The Indian Ocean riposte (Stunning news about the S3 & S4 & S4*)

[RISING SUN]

Sources? The article discusses just 6 SSN and 4 SSBN.

"the Cabinet Committee on Security (CCS) formally cleared India's single-largest defence project: a joint Defence Research and Development Organisation (DRDO)-Bhabha Atomic Research Centre (BARC)-Navy project to build six nuclear-powered attack submarines or SSNs"

"The INS Arihant or the S2, the first of a class of four 6,000-tonne ballistic missile submarines, recently began her sea trials in Visakhapatnam."

You don't suppose by the time those 6 SSN are built that the leased SSNs will be let go. I.e. overcounting?


You don't want your SSBN anywhere near your CBG, lest its location can be tracked.

If you see the initial pic in first post, its clearly mentioned three ten thousand tone boomer with long range K series missile with MIRV capability. It was earlier mentioned also but people missed/forgot it. And yes boomer don't go with CBG, at least as per my knowledge.

 

[SuperSubrayan]

I dont think M777 project is completly shelved. Still possibilities are there.

By now cost of the deal increased i guess. They were already warning about cost escalation and there fore new process needed to be followed which will again delay due to new set of bargain have to take place. Remember we want them to shift production line to India .

 

[RISING SUN]

Is there any govt. source or is this 10k sub is a myth by india today

Its certainly double weight. Only doubt was on the numbers to be built. That too now confirmed.

 

[Kinetic]

Our boomers will never carry any Agni series missile, ever.

yes they will. Agni-6 is land as well as submarine based missile. That info was accidentally released by DRDO.


India developing 6000 km range Agni-6 SLBM with MIRV

 

[RISING SUN]

You might be right. Jane said CCS cleared 6 SSBN, but this article says it was 6 SSN.

But the article also says development of K5 Misile which will require a new class of SSBN to carry them since they will not fit into the Arihant class.

About the Akula-II Lease, it is likely that the lease will be extended rather than let go. IN and GoI has that option available to them on the contract.

But consider the worst case scenario, IN will have 10 Nuclear submarines, at Best case scenario, IN will have 17.

In best case scenario, we will have 18 nuke subs by 2028.

 

[The_Sidewinder]

By now cost of the deal increased i guess. They were already warning about cost escalation and there fore new process needed to be followed which will again delay due to new set of bargain have to take place. Remember we want them to shift production line to India .

True that. But decision lies with MoD & FM. I dont think there are any replacements to those M777 howitzers, for the time being atleast.

By the way, nice to see in your new avatar.

 

[SuperSubrayan]

True that. But decision lies with MoD & FM. I dont think there are any replacements to those M777 howitzers, for the time being atleast.

By the way, nice to see in your new avatar.

Don't belive in rumours
M777 or not we will have 800+ new guns

 

[RISING SUN]

The S-5 SSBN would easily be around 20,000 tons. I have info that says it shares some similarities with
the cancelled Soviet Delta-IV class SSBN...no. of silos is not confirmed, but minimum is 12, as is stated in the article.
We are unlikely to go for more than 3 of these full-fledged SSBNs.

After those 3 dedicated SSBNs (each armed with atleast 12 x of the advanced K-5 Submarine-Launched
Ballistic Missiles (SLBMs). The K-5 is gonna be a beast, having an intercontinental reach of around 6,500 kms,
with each missile having atleast 3-6 MIRVed nuclear warheads (and decoys), with a maximum payload
capacity of 2 tons...which is quite terrific....and it can manage 6500km with a full 2-ton payload, which means
in actual conditions (where decoy warheads will be included), it's operational reach could be much higher. But
don't take my word for it. On top of all these raw specs, it'g gonna have all our latest advancements in navigation,
fiber-optics, space-based comms, propulsion and composite materials) are commissioned, the existing 3 Arihants
would be converted to SSGNs, each can be armed with 20 x Nirbhay SLCMs (in the silos alone) as well as
BrahMos-NG or other subsonic ASCMs.

The real hunter-killers, the SSNs, would easily be procured in numbers totaling well over a dozen (upto 18 boats is possible) in due course of time...although 6 subs seems to be the first step.

--

All this, in addition to our procurement of conventional attack submarines.

S5 & S6 are confirmed at 10,000 tonnes. Number of silos I am doubtful on this. I have also heard the similarity with Akula as well as Delta class SSBNs but that is it. Our target is to put mejority of warheads in SSBNs on station, rest you can speculate. And three SSNs are follow on scheduled after first six boats.

 

[Abingdonboy]

By now cost of the deal increased i guess. They were already warning about cost escalation and there fore new process needed to be followed which will again delay due to new set of bargain have to take place. Remember we want them to shift production line to India .

BAE has offered to set up the M777 production line in India which the GoI should take with both hands and start pumping out those beasts ASAP.

True that. But decision lies with MoD & FM. I dont think there are any replacements to those M777 howitzers, for the time being atleast.

The deal isn't dead at all, talks are going on between the GoI/MoD and BAE and fingers crossed we will see something positive soon because there is no way any Indian product exists (or will do for at least a decade) on par with the M777.

M777 or not we will have 800+ new guns

The IA requires 4,000-5000++ by 2020 of all types (MGS, towed, ULH etc)- 800 is nowhere near enough.

 

[The_Sidewinder]

Don't belive in rumours
M777 or not we will have 800+ new' guns

814 to be precise.



Yeah, I shouldnt.

 

[SuperSubrayan]

BAE has offered to set up the M777 production line in India which the GoI should take with both hands and start pumping out those beasts ASAP.



The deal isn't dead at all, talks are going on between the GoI/MoD and BAE and fingers crossed we will see something positive soon because there is no way any Indian product exists (or will do for at least a decade) on par with the M777.

The IA requires 4,000-5000++ by 2020 of all types (MGS, towed, ULH etc)- 800 is nowhere near enough.

4000 - 5000 ? By 2020 how It's even possible .

814 to be precise.



Yeah, I shouldnt.

 

[The_Sidewinder]

BAE has offered to set up the M777 production line in India which the GoI should take with both hands and start pumping out those beasts ASAP.



The deal isn't dead at all, talks are going on between the GoI/MoD and BAE and fingers crossed we will see something positive soon because there is no way any Indian product exists (or will do for at least a decade) on par with the M777.

The IA requires 4,000-5000++ by 2020 of all types (MGS, towed, ULH etc)- 800 is nowhere near enough.

Couldnt have agreed more mate. With each passing day, I am becoming more & more pleased by this new govt & defence ministry. Thank god for not wasting our votes.

Salvation at last.

 

[Abingdonboy]

4000 - 5000 ? By 2020 how It's even possible .

Well the deals need to be signed soon (basically now) and get into mass production ASAP, I don't see the target being met mind you but if production can at least be started within the next few years there won't be a huge problem. HOWEVER should more indecision take place with a further lack of orders between now and 2020 then the IA is in deep, DEEP sh!t

 

[SuperSubrayan]

Well the deals need to be signed soon (basically now) and get into mass production ASAP, I don't see the target being met mind you but if production can at least be started within the next few years there won't be a huge problem. HOWEVER should more indecision take place with a further lack of orders between now and 2020 then the IA is in deep, DEEP sh!t

Yeah. It's bad.... But don't worry the best estimate places the army's towed artillery capabilities at more than 4,000 pieces. In addition to the towed artillery, the army has self-propelled artillery.

The 105 mm Indian and Light Field Guns (IFG/LFG) were being replaced by 130mm M-46 Field Gun. About 200 of the M-46 guns are purchased each year to replace the 105mm IFG/LFG. Nearly 500 of the M-46 guns were earmarked for upgrade to the 155mm/39-caliber and 155mm/45-caliber by Soltam Systems Ltd. of Israel. But the attempt to upgrade the Russian-supplied 130MM guns to 155MM calibre has been ridden with failures. By early 2009 approximately 180 pieces of 130mm M46 Russian medium guns had been successfully "up-gunned" to 155mm calibre with ordnance supplied by Soltam of Israel. The new barrel length of 45 calibre enhanced the range of the gun to about 40 km with extended range ammunition.

And this is our requirements ... WE CAN MANAGE WITH CURRENT AND PLANNED FUTURE REQUIREMENTS :

The modernisation plan of tube artillery alone is likely to cost Rs 13,000 crores, or USD 3 billion-plus, going possibly to $ 4 billion. The major acquisitions will be of the initial lots of 400 towed howitzers of 155mm calibre, with a barrel length of 52 calibre, costing about Rs 4,000 crore, 140 ultra-light weight 155mm towed howitzers, with a barrel length of 45 calibre, costing Rs 3,000 crore and 180-185 wheeled SP 155mm howitzers costing Rs 5,000 crore. Another account states that the the total deal for 400 guns expected to be in the region of $2 billion. Of these, 140 guns will be of the ultra-light category, 185 of the wheeled version and the balance 175 of the towed version.

So 814 howitzer will add more power to our Artillery Regiments !

Finger crossed . We could sign M777 ASAP !!! For our Mountain Corp . Which is been raised specially for our Eastern Neighbour

 

[Abingdonboy]

Yeah. It's bad.... But don't worry the best estimate places the army's towed artillery capabilities at more than 4,000 pieces. In addition to the towed artillery, the army has self-propelled artillery.

The 105 mm Indian and Light Field Guns (IFG/LFG) were being replaced by 130mm M-46 Field Gun. About 200 of the M-46 guns are purchased each year to replace the 105mm IFG/LFG. Nearly 500 of the M-46 guns were earmarked for upgrade to the 155mm/39-caliber and 155mm/45-caliber by Soltam Systems Ltd. of Israel. But the attempt to upgrade the Russian-supplied 130MM guns to 155MM calibre has been ridden with failures. By early 2009 approximately 180 pieces of 130mm M46 Russian medium guns had been successfully "up-gunned" to 155mm calibre with ordnance supplied by Soltam of Israel. The new barrel length of 45 calibre enhanced the range of the gun to about 40 km with extended range ammunition.

And this is our requirements ... WE CAN MANAGE WITH CURRENT AND PLANNED FUTURE REQUIREMENTS :

The modernisation plan of tube artillery alone is likely to cost Rs 13,000 crores, or USD 3 billion-plus, going possibly to $ 4 billion. The major acquisitions will be of the initial lots of 400 towed howitzers of 155mm calibre, with a barrel length of 52 calibre, costing about Rs 4,000 crore, 140 ultra-light weight 155mm towed howitzers, with a barrel length of 45 calibre, costing Rs 3,000 crore and 180-185 wheeled SP 155mm howitzers costing Rs 5,000 crore. Another account states that the the total deal for 400 guns expected to be in the region of $2 billion. Of these, 140 guns will be of the ultra-light category, 185 of the wheeled version and the balance 175 of the towed version.

So 814 howitzer will add more power to our Artillery Regiments !

Finger crossed . We could sign M777 ASAP !!! For our Mountain Corp . Which is been raised specially for our Eastern Neighbour

Basically every arty gun in service today either needs to be replaced or up-gunned and upgraded within the next few years along with a vast amount of new guns (of all kinds) being inducted.

The arty arm, thanks to the shadow of Bofors, is in a real real mess (on the tube side, the rocket side is pretty decent) but I am pretty hopeful that the next few years will see a revival of the arty regiment's fortunes.

Let's just hope the new DM is pushing hard to get these arty deals cleared.