-35s


 
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Depends.

If our industrial participation won't be effected, I'd chose the S400.

If the US government not only blocks the transfer of our F35s but excludes us from the F35 program at the same time, I'd say we're making a grave mistake here.

Sometimes you have to swallow your pride in order to achieve bigger goals. Our industrial participation is worth 13 - 16.000.000.000 USD. If we take this income into account, we'll recognise that our F35s are actually extremely cheap. Or I could put it this way: several of our birds are effectively a gift from the US to Turkey.

Yes, the US is an shitty ally but we simply need their money and technology - at least for now.
Go for f35 ask Americans for thaad
 

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