TLP now to be treated as a militant organization

[Arsalan345]

TLP is already declared as a terrorist organization by Pakistani government. Any organization/sect that openly call others Kaffir without any proof (and harm them), should be under government radar.

Government need to promote islamic reformation ( islah ) in the Pakistan, not just educating people about real islam, also eliminating biddat practices, for example Jali Peer, taveesGanday, Jali Aamalo, unIslamic practices on Shrines, etc.

Why young generation is listening to Engineer Baba? They are tired of fake practices in the name of religion, lies of Molvis (Shaitan his Muslim and AbdulQadir Jilani is more powerful than Allah swt), biddat and grave worshiping.

And who is deciding what is biddat and who should go to shrine? Wahhabi terrorist? A self created religion who was made under british and even british accepted that they helped saud family during carnage against ottoman empire. You are nobody to lecture the biggest sect. Yes there are uneducated people in our own sect but you also celebrated and cut the cake of your 150 years completion birthday. Birthday allow in Wahhabi terrorist mullah or na jayz? hahaha Wahhabi calls Shia kafir and it's not a hidden secret. Authorities seized mosque in Belgium. why? because it was funded by Wahhabi terrorists. I mean 60+ terrorist organizations worldwide and now you are preaching about biddat. lol Moulaana abdul qadir jilani is a respectable figure who introduced different aspects including spirituality. Your hate for him clearly shows your understanding of Islam. You are the same people who calls Yazid caliph. I have seen your places here in Pakistan. you are just a drama, a fitna. who created Isis? Please tell me if you are peaceful sect or not because you aren't. Without funding, you are nothing. Saudis still have good relations with Britain because Britain is your father. Read the history. Do you think that you can continue this occupation of saudia forever? This land, Saudia Arabia, it will always remain part of Ottoman empire and they will take it back from you. No regrets.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/asia_pacific/pakistan-red-mosque-taliban/2021/09/24/e6d0c0ec-1b50-11ec-bea8-308ea134594f_story.html

Evidence of Financial Links Between Saudi Royal Family and Al Qaeda

In an attempt to link members of the Saudi royal family to the financing of Al Qaeda, lawyers for Sept. 11 families and their insurers have collected several hundred thousand pages of interview transcripts, government reports, financial records, court testimony and other material. Four of the...

www.nytimes.com

Analyses - Wahhabism | PBS - Saudi Time Bomb? | FRONTLINE | PBS

 

[Verve]

4 fiqhs are approved, these only comprises 25% of the Deen, 75% is same. one can choose anyone of them and it will be ok.

Approved by whom? 4 fiqhs shattered the Ummah in reality. 4 groups praying separately in Masjid Haram is approval of what exactly?

Anyways, what is in these 4 fiqhs that's not already in Quran and Hadith? Why choose any when Quran (with all Urdu and English translations) and All Hadith books are in nearly everyone's access now.

4 fiqhs are divisions in groups on matters on Deen .... again, I refer you to Quran 6:159.

 

[jupiter2007]

And who is deciding what is biddat and who should go to shrine? Wahhabi terrorist? A self created religion who was made under british and even british accepted that they helped saud family during carnage against ottoman empire. You are nobody to lecture the biggest sect. Yes there are uneducated people in our own sect but you also celebrated and cut the cake of your 150 years completion birthday. Birthday allow in Wahhabi terrorist mullah or na jayz? hahaha Wahhabi calls Shia kafir and it's not a hidden secret. Authorities seized mosque in Belgium. why? because it was funded by Wahhabi terrorists. I mean 60+ terrorist organizations worldwide and now you are preaching about biddat. lol Moulaana abdul qadir jilani is a respectable figure who introduced different aspects including spirituality. Your hate for him clearly shows your understanding of Islam. You are the same people who calls Yazid caliph. I have seen your places here in Pakistan. you are just a drama, a fitna. who created Isis? Please tell me if you are peaceful sect or not because you aren't. Without funding, you are nothing. Saudis still have good relations with Britain because Britain is your father. Read the history. Do you think that you can continue this occupation of saudia forever? This land, Saudia Arabia, it will always remain part of Ottoman empire and they will take it back from you. No regrets.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/asia_pacific/pakistan-red-mosque-taliban/2021/09/24/e6d0c0ec-1b50-11ec-bea8-308ea134594f_story.html

Evidence of Financial Links Between Saudi Royal Family and Al Qaeda

In an attempt to link members of the Saudi royal family to the financing of Al Qaeda, lawyers for Sept. 11 families and their insurers have collected several hundred thousand pages of interview transcripts, government reports, financial records, court testimony and other material. Four of the...

www.nytimes.com

Analyses - Wahhabism | PBS - Saudi Time Bomb? | FRONTLINE | PBS

Saudi influences should be reduce in Pakistan and we must have a watchdog organizations who should monitor funding coming from ME countries to Pakistani maddaris. This will eliminate terrorist funding.
As for your RANT, it’s same BS that have heard before, attack the person who talks about reformation in Islam. I blame Deobandi Ulemas for allowing RazaKhani firqa to brainwash people in Pakistan. Had they produced the evidence against RazaKhan, it would have reduced their influence in Pakistan.

 

[Verve]

I blame Deobandi Ulemas for allowing RazaKhani firqa to brainwash people in Pakistan. Had they produced the evidence against RazaKhan, it would have reduced their influence in Pakistan.

Deobandi were too busy with Return Fatwabazi .... have you read Al-Muhannad ala al-Mufannad ?

Deobandi have a real violent streak and they've had it a lot longer than Brelvis.

 

[jupiter2007]

Approved by whom? 4 fiqhs shattered the Ummah in reality. 4 groups praying separately in Masjid Haram is approval of what exactly?

Anyways, what is in these 4 fiqhs that's not already in Quran and Hadith? Why choose any when Quran (with all Urdu and English translations) and All Hadith books are in nearly everyone's access now.

4 fiqhs are divisions in groups on matters on Deen .... again, I refer you to Quran 6:159.

Read the history of Islam and you will know why certain things were done. For example writing of the Quran….syedna usman e ghani (r.a) made mashwara (consultation) with 50,000 shabah Ikram (r.a) regarding writing of the holy Quran.
Why fiqh was created? when there was no clear instructions on certain things in Quran and Hadiths, scholars study Quran, Hadith and life of Shabah (r.a) and gave ruling.
What encouraged Mohammad bin Wahaab, who himself followed Hanafi Mazab, to bring Islamic reformation? Historian have written that Muslims were indulged in Shirk and Biddats practices. women who could not have child, she used go the graves of Ayulia Ikram and rub their private part and make Dua to them to have a child. Certain ruling were given based on these kinds of practices.
We don’t read Islamic history, sirah and Hayatul Sahabah and make stupid comments.

 

[Adecypher]

2. An impoverished country like Pakistan has the responsibility of uplifting the economic status of its people. The Arabs blessed with oil wealth by god could take these responsibilities. There is no need for us to champion religious stuff while our people sleep on a hungry stomach. This namoos e rasalat rhetoric has radicalized an entire generation of Pakistanis. There is a need to take a break from it, rather than the state amplifying it by becoming a party.

I mean with WHAT logic you co-relate a Country's economic health with Namoos e Risalat?

And also care to explain how someone who favors it called radicalized...how can you make such statements as "entire generation of Pakistanis"... Every single Pakistani muslim favors Namoos e Risalat... or supports it IF not vocally or proactively than silently in his/her heart...



I mean if you read the news article above will tell you that a good majority is in favor of it...

5. Yes, secular liberals choke national arteries, make people prisoners in their homes, abduct and torture policemen, burn/damage state/public property in protest (talking about civil society groups).

hmmm... this will refresh your memory a bit:



This is just one example where the instigators are not related to TLP or similar group...what I meant to say that TLP does not own monopoly on "Violent Protests", in the past there are quite a few instances of Political protests being turned violent...

TTP couldn't deliver what its paymasters required it to deliver

What they failed to deliver?

TLP through its violent agitation could make the state surrender and then a chain of events would lead to economic hardships for the country that could not take it anymore. Pakistan would be softened to the extent where it could be denuclearised and balkanized. Once you get hyperinflation, the country would implode.

State will NOT surrender; State will negotiate with TLP successfully and through required due diligence make sure that all required steps would be taken to initiate a debate in Parliament...

6. He could not act against those who brought him. Likes of Asim Bajwa were part of his government. He should not have picked up the fight on the ISI chief either. It has only made his electoral prospects bleaker. with rampant inflation, global challenges in the shape of high commodity prices, and covid 19, he did not need to pick up a fight with the establishment too. He would be discarded now. No civil govt should pick up a fight with the establishment until it begins delivering good governance and develops genuine goodwill for itself within the masses. Turkish model.

Well ONLY time will tell ... Pakistan will NOT withstand another term from ANY of the previous tried and tested corrupts Politicians ...

 

[Arsalan345]

Saudi influences should be reduce in Pakistan and we must have a watchdog organizations who should monitor funding coming from ME countries to Pakistani maddaris. This will eliminate terrorist funding.
As for your RANT, it’s same BS that have heard before, attack the person who talks about reformation in Islam. I blame Deobandi Ulemas for allowing RazaKhani firqa to brainwash people in Pakistan. Had they produced the evidence against RazaKhan, it would have reduced their influence in Pakistan.

i don't care about your deoband ulema. All are terrorists. everyone knows it. How the hell are you to give fatwa? your fatwa has no credibility. Pakistan is not your property. You are just a newbie sect, trying to fund madrassas so that you can influence the world. What evidence? British helped al saud, the biggest fitna maker in history. Do you want me to respect al saud? hahaha Everyone knows how your sect came into being. British helped you and your sect is based on pure hate. British assistance is well known to all and now you are asking deobandis to provide evidence lol.

 

[Zibago]

If civil war start then remember this Khadyani type minister

With TLP you can either have confrontation now or delay it till few years

 

[Verve]

Read the history of Islam and you will know why certain things were done. For example writing of the Quran….syedna usman e ghani (r.a) made mashwara (consultation) with 50,000 shabah Ikram (r.a) regarding writing of the holy Quran.
Why fiqh was created? when there was no clear instructions on certain things in Quran and Hadiths, scholars study Quran, Hadith and life of Shabah (r.a) and gave ruling.
What encouraged Mohammad bin Wahaab, who himself followed Hanafi Mazab, to bring Islamic reformation? Historian have written that Muslims were indulged in Shirk and Biddats practices. women who could not have child, she used go the graves of Ayulia Ikram and rub their private part and make Dua to them to have a child. Certain ruling were given based on these kinds of practices.
We don’t read Islamic history, sirah and Hayatul Sahabah and make stupid comments.

Accurate history is in Hadith books only.

Mohammad bin Wahaab was Ahl-ul-Bayt lover - his sons' names! Whereas those who call themselves Wahabi or Ahle-Hadith are full of bugz for Ahl-ul-Bayt. Irconically they are munkar-e-Hadith as well, just like all others.

4 Fiqhs are division that resulted in a horrible split in Ummah. Allah repeats 4 times in Quran that this Book is made easy for guidance yet every group tells it's follower not to study Quran directly - Shaitan wouldn't be happier! So I don't buy this 'no clear instruction on certain things in Quran and Hadith'. There are no excuses for those who can read and reflect as almost all Quran translation and Hadith books are at our finger tips in one mobile app. Change is coming and all these fiqhs and sects will die.

 

[Mentee]

There are no excuses for those who can read and reflect as almost all Quran translation and Hadith books are at our finger tips in one mobile app. Change is coming and all these fiqhs and sects will die.

They leave the muhkum and fight over mutashaabihaat like jews and Christians.


"No no no these verses are addressing the jews and Christians not us , how can we ever err when my grand daddy was a saint so was his grand daddy ."

Pride always has a fall.

Accurate history is in Hadith books only.

"Yeah but I only find my opinion to have its origin in the mind of greatness. We gonna save and implement Islam , we paaki muslims and we are inevitable for the greater good , we gonna tell Allah Swt that we gonna do this and that for you in such and such ideal situation "


Seriously!!! They gonna tell Allah Swt and not accept and do their best in those circumstances where their Lord has placed them?

 

[Verve]

They leave the muhkum and fight over mutashaabihaat like jews and Christians.


"No no no these verses are addressing the jews and Christians not us , how can we ever err when my grand daddy was a saint so was his grand daddy ."

Pride always has a fall.

+1

Re Riba ... Is it just the state at fault here or those borrowing on interest as well to start/expand a business or buy something? Is it the state's responsibility in Islam to give interest free loans?

I rent in UK instead of taking up a mortgage, content with it as I know I'm compliant with hadith.

Hadith is crystal clear:

صحیح مسلم
کتاب: کھیتی باڑی کا بیان
باب: سود کھانے اور کھلانے والے پر لعنت کے بیان میں
حدیث نمبر: 4093

حَدَّثَنَا مُحَمَّدُ بْنُ الصَّبَّاحِ وَزُهَيْرُ بْنُ حَرْبٍ وَعُثْمَانُ بْنُ أَبِي شَيْبَةَ قَالُوا حَدَّثَنَا هُشَيْمٌ أَخْبَرَنَا أَبُو الزُّبَيْرِ عَنْ جَابِرٍ قَالَ لَعَنَ رَسُولُ اللَّهِ صَلَّی اللَّهُ عَلَيْهِ وَسَلَّمَ آکِلَ الرِّبَا وَمُؤْکِلَهُ وَکَاتِبَهُ وَشَاهِدَيْهِ وَقَالَ هُمْ سَوَائٌ

ترجمہ:
محمد بن صباح، زہیر بن حرب، عثمان بن ابی شیبہ، ہشیم، ابوزبیر، حضرت جابر ؓ سے روایت ہے کہ رسول اللہ ﷺ نے سود کھانے والے اور کھلانے والے، سود لکھنے والے اور اس کی گواہی دینے والوں پر لعنت فرمائی اور ارشاد فرمایا یہ سب گناہ میں برابر شریک ہیں۔

Translation:
Jabir said that Allahs Messenger ﷺ cursed the accepter of interest and its payer, and one who records it, and the two witnesses, and he said: They are all equal.

 

[Xestan]

Wait, did the Government just enter into a secret deal with "militant" Indian funded organisation after it killed 7 policemen, damaged public property and blocked highways?

 

[Verve]

Interest is just rent of using someone else's money. If interest is haram then giving property on rent is also haram phir hotels hostels etc sab band krdo sab haram ha

Your comment is so ridiculous that I don't want to waste any more time in replying. 'Interest is just rent' and you pay some sort of rent on your credit cards and other loan agreements that specifically state 'interest' instead of 'rent'

 

[Mentee]

Is it just the state at fault here or those borrowing on interest as well to start/expand a business or buy something? Is it the state's responsibility in Islam to give interest free loans?

All are guilty but the primary responsibility lies with the head of the state given/enjoying dominion. There are evils regarding which no leniency can be shown and riba and sorcery falls in that category.

 

[Verve]

All are guilty but the primary responsibility lies with the head of the state given/enjoying dominion. There are evils regarding which no leniency can be shown and riba and sorcery falls in that category.

At least this head of the state is issuing interest free loans under Kamyab Jawan programme and giving large funding to Akhuwat for interest free loans. You must appreciate the work that is being done at least, even if it is not enough. Conventional banks would shut down if government enforced interest free policy so alternatives need to be worked on and are being worked on. It will take time.