Timur's invasion of India, 1398 : Kings & Generals

[masterchief_mirza]

You sure he surprassed Genghis? what makes you say that? because Genghis Khan had a bench strength of capable generals? Genghis was also nobility...though fallen nobility barely scraping by before his ascension

Timur apparently styled himself on Genghis and yes, I think he did surpass Genghis certainly for his successes against Indian Muslim rulers and also against Mamelukes and Turks at the time. I don't think Genghis or his sons had such victories against as many highly advanced and civilised enemies as Timur did. Granted, their direction of conquest was different and we can never know how far Genghis' armies would have gone into Europe at the time when Genghis suddenly died, but Timur on paper was undefeated and inflicted defeat on more organised and advanced opponents than Genghis. That's just my opinion but you're welcome to differ.

 

[Baybars Han]

Hunas, Scythians and a huge chunk of Kushans did become Hindu...anyways LoL at Timur...the man who singlehandedly killed more Muslims than all of the CRusades combined...raped the Queen of Ottoman Sultan Bayezid...defeated 4 Muslim superpowers and never took out any Hindu,Christian or Chinese power

raped Ottoman queen? is that what they teach you in indian schools? Unfortunately Timur had to defeat Muslim armies to get stronger and to be the most powerful. He respected Bayezid for defeating massive crusader armies, however, they both knew that there can only be one supreme ruler in the world.

 

[masterchief_mirza]

He reasserted the Mongol control over Russians and burned Moscow allying with the Mongol Prince Tokhtamysh in 1382.

He wasn't strictly "Mongol". He was not descended from Genghis and he was rather turkic-Mongol. He did model his ambitions on Genghis and sought to restore the entirety of the original Mongol empire under his name. He allied with true Mongol descendants, including those in the Golden Horde who overran Moscow.

 

[Juggernaut_Flat_Plane_V8]

raped Ottoman queen? is that what they teach you in indian schools? Unfortunately Timur had to defeat Muslim armies to get stronger and to be the most powerful. He respected Bayezid for defeating massive crusader armies, however, they both knew that there can only be one supreme ruler in the world.

Olivera Despina was forced to serve naked to Taimur in front of her husband as far as I remember...this is well known in world history...no nothing about this was taught in Indian schools

 

[Baybars Han]

Timur apparently styled himself on Genghis and yes, I think he did surpass Genghis certainly for his successes against Indian Muslim rulers and also against Mamelukes and Turks at the time. I don't think Genghis or his sons had such victories against as many highly advanced and civilised enemies as Timur did. Granted, their direction of conquest was different and we can never know how far Genghis' armies would have gone into Europe at the time when Genghis suddenly died, but Timur on paper was undefeated and inflicted defeat on more organised and advanced opponents than Genghis. That's just my opinion but you're welcome to differ.

Harzemsahs or Kwarzems was very powerful, Mongols defeated them and other very powerful armies or empires. Seljuks was in absolute turmoil, broken into parts, Mameluks was powerful but Mongols got defeated. Mongols did go all the way to europe and would have smashed through if they were united or the Khan didnt die and had to return. Europeons were not as powerful as most empires Mongols went through at the time.

 

[Naofumi]

Timur apparently styled himself on Genghis and yes, I think he did surpass Genghis certainly for his successes against Indian Muslim rulers and also against Mamelukes and Turks at the time. I don't think Genghis or his sons had such victories against as many highly advanced and civilised enemies as Timur did. Granted, their direction of conquest was different and we can never know how far Genghis' armies would have gone into Europe at the time when Genghis suddenly died, but Timur on paper was undefeated and inflicted defeat on more organised and advanced opponents than Genghis. That's just my opinion but you're welcome to differ.

Genghis extinguished more mightier empire than Timur starting from Khwazremian to the China, and Anatolian Seljuks surrendered to Mongols later too, not to mention the advances towards Volga. Especially conquest of China makes him the better one and he consolidated his control to administer the territories not simply looted them.

 

[Baybars Han]

He wasn't strictly "Mongol". He was not descended from Genghis and he was rather turkic-Mongol. He did model his ambitions on Genghis and sought to restore the entirety of the original Mongol empire under his name. He allied with true Mongol descendants, including those in the Golden Horde who overran Moscow.

He had to use that for political ambition to gather support and be seen as a succesor. However, it is definitely debatable who was greater, Gengiz or Timur.

 

[Naofumi]

He wasn't strictly "Mongol". He was not descended from Genghis and he was rather turkic-Mongol. He did model his ambitions on Genghis and sought to restore the entirety of the original Mongol empire under his name. He allied with true Mongol descendants, including those in the Golden Horde who overran Moscow.

He was from Barlas clan, originally came from the Mongolia and Turkicized after settling in Chagatai region.

Barlas shared distant ancestry with Borjigin.

 

[bluesky]

The Mongols did actually invade India but were defeated by the Khaljis. Yes, Allauddin Khalji (Ranveer Singh).

There were Mongol invasions of India also during the time when Ghiyasuddin Balban was the Sultan (reign: 1266 -1287). His eldest son Muhammad was killed in the fighting with Mongols.

He called back his second son, Bogra Khan from Bengal, but he detasted Delhi politics and weather and returned to Bengal. This Bogra Khan's descendant Muhammad Ali Bogra became the PM of Pakistan in 1950s.

As a matter of fact Mongol invasion continued for a few centuries during the Muslim rule. Settler Muslim ruling class and their retinues from Central Asia were quite organised, strong and brave. They repulsed many invasions that could not have been undertaken by the pre-Muslim Hindus of India.

Hindus were no match to those cruel and barbarian Mongols, Muslim or not. Even then, that Mongol-Turkic Timur had defeated the weakened Muslim power in Delhi.

 

[masterchief_mirza]

Harzemsahs or Kwarzems was very powerful, Mongols defeated them and other very powerful armies or empires. Seljuks was in absolute turmoil, broken into parts, Mameluks was powerful but Mongols got defeated. Mongols did go all the way to europe and would have smashed through if they were united or the Khan didnt die and had to return. Europeons were not as powerful as most empires Mongols went through at the time.

Good point. Central Asia, the Caucasus, the middle east and China were the proving grounds of world power at that time. I completely agree. Hence, Timur's achievements surpass Genghis's.

 

[Pakistani Fighter]

Shame on Timur for killing the Muslims

 

[Gandhi G in da house]

Shame on Timur for killing the Muslims

Proud of him for killing Non- Muslims ?

 

[Naofumi]

Shame on Timur for killing the Muslims

In Delhi, he massacred everyone except Syeds. He leaved your ancestors unharmed (you're Syed na?).

 

[Naofumi]

He didn't massacre anyone's ancestors. Because massacred people can't reproduce

They may be already parents, no?

 

[masterchief_mirza]

Shame on Timur for killing the Muslims

Again, who else was he supposed to kill? There is no point judging the guy through some distorted prism of temporal relativism. He had to kill Muslims because that was his path of conquest.

Timur's justifications for establishment of cassus belli were interesting at times. He regarded himself as a ghazi of sorts, warring against Muslim rulers whom he declared too sedate and not expansionist enough or ambitious enough.

One invasion of the Indian subcontinent was justified by Timur because the local Tughlaq Muslim rulers were too lenient on Hindu subjects.

"For instance, when he was about to invade India, he declared that the Tughlaq rulers of that country were tolerant to Hinduism and therefore it was obligatory on Taimur’s army to punish them. What he achieved in the two years of his Indian adventure was a holocaust of the Indian population in Northern India, irrespective of religion. "