Traitors...

[Armstrong]

@HRK @dexter - Janab aap loggon seh guzzarish hai keh @Secur key koi shaadi wagheraa ka bandobast karein.....so many evenings spent alone have made him a cranky old man !

Koi Mrs.Secur aur Secur Jr. hooon geiii tou apneiii Bhai key zindagi phir seh gulzar ho jai giii !

 

[Secur]

First of all if you want to talk about politicians being labelled as traitors or otherwise then stop playing victim card and mentioning "mohajir" thing here.

Your objection or frustration is why assemblies adopted resolution to condemn Altaf Hussain's drunkard speech then the reply is political parties are working upon own political agendas and under the law they are free to put any such resolution at the floor of the assembly . It is just democratic process . MQM has the right to put any such resolution for voting against any politician/leader/party which it considers a traitor/s. If everyone is voting against you and you find no supporter in this case then there must be something wrong with you so why cry

Simple as that. The tag is just used for exploitation and crying .

There's no victim card being played, there's a genuine problem at hand where a few are traitors while the rest can get away with almost anything. Both are interlinked.

Really? So political parties in assemblies never could find a single political agenda to speak against other traitors? What sort of lame argument are you giving me under the "simple as that" tag here? Explain to me, in simple words, why Altaf Hussain is a traitor and Akbar Bugti, Munawwar Hasan, Khwaja Asif, Imran Khan plus dozens others aren't despite speaking in more or less the same manner and some of them even involved in waging a war against the state? Its just a democratic process to forgive the sinister mistakes of the sons of soils?

I know very well, the reason for everyone being against MQM, they are at an evolutionary disadvantage being not living here for some hundreds of years.

It's the money again sir, they would speak if it benefits them or be silent if that works best for them and in the end you can shortlist a handful of those who decide whether to speak or not. Most 'public representatives' are just political mercenaries working for private interests of their bosses called leaders in Pakistani dictionary

Why does it always work best for them to stay silent when others are found guilty of the same, mate? Is there something that I don't understand about politics? This is a diplomatic answer and I am not looking for one.

 

[Spring Onion]

There's no victim card being played, there's a genuine problem at hand where a few are traitors while the rest can get away with almost anything. Both are interlinked.

Nothing is interlinked here. There had been actions against Bugtis, the Bachakhanis and so on. Its only MQM which wants to eat the pie and continue terrorizing Pakistanis.

Really? So political parties in assemblies never could find a single political agenda to speak against other traitors? What sort of lame argument are you giving me under the "simple as that" tag here? Explain to me, in simple words, why Altaf Hussain is a traitor and Akbar Bugti, Munawwar Hasan, Khwaja Asif, Imran Khan plus dozens others aren't despite speaking in more or less the same manner and some of them even involved in waging a war against the state? Its just a democratic process to forgive the sinister mistakes of the sons of soils?


.

Why ask me? Ask your beloved MQM why it had always been in bed with these "traitors" you have mentioned? ask your beloved MQM why MQM never brought any such resolution against these people in Assemblies or at least one assembly after all MQM had been in Govt one way or the other.

I know very well, the reason for everyone being against MQM, they are at an evolutionary disadvantage being not living here for some hundreds of years.

cry me a river. our greatest loss that these saints of MQM did not live here for some hundreds of years.

 

[Secur]

Why ask me? Ask your beloved MQM why it had always been in bed with these "traitors" you have mentioned? ask your beloved MQM why MQM never brought any such resolution against these people in Assemblies or at least one assembly after all MQM had been in Govt one way or the other.

MQM isn't my beloved though I wish to know the reason for selective treatment. Why should it only be MQM to bring resolution against other traitors? Are others not Pakistanis enough to do so? When is Baluchistan assembly passing a resolution against Akbar Bugti, murderer of security forces and the man involved in a war against the state? What political agenda, according to your earlier arguments, prevents them from doing so? You answer everything but the question. Of course, there's a distinction clearly made between son of soils and immigrants.

cry me a river. our greatest loss that these saints of MQM did not live here for some hundreds of years.

Had they did, there would have been no resolution in assemblies and no widespread condemnation, that is the point. You clearly have more interest and an obsession with the word crying and typing without reading hence the persistent failure in understanding what is being said.

@Oscar How does pretending that there's no problem and then becoming a part of it work for most people of Pakistan?

 

[Zarvan]

MQM isn't my beloved though I wish to know the reason for selective treatment. Why should it only be MQM to bring resolution against other traitors? Are others not Pakistanis enough to do so? When is Baluchistan assembly passing a resolution against Akbar Bugti, murderer of security forces and the man involved in a war against the state? What political agenda, according to your earlier arguments, prevents them from doing so? You answer everything but the question. Of course, there's a distinction clearly made between son of soils and immigrants.


Had they did, there would have been no resolution in assemblies and no widespread condemnation, that is the point. You clearly have more interest and an obsession with the word crying and typing without reading hence the persistent failure in understanding what is being said.

@Oscar How does pretending that there's no problem and then becoming a part of it work for most people of Pakistan?

MQM is involved in 80 % of crimes in Karachi. RAW help to MQM is getting more evident. Finally biggest city was destroyed by this party.

 

[IrbiS]

There's no victim card being played, there's a genuine problem at hand where a few are traitors while the rest can get away with almost anything. Both are interlinked.

Really? So political parties in assemblies never could find a single political agenda to speak against other traitors? What sort of lame argument are you giving me under the "simple as that" tag here? Explain to me, in simple words, why Altaf Hussain is a traitor and Akbar Bugti, Munawwar Hasan, Khwaja Asif, Imran Khan plus dozens others aren't despite speaking in more or less the same manner and some of them even involved in waging a war against the state? Its just a democratic process to forgive the sinister mistakes of the sons of soils?

I know very well, the reason for everyone being against MQM, they are at an evolutionary disadvantage being not living here for some hundreds of years.



Why does it always work best for them to stay silent when others are found guilty of the same, mate? Is there something that I don't understand about politics? This is a diplomatic answer and I am not looking for one.

It's me who doesn't know anything about politics actually. MQM would have registered condemnation in other assemblies if it were there, but they aren't and they never wanted because Karachi was enough for their greed but killing innocent Pakistanis, is simply too much whether it's them or noora league and ppp too and simply unacceptable

 

[TankMan]

No, hurdles like raiding the zonal offices and even the head office of MQM, arresting members and supporters indiscriminately and charging them with make believe crimes. Harassing party workers and supporters and their families, running a media trial with production of 'confessions' from convicted felons hours before execution and general campaigns against MQM making it to be terrorist, anti-state, RAW and India sponsored organization and what not.......

The few hundred weapons found inside nine-zero were make believe?
Rao Anwar held his press conference after the NA 246 election.

As for ''Media trial'', that is what happens when there's a free media and a political party whose leader doesn't think before he speaks and is involved in countless crimes. That's what happens anywhere in the world. Criticism from people on the media doesn't make it a conspiracy.

MQM opposition such as IK and perhaps even JI!

If you don't want opposition go to North Korea and join Kim Jong's party. Otherwise you'll have opposition, no point being upset about it.

Known to be target killers is the catch phrase here, how are they so 'known'? Because of fake FIR's and media trials and 'confessions' under torture and so on. Not just that, even the convictions were in absentia.....I mean who would want to appear in a court when the LEAs are engineering the whole case with false evidence and fake witnesses? Can you imagine that a witness failed to identify Faisal Mota in 1 of the cases and yet the very next day some other witness identified him in an unrelated case over 15 years ago.......I mean I am unable to recognize friends whom I haven't met in 15 years and this guy recognizes a person who must have been a blur in a shoot and scoot thing.

Faisal Mota's lawyers are arguing the in absentia point, otherwise as for ''fake FIRs'' and ''fake witnesses'' it's just your word against the LEAs'.
It doesn't help that investigating officers and witnesses willing to testify against MQM-affiliated criminals tend to get murdered a lot.

I am pleasantly surprised that you do not believe in the RAW conspiracy, however you are still playing in the hands of the manipulators as even though you do not believe in alleged evidence 'A' you still believe in alleged evidence 'B' of the weapons being illegal.

First of all, licenses were provided for all weapons to the LEA's, they were able to confirm licenses of many of the weapons but were unable to verify about 30 odd licenses for the prohibited bore weapons so let me ask you something, have you ever read anyone that someone was killed in a target killing incident with a Sniper Rifle? Or an automatic Assault Rifle? Apparently these are the weapons for which licenses are yet to be verified.......yet all the weapons recovered are still considered to be 'illegal'.....that is a win for the LEA's who want to malign MQM.

Suppressed SMGs are illegal in most of the world. Of course, in Pakistan, MQM might have bent the rules and gotten licences for some of them, but that doesn't make it legal. And yes, I have heard of many targeted killings with automatic and semi automatic weapons.

The fact that you think half of Pakistan is a 'manipulator' shows how effective whatever brainwash they feed you people really is.

That is a funny question actually, do you even know what a physical remand is? The question is funny because apparently you think that hardened criminals and target killers suddenly grow a conscience in the presence of LEAs and confess to all their crimes. Your question is actually very funny.

This is an idiotic response. Do you think criminals actually have any allegiance to anyone? If they were given incentives by LEAs, or in the case of Saulat, close to a death penalty, they would confess without any hesitations. Even if these particular criminals were the most loyal people, criminals around the world confess in the presence of LEAs, no matter how ''hardened'' they are. It depends on a variety of factors, and yes, conscience is a part of it. Guilt is human psychology. Even 'hardened' serial killers have confessed.

You think you know a lot but really you have absolutely no clue what you're talking about.

Don't you still understand that despite winning 90% of seats from Karachi and Hyderabad, MQM is still unable to govern either or even able to serve as all administration and finance is in the hands of the CM? MQM and Karachi are losers despite winning 90% of the seats. So both MQM and Karachi have been without power for a very very long time.

90% of seats from Karachi isn't enough because that's not where the majority of constituencies are - that's how a democracy works. That's the challenge for MQM, if they can drop their ethnic card and win votes in other parts of the country, i.e become a national party instead of being limited to a specific ethnic group in specific areas.

The division is spreading, a few decades ago there was hardly any ethnic problem or violence. Today everything is ethnic. This needs to stop and the only means to stop is to eliminate the feeling of isolation and depravity. Establishment is not racist or fascist or evil, their leaders can sometimes be short visioned and thus take the institutions in a particular direction which they may believe to be of the best option.....but well, we aren't getting any better, are we?

Ethnic divides existed before, '71 was the climax; enemies have taken advantage of it before, and they can do so again.
Civilian leaders can be equally short sighted and improvident - yes, we aren't getting any better.

 

[Spring Onion]

MQM isn't my beloved though I wish to know the reason for selective treatment. Why should it only be MQM to bring resolution against other traitors? Are others not Pakistanis enough to do so? When is Baluchistan assembly passing a resolution against Akbar Bugti, murderer of security forces and the man involved in a war against the state? What political agenda, according to your earlier arguments, prevents them from doing so? You answer everything but the question. Of course, there's a distinction clearly made between son of soils and immigrants.

1. you are asking for reasons from the wrong side because we Common Pakistanis are not responsible for it neither answerable since we Common Pakistanis consider Bugti as much a bigger traitor, we common Pakistanis consider Bacha Khan as much a traitor. you must ask the political parties instead of blaming Pakistan.

2. Secondly its not that only MQM should be bringing such resolution the fact is if no one is bringing any such then what is MQM doing?

3. Since MQM had been supporting all those traitors one way or the other hence it never had the courage to bring any such resolution so your defending MQM here is based on weak foundation.

Had they did, there would have been no resolution in assemblies and no widespread condemnation, that is the point. You clearly have more interest and an obsession with the word crying and typing without reading hence the persistent failure in understanding what is being said.

You are clinging on straws

@Oscar How does pretending that there's no problem and then becoming a part of it work for most people of Pakistan?

So your biggest refuge is Oscar here ?

NVM

 

[SQ8]

Had they did, there would have been no resolution in assemblies and no widespread condemnation, that is the point. You clearly have more interest and an obsession with the word crying and typing without reading hence the persistent failure in understanding what is being said.

@Oscar How does pretending that there's no problem and then becoming a part of it work for most people of Pakistan?

It works for all ethnicities in Pakistan. They went "blind" to the BD problem....to the Balochistan problem, d they will go blind to this problem. Eventually the country will shatter , but the selective filters will not recede after a period of crocodile tear based mourning and blaming of the part of the population that broke away.

Essentially, the Breakup of East Pakistan was the bangalis fault, and the constant ills of Balochistan will be the balochis fault.. and then so on and so forth. Till it will be only Punjab and KP.. after which sections of KP will be hell or break away.. and it well be their fault...and so on..

As they say "Allah Allah, Khair Sallah".

 

[Secur]

1. you are asking for reasons from the wrong side because we Common Pakistanis are not responsible for it neither answerable since we Common Pakistanis consider Bugti as much a bigger traitor, we common Pakistanis consider Bacha Khan as much a traitor. you must ask the political parties instead of blaming Pakistan.

2. Secondly its not that only MQM should be bringing such resolution the fact is if no one is bringing any such then what is MQM doing?

3. Since MQM had been supporting all those traitors one way or the other hence it never had the courage to bring any such resolution so your defending MQM here is based on weak foundation.

You are clinging on straws

So your biggest refuge is Oscar here ?

NVM

No, I don't believe that I am asking for reason from the wrong side, since I have seen the levels of condemnation from the general public for both Bacha Khan and Akbar Bugti. I have seen the apologetic attitude by the masses on supposedly wrong treatment meted out by the state against both. And I have seen the support for the nationalists in different province and their language against other races. I have seen the support of the religious crowd for Taliban leaders and JI/JUI-F chief. You and we are no representative of common Pakistani here, we are just one percent of it which can distinguish right and wrong due to high literacy rate. The rest, well lets say that even sheep display better judgement and ability to think. Please take this idealism elsewhere, because no such thing exists in the real world. The political parties come from the same public, they aren't arriving from another planet, as far as they are concerned they don't see the need to prosecute and bring condemnation upon a "son of soil" hence the majority of traitors don't even get recognized and let alone be condemned by anyone. The public of Pakistan is equally involved in the selective treatment.

MQM has no power to get a resolution of that nature passed from any assembly at all, even the Sindh assembly. You know that well and have implied it in your earlier posts. Why then expect a resolution from the sidelined political party, living practically in political isolation? Why not the rest who can see a reason to condemn MQM but not others?

Really? How?

No, you fail to accept the problem at hand. Zulfiqar Mirza is alive and fine. Even after doing so much, he was in Karachi and yet no Rangers personnel apprehended him.

Refuge? Lol Are we so desperate to score brownie points now? That was meant for a separate post but got added up with my reply to your post.

 

[Zarvan]

No, I don't believe that I am asking for reason from the wrong side, since I have seen the levels of condemnation from the general public for both Bacha Khan and Akbar Bugti. I have seen the apologetic attitude by the masses on supposedly wrong treatment meted out by the state against both. And I have seen the support for the nationalists in different province and their language against other races. I have seen the support of the religious crowd for Taliban leaders and JI/JUI-F chief. You and we are no representative of common Pakistani here, we are just one percent of it which can distinguish right and wrong due to high literacy rate. The rest, well lets say that even sheep display better judgement and ability to think. Please take this idealism elsewhere, because no such thing exists in the real world. The political parties come from the same public, they aren't arriving from another planet, as far as they are concerned they don't see the need to prosecute and bring condemnation upon a "son of soil" hence the majority of traitors don't even get recognized and let alone be condemned by anyone. The public of Pakistan is equally involved in the selective treatment.

MQM has no power to get a resolution of that nature passed from any assembly at all, even the Sindh assembly. You know that well and have implied it in your earlier posts. Why then expect a resolution from the sidelined political party, living practically in political isolation? Why not the rest who can see a reason to condemn MQM but not others?

Really? How?

No, you fail to accept the problem at hand. Zulfiqar Mirza is alive and fine. Even after doing so much, he was in Karachi and yet no Rangers personnel apprehended him.

Refuge? Lol Are we so desperate to score brownie points now? That was meant for a separate post but got added up with my reply to your post.

Bacha Khan who till his death opposed Pakistan and even didn't wanted to be buried in Pakistan Akbar Bugti the moron who proudly claimed he killed first person at the age of 12 just because he didn't liked his face

 

[Spring Onion]

No, I don't believe that I am asking for reason from the wrong side, since I have seen the levels of condemnation from the general public for both Bacha Khan and Akbar Bugti. I have seen the apologetic attitude by the masses on supposedly wrong treatment meted out by the state against both. And I have seen the support for the nationalists in different province and their language against other races. I have seen the support of the religious crowd for Taliban leaders and JI/JUI-F chief. You and we are no representative of common Pakistani here, we are just one percent of it which can distinguish right and wrong due to high literacy rate. The rest, well lets say that even sheep display better judgement and ability to think. Please take this idealism elsewhere, because no such thing exists in the real world. The political parties come from the same public, they aren't arriving from another planet, as far as they are concerned they don't see the need to prosecute and bring condemnation upon a "son of soil" hence the majority of traitors don't even get recognized and let alone be condemned by anyone. The public of Pakistan is equally involved in the selective treatment.

MQM has no power to get a resolution of that nature passed from any assembly at all, even the Sindh assembly. You know that well and have implied it in your earlier posts. Why then expect a resolution from the sidelined political party, living practically in political isolation? Why not the rest who can see a reason to condemn MQM but not others?

Really? How?

No, you fail to accept the problem at hand. Zulfiqar Mirza is alive and fine. Even after doing so much, he was in Karachi and yet no Rangers personnel apprehended him.

Refuge? Lol Are we so desperate to score brownie points now? That was meant for a separate post but got added up with my reply to your post.

1. I dont know where you have seen general public supporting Bugti and Bacha Khan.
2. Where the general public had condemned Altaf more than they condemned Bugti and Bacha Khan?

3. As for the bold part whether it will be passed or not that is another thing the first step is why MQM shy away from bringing any such resolution against other traitors in the first place? it is like accepting defeat without a fight.

4. even if a resolution had been passed against Altaf it does not affect him so why cry river

It works for all ethnicities in Pakistan. They went "blind" to the BD problem....to the Balochistan problem, d they will go blind to this problem. Eventually the country will shatter , but the selective filters will not recede after a period of crocodile tear based mourning and blaming of the part of the population that broke away.

Essentially, the Breakup of East Pakistan was the bangalis fault, and the constant ills of Balochistan will be the balochis fault.. and then so on and so forth. Till it will be only Punjab and KP.. after which sections of KP will be hell or break away.. and it well be their fault...and so on..

As they say "Allah Allah, Khair Sallah".

all this has made MQM a victim ?

 

[Secur]

Bacha Khan who till his death opposed Pakistan and even didn't wanted to be buried in Pakistan Akbar Bugti the moron who proudly claimed he killed first person at the age of 12 just because he didn't liked his face

Yes, that is the point. Nobody has ever brought a resolution of condemnation against them in the assembly. Nor the people of Pakistan feel the need for it. Other traitors even get the airport and trains named after them, this is the level of hypocrisy and biasness in this country.

 

[Samandri]

90 year old Akbar Bugti got brutally got killed by Army, Altaf is alive. Nine zero was just raided, while Dera bugti was subjected to aerial bombarded and shelling (one can check the video on youtube).

Old Bacha Khan spent most of his years in Jail after creation of pakistan on the ground of being traitor, Altaf never tasted Jail and ruled like a mafia king when he was in Pakistan.

They 'occupied' port city in 1947, have best business and job opportunities among all in pakistan yet this 'rona dhona of son of soil'?....if some one call you kala kalota or midget, then i can sympathize with you for being victim of racism but you are asking people to consider fascist and criminal party like MQM to be "dhoodh may dhola howa"................your party MQM is not victim, they are offenders of worst kind

 

[Porus]

Bacha Khan who till his death opposed Pakistan and even didn't wanted to be buried in Pakistan Akbar Bugti the moron who proudly claimed he killed first person at the age of 12 just because he didn't liked his face

Ok! That is what mutala e Pakistan says about him, and here is the reality. Ghaffar Khan was a true son of the soil who fought hard to liberate his own people (Afghans/Pashtuns) from the yoke of the British slavery. He was definitely not a self-proclaimed saviour of all the Muslims of British India, neither he had ever been interested in the communal politics of AIML. He was a down-to-earth Pashtun, well connected with his people and well-aware of their weaknesses and strengths.

He knew that violence, the lack of education and age-old tribal customs and traditions were keeping the Pashtuns backwards. He despised the British forces that were stationed in FATA and hunted the Pashtuns people like wild goats, and knew that they were too strong to get defeated by some rag-tag groups of Pashtun freedom fighters.Therefore, he started his non-violence movement, opened schools and promoted women’s rights. In a sense he was more of a reformer than a run-of-the-mill type politician.

He co-operated with the Congress because just like him they also wanted to get rid of the British Raj, previously his offer of a common struggle was rejected by the AIML. He was not bound by and law, Islamic or otherwise, to support the ideology of AIML. And look what that preposterous ideology has given to you – a perpetual hate between Hindus and Muslims of South Asia. Whatever is going on in urban Sindh is directly linked to that ideologically driven delusion. Those who thrive on hate cannot find peace anywhere in this world.

You own leaders and political party have been badly exposed. MQM and its leaders have become synonyms to killing, racketeering and kidnapping. You can drag the leaders of other people and political parties into this debate and malign them, but it ain’t giving you any solace.