The ground under Hasina's feet is shifting: Hindustan Times

[fallstuff]

Religious trash talking is a bad idea from any side, you can dish it out anyway short of violent threats.

 

[SMX 3.0]

Lets go for a fight on religious matter! Lets us both learn new things today.

Maybe you misunderstood why muslims protested, lets clearify. Only because you tolarate mockery on Jesus, dont expect us to do the same.

I am not interested in religious mudslinging. BTW, I don't understand the protests given that Muslim scriptures criticize & even make derogatory remarks on non believers including Christians, Jews & Polytheists.

Maybe remove the beam out of your own eye first??

And you can always quote the Bible, no problems with that. BTW, Jesus did call a twelve year old "little girl".

 

[Rushd Alam]

You really really don't want to get into religious fights. You might have heard about the recent Nupur Sharma controversy, surely every non-Muslim who heard of it googled to confirm whether her statements were true. And guess what they found??

Nupur Sharma said our prophet(sm) to meet his sexual hunger married 9 year old Ayesha(as).

So what do you think muslims had a problem with, Ayesha being 9 year old or saying prophet (sm) because of lust for young girls married his wife.

Ayesha (ra)being 9 year is from muslim sources and still under islamic sharia you can marry a pubescent girl. Its only in last 100 years law was put in to get girls married at older age. Most of our grandparents got married at early ages that never made them a pedophile, that was the norm then and still girls can get married at 14 in Alaska USA.

As you are a christian, you should now Marry(as) mother of Jesus(as) was 12 when he gave birth to him. Rebecca is the wife Issac(as) she was 3 years old when she was married.

These sort of comments on character we cant tolarate about our family even forget our beloved prophet.

 

[Rushd Alam]

I am not interested in religious mudslinging. BTW, I don't understand the protests given that Muslim scriptures criticize & even make derogatory remarks on non believers including Christians, Jews & Polytheists.

Maybe remove the beam out of your own eye first??

And you can always quote the Bible, no problems with that. BTW, Jesus did call a twelve year old "little girl".

Have you read what muslim scriptures say? Why dont you read it first. Dont go by comments made by islam haters, read objectively, it adresses christians and jews by people of the book and ask them to come to path of truth.

Lets look at jewish and christian traditions

Jewish scholars and rabbis strongly discouraged marriages before the onset of puberty,[30] but at the same time, in exceptional cases, girls ages 3 through 12 (the legal age of consent according to halakha) might be given in marriage by her father.[49][50] By Judaism, the minimal girl age, for marriage, was 12 years and one day, "na'arah", as mentioned in the ancient Talmud Mishnah books (compiled between 536 BCE – 70 CE, redacted in the 3rd century CE), Order Nashim Masechet Kiddushin 41 a & b.[51]

According to halakha, girls should not marry until they are 12 years and six months old, "bogeret".[52][53] Although Moses Maimonides mentions in the Talmud Mishneh Torah (compiled between 1170 and 1180 CE) that in exceptional cases girls ages 3 through 12 might be given in marriage by her father,[49][54] he also clarifies in verse 3:19 of the same chapter that: "Although a father has the option of consecrating his daughter to anyone he desires while she is a minor or while she is a maiden, it is not proper for him to act in this manner."[55]

According to the 1907 Catholic Encyclopedia, apocryphal accounts that, at the time of her betrothal to Joseph, Mary, the mother of Jesus, was 12–14 years old.[56]

Historically within the Catholic Church, prior to the 1917 Code of Canon Law, the minimum age for a dissoluble betrothal (sponsalia de futuro) was seven years in the contractees. The minimum age for a valid marriage was puberty, or nominally 14 for males and 12 for females.[57] The 1917 Code of Canon Law raised the minimum age for a valid marriage at 16 for males and 14 for females.[58] The 1983 Code of Canon Law maintained the minimum age for a valid marriage at 16 for males and 14 for females.[59]: c. 1083 §1 [a]


So lets not go by who jesus called a "little girl".

Average life expectancy was around 20-35 years in ancient rome and greece, imagine getting married at 18 then may have 2 to 15 years to live.


ঃ::::ঃ::::::::::
In Ancient Greece and Rome, scientists estimate that the average life expectancy was just 20 to 35 years. Thanks to modern medicine and improved hygiene, these numbers have more than doubled, with Americans living about 78.6 years on average.1 Oct 2019
https://www.brookdale.com › 2019/10
Could Humans Live to be 1,000 Years Old? - Brookdale
:::

So study first before making judgement. This is how the seculars destroyed Christianity and now they are after Islam the only surviving religion. Unfortunately they have been unsuccessful hence the bad press.

 

[SMX 3.0]

So what do you think muslims had a problem with, Ayesha being 9 year old or saying prophet (sm) because of lust for young girls married his wife.

Ayesha (ra)being 9 year is from muslim sources and still under islamic sharia you can marry a pubescent girl.

Obviously you wouldn't have a problem. We all know that.

Actually you can marry and consummate the marriage with a pre pubescent girl according to your scriptures. Refer Maulana Maududi.

As you are a christian, you should now Marry(as) mother of Jesus(as) was 12 when he gave birth to him. Rebecca is the wife Issac(as) she was 3 years old when she was married.

Nope, none of this is in Christian scriptures. I know this is the standard Muslim defense.

Most of our grandparents got married at early ages

The bridegrooms were young as well. Not exactly middle aged.

 

[Rushd Alam]

Nope, none of this is in Christian scriptures. I know this is the standard Muslim defense.

Rebecca is from old testament so here jewish commentary and Rabbies statements supersede what christians say and it is unfortunately as young as 3, and Marry (as) being 12 is from christian sources, as we do not have any age in muslim traditions.

The bridegrooms were young as well. Not exactly middle aged.

Who told you that??? Life is not a romantic movie where everything goes by a standard.


Marry (as) yr 12 after jesus(as) was bornmarried joseph who was 90. So you have a problem with that???

 

[Rushd Alam]

Actually you can marry and consummate the marriage with a pre pubescent girl according to your scriptures. Refer Maulana Maududi

Do not know what Maulana Maududi said as no one can overwrite quran and Sahih Hadid be it a maulana or a mufti.

 

[SMX 3.0]

Marry (as) yr 12 after jesus(as) was bornmarried joseph who was 90. So you have a problem with that???

Rebecca is from old testament so here jewish commentary and Rabbies statements supersede what christians say and it is unfortunately as young as 3, and Marry (as) being 12 is from christian sources, as we do not have any age in muslim traditions.

There is no proof for any of that in the Bible, it never mentions the age of any of them. According to the Bible, Mary (described as a "maiden") was old enough to travel alone from Nazareth to Judea's hill country to nurse her pregnant aunt. Rebecca (again described as a "maiden") was old enough to draw water from the well & water the camels.

I guess that clears. Definitely not 12 or 3.

And Christianity emerged from second temple Judaism & not Rabbinic judaism. So we are not bound to accept whatever theories Rabbis come up with.

Who told you that??? Life is not a romantic movie where everything goes by a standard.

Please do tell me if you would ever marry of your 6 year old to a 50 something man. That's all I want to know.

Do not know what Maulana Maududi said as no one can overwrite quran and Sahih Hadid be it a maulana or a mufti.

He didn't overwrite anything, it's Tafsir of your scripture. He says it's perfectly acceptable to marry & consummate a pre pubescent.

Go read it. Don't blame me.

Who told you that??? Life is not a romantic movie where everything goes by a standard.

Even the stuff you copy pasted about some ancient canon of Catholic Church states the minimum age of bridegroom to be 14.

Read stuff before you post

 

[Rushd Alam]

There is no proof for any of that in the Bible, it never mentions the age of any of them. According to the Bible, Mary (described as a "maiden") was old enough to travel alone from Nazareth to Judea's hill country to nurse her pregnant aunt. Rebecca (again described as a "maiden") was old enough to draw water from the well & water the camels.

I guess that clears. Definitely not 12 or 3.

And Christianity emerged from second temple Judaism & not Rabbinic judaism. So we are not bound to accept whatever theories Rabbis come up with.

Maiden by definition means young girl who is pubescent so being 12 fits the bill. Plus middle easter teeneagers reach maturity faster compaired to asian kids. Did not go based on data but experience, but I believe data will support.

Then after birth of jesus married 90 year old Joseph. Thats must be normal at that time as I do not see anyone raising any questions on the age gap.

Lets not go into debate why jews commentry on Rebecca should be taken vs chistian view. As Torah was given to children of Israel not to gentiles, lets take that as the first point.

Also there is dispute on the current form of christianity emergerd from st. Paul, Peter who were summoned by James brother of jesus asked to have his head shaved for what he has preached , but thats another topic.

 

[SMX 3.0]

Plus middle easter teeneagers reach maturity faster compaired to asian kids. Did not go based on data but experience, but I believe data will support.

Yeah those hilarious excuses, which I often hear when this topic is discussed. Dude, stop coming up with creative excuses

You wouldn't marry off your six year old daughter to a 50 something man, and that sa than any excuse you come up with.

Then after birth of jesus married 90 year old Joseph. Thats must be normal at that time as I do not see anyone raising any questions on the age gap.

Lets not go into debate why jews commentry on Rebecca should be taken vs chistian view. As Torah was given to children of Israel not to gentiles, lets take that as the first point.

As I said there is no mention of age for Joseph/ Mary/Rebecca in the Bible. Both were old enough to do tasks reserved for adults, though. Why don't you read these texts before copy pasting stuff from Muslim apologists??

Paul was a Jewish scholar, so I guess his exegesis holds. While Muhammad didn't have much clue about Biblical timelines, so much that thought that Mary was the brother of Aaron, but that's another discussion.

 

[El Sidd]

India's plunge into communal violence is likely to be exported by design outward to neighbours. The power vacuum created by Hasina will present a viable opportunity to accelerate the exports.

 

[Rushd Alam]

Yeah those hilarious excuses, which I often hear when this topic is discussed. Dude, stop coming up with creative excuses

You wouldn't marry off your six year old daughter to a 50 something man, and that sa than any excuse you come up with.

Regardless, marrying after puberty has been a culture in not into Arab society, but in Bengali society as well. Rabindranath who top bengali writer and poet on his book mentions marriage in early teen was a norm in hindu bengali society and if a girl reached 19 and was unmarried would be considered old.

Seikh Mujib who is our founding father married his wife at age of 8. That was the norm then, not even going to 1400 years ago.

Age difference of people marrying is not even considered in todays law, on what basis are you questioning that? Its still common for younger women to marry older men, its their preference, if a girl you liked didnt like you but married an older guy thats her choice, if Ayesha(ra) never had a problem with our prophets age nor her parents had a problem, who are you to question?

In islam pubescent girls are considered marriageable and can give consent and doent set a rule on age gap marriage but also cant be forced to marry her to anyone without consent.

As I said there is no mention of age for Joseph/ Mary/Rebecca in the Bible. Both were old enough to do tasks reserved for adults, though. Why don't you read these texts before copy pasting stuff from Muslim apologists??

Paul was a Jewish scholar, so I guess his exegesis holds. While Muhammad didn't have much clue about Biblical timelines, so much that thought that Mary was the brother of Aaron, but that's another discussion

Quran verse:
Then she brought him (the baby) to her people, carrying him. They said: "O Mary! Indeed you have brought a thing an unheard mighty thing. O sister of Harun (Aaron)! Your father was not a man who used to commit adultery, nor was your mother an unchaste woman."(Maryam 19:27-28)
Answe from our prophet:

It turns out that Christians in Najran during the time of the Prophet(P) raised a similar objection and it was answered by the Prophet(P). In Sahih Muslim, the hadith related by Mughirah ibn Shu`bah [5326] says:

When I came to Najran, they (the Christians of Najran) asked me: You read "O sister of Harun" (i.e. Maryam) in the Qur'an, whereas Moses was born much before Jesus. When I came back to Allah's Messenger(P) I asked him about that, whereupon he said: The (people of the old age) used to give names (to their persons) after the names of Apostle and pious persons who had gone before them.

So where did you find quran says Mary's brother Aaron is same as Mose's brother Aaron?

There is no cannonical bible chapters that talks about Marry's(as) parets or siblings. There are non canonical sources that has her parents but nothing about siblings. What jesus did for first 30 years of his life is also missing in gospels.


As per our hadit our prophet when asked said People would be named after old pious people or apostles, like they can be named Aaron, Moses, Jonah, Abraham even till today.

Many muslim scholars consider current christians followers of St Paul not Jesus(as), there are so much to say but I would just mention 1

Paul who never met jesus claimed he saw jesus in his dreams in road to Damascus and started saying he received a vision of the resurrected Jesus, who commissioned him to be the Apostle to the gentiles.

Then paul mentioned in his letters that jesus would comeback during his lifetime. So did he actually saw jesus in his dreams or was he a lair.

According to Islam only the true followers of jesus were muslims(submitter to only true god) and would go to haven, and it is quite evident now paul was one of those who will derail people from path of god.
ঃ::::::

Bart D. Ehrman says, in Forged:

Paul thought the end was coming in his lifetime. Nowhere is this more clear than in 1 Thessalonians. Paul wrote to the Christians in Thessalonica because some of them had become disturbed over the death of a number of their fellow believers. When he converted these people, Paul had taught them that the end of the age was imminent and that they were to enter the kingdom when Jesus returned, but members of the congregation had died before it happened.

Paul wrote to assure the survivors that even those who have died will be brought into the kingdom. In fact, when Jesus returns in glory on the clouds of heaven, "the dead in Christ will rise first; then we who are alive, who remain, will be caught up together with them to meet the Lord in the air" (4:17).

::::::

 

[SMX 3.0]

Regardless, marrying after puberty has been a culture in not into Arab society, but in Bengali society as well. Rabindranath who top bengali writer and poet on his book mentions marriage in early teen was a norm in hindu bengali society and if a girl reached 19 and was unmarried would be considered old.

Seikh Mujib who is our founding father married his wife at age of 8. That was the norm then, not even going to 1400 years ago.

Age difference of people marrying is not even considered in todays law, on what basis are you questioning that? Its still common for younger women to marry older men, its their preference, if a girl you liked didnt like you but married an older guy thats her choice, if Ayesha(ra) never had a problem with our prophets age nor her parents had a problem, who are you to question?

In islam pubescent girls are considered marriageable and can give consent and doent set a rule on age gap marriage but also cant be forced to marry her to anyone without consent.

lol, I am not interested in wasting my time on this.

But sure, marry off your daughter at the age of six. It's not like I have a problem with it.

 

[Rushd Alam]

lol, I am not interested in wasting my time on this.

But sure, marry off your daughter at the age of six. It's not like I have a problem with it.

Just playing by the demand of time for now.... Ha ha ha

 

[ulin elup]

Hasina is the best leader Bangladesh ever produced.

Modi gave Indian land to Bangladesh.

Modi gave Indian water to Bangladesh.

Modi let's 60 million Bangladeshis stay in India. Even lets thousands of Bangladeshi infiltrate India daily.

I mean what do more you need.

Hasina needs to keep pushing her poor citizens into India. In 10 years Bangladesh will get rid of poverty and India will be worse than Somalia.