The Future of Kashmir? "Seven" Possible Solutions!

[Abu Zolfiqar]

a couple glances at his post; and its obvious he is one

perhaps he would propose a Leninist approach to ''demographic re-arrangement'' as well


take a communist with a grain of salt and some Caspian sea caviar

 

[Xeric]

a couple glances at his post; and its obvious he is one

perhaps he would propose a Leninist approach to ''demographic re-arrangement'' as well

The usual materialistic approach. The regular habit of seeing everything through that darkened eye glass of greed, manipulation and oppression.

We cant blame the guy, he's too blinded by the 'freedom' he enjoys himself in the States. i wish he has to suffer what the Kashmiris have been suffering since decades! Seriously, this guy is biting the hand that feeds him. What a shame, rather pity!

i am surprised that God even give such privileges to those people who never had deserved them.

take a communist with a grain of salt and some Caspian sea caviar

Nah.. i am not wasting such an expensive delicacy on an extremist (or should i say a fundamentalist?)

 

[RollingStones]

The usual materialistic approach. The regular habit of seeing everything through that darkened eye glass of greed, manipulation and oppression.

We cant blame the guy, he's too blinded by the 'freedom' he enjoys himself in the States. i wish he has to suffer what the Kashmiris have been suffering since decades! Seriously, this guy is biting the hand that feeds him. What a shame, rather pity!

i am surprised that God even give such privileges to those people who never had deserved them.




Nah.. i am not wasting such an expensive delicacy on an extremist (or should i say a fundamentalist?)

Well then...the Kashmiris would have to get their district to become "independent" all on their own. You can be rest assured that there would be no global support for this for the several reasons I mentioned before. What does having another small independent country do for the world? Nothing. They can stay where they are. I really fail to see a case where India is systematically engaged in depriving them of their freedoms. And no, I am not a communist. But if Kashmiris want global support, they need to give the world a reason. No one's stopping them, so they better have a believable one. Throwing stones at Indian forces and then saying India is the oppressor, especially when India holds Tibetan refugees, despite China's power and ire, is going to sound very hollow. Good luck with painting India as a monster or a devil but no one is going to buy that, I am afraid. I mean it is laughable to paint a parliamentary democracy as a suppressing force. Yes, they are corrupt and inept but to paint them as unscrupulous oppressors...well, like I said before, good luck convincing anyone with that and using that to get Kashmir's "freedom".

 

[ejaz007]

Clashes erupt after protester dies in IHK

SRINAGAR: Stone-hurling protesters fought police on Tuesday after the death of a young man injured in a clash with security forces in Indian-held Kashmir, police said. The latest death brought to 58 the number of protesters and bystanders killed in two months of violent protests, most of them young men or teenagers shot dead by security forces. The man had been injured in Anantnag on Friday and died in hospital on Tuesday. His relatives said the security forces had beaten him during a protest but police claimed he had been injured in a stampede during a clash between security forces and protesters. The police said it had clamped a curfew to prevent further unrest. In Srinagar, young protesters blocked roads at several places and hurled stones at security forces. Police retaliated by firing warning shots and used teargas and batons. afp

Daily Times - Leading News Resource of Pakistan

 

[ejaz007]

Well then...the Kashmiris would have to get their district to become "independent" all on their own. You can be rest assured that there would be no global support for this for the several reasons I mentioned before. What does having another small independent country do for the world? Nothing. They can stay where they are. I really fail to see a case where India is systematically engaged in depriving them of their freedoms. And no, I am not a communist. But if Kashmiris want global support, they need to give the world a reason. No one's stopping them, so they better have a believable one. Throwing stones at Indian forces and then saying India is the oppressor, especially when India holds Tibetan refugees, despite China's power and ire, is going to sound very hollow. Good luck with painting India as a monster or a devil but no one is going to buy that, I am afraid. I mean it is laughable to paint a parliamentary democracy as a suppressing force. Yes, they are corrupt and inept but to paint them as unscrupulous oppressors...well, like I said before, good luck convincing anyone with that and using that to get Kashmir's "freedom".

Well perhaps you are not aware of the strategic importance of Kashmir. Anyone who sits in Kashmir can keep an eye on three of the eight nuclear powers.

Americans have been interested in Kashmir since 50's. During 1953 there were a serious of meetings between Indian and Pakistani PM's for resolving the issue and Americans were active behind the scene. It was only Nehru who decided to abandon the negotiations otherwise the issue was almost resolved.

 

[RollingStones]

Well perhaps you are not aware of the strategic importance of Kashmir. Anyone who sits in Kashmir can keep an eye on three of the eight nuclear powers.

Americans have been interested in Kashmir since 50's. During 1953 there were a serious of meetings between Indian and Pakistani PM's for resolving the issue and Americans were active behind the scene. It was only Nehru who decided to abandon the negotiations otherwise the issue was almost resolved.

Sure, we can always have a consulate in Kashmir district with a defense attache and be done with it. Even today laws of India or Pakistan do not prevent us from doing that. We have consulates all over India, I believe. America was interested to the extent that this area could have become a nuclear flashpoint. Now that the situation is more akin to a civil war and not as a flash between two countries - India and Pakistan - the whole "struggle" has been diluted. I actually think the problem in India and Pakistan is a lack of governance. I mean there are large areas that are already free of governance. that means they are almost independent. They are inside the federation all but in a name. This being the case, the argument that there is excessive government interference in select areas (such as Kashmir) just does not seem plausible. Once the security threat dies down, my guess is that Kashmir will return to a weak federal control with badly written laws and not much governance, much like the rest of India, with its inept and corrupt governance systems. So, basically Kashmiris are asking for something that is already there -not much of Indian governance - due to India's inept bureaucracy. They just need to get rid of the armed forces and they'll have a district with weak federal control and a large State control (like in their own people controlling them), which is almost the same as "freedom". Then, the Kashmiris just need to go on to figure out how to elect better people/put in place better governance systems to serve them. All else is just a sheer waste of time, in my opinion.

 

[Abu Zolfiqar]

what is this nonsense? Are occupied Kashmiris event granted the same laws and protection as hindustanys in hindustan?


there is no connection between the 2. It's occupied territory, and the people are fighting for their freedom.

I'm sorry to see another day, more death.


and that isnt just limited to Kashmir.

 

[Xeric]

Well then...the Kashmiris would have to get their district to become "independent" all on their own. You can be rest assured that there would be no global support for this for the several reasons I mentioned before. What does having another small independent country do for the world? Nothing.

Being beneficial for the world is NOT the ONLY criterion basing on which one would the right for its inception. If that be the case every baby born should first be checked if he/she would bring some guud to the world or not. If yes, it has the right to survive or else it must perish!

That's stupid!

They can stay where they are.

You should also have stayed the way you were before the civil war.

Germany should have also stayed the way it was during the WWs (remember what the treaty of versailles bring to the world?)

The jews should also have stayed the same way they were being treated during the holocaust. How did they qaulify to get an independent land AMIDST a settled land where some other race had already living, but the same cannot be garaunteed to the Kashmiris? Now should i say, are YOU racist of what..??!!

i dont want to refresh your general knowledge by writing many other examples but then you must understand that the size or the race dont matter, it is humanity that we are concerned about.

You probably want that the Kashmiris should continue to live the same miserable life that they have been since the past decades, without giving a single thought that they are no lesser humans than you or your likes!

And seriously, if you think the Kashmiris are 'happy' under the indian control (read occupation) than you are sadly mistaken. North Koreans are also 'free' and so were the Soviets, so, a simple question now, are you ready to renounce your (free) life and lead the one being lead by Kashmiris (or for that matter the Koreans, Chinese etc etc)?

I really fail to see a case where India is systematically engaged in depriving them of their freedoms.

Lolz... So that's the only criteria full-fling which would only allow the world to step ahead into the Kashmir Issue, and if not then Kashmiris are suppose to burn for life and the indians have a free ticket to ruin their lives, right?

And no, I am not a communist.

Oh yes you are!

And you may not even know

But if Kashmiris want global support, they need to give the world a reason.

Oookay....Right, right.

A reason....hmm.... a reason like another holocaust or another Nagasaki. Perfect!

No one's stopping them, so they better have a believable one.

The prevalent reason is more than enough for THOSE who are not communists and racists.

Throwing stones at Indian forces and then saying India is the oppressor,

Ok. Please enlighten us, what else they must do to prove that they are being oppersed by the indian military and state?

Mass suicide?

Another Mumbai Attack?

More terrorism/terrorists?

More suffering and human right violations?

Choose you pick!

Good luck with painting India as a monster or a devil but no one is going to buy that, I am afraid.

May be i should post those YT vids where you would see everyone calling india a monster and a devil (guud selection of words, BTW )

I mean it is laughable to paint a parliamentary democracy as a suppressing force.

I mean it is laughable to paint a Superpower (a democracy too) as an oppressor, but guess what, the world does that.

Just because i keep a beard (though i dont) doesnt make me a better Muslim (or a terrorist - suite yourself, please), just as you having sarcastic (read communist) views dont make you a communist, similarly, a 'parliamentary democracy' doest absolve india from being an oppressor.

If that be the case, your country would not have supported Dictators all around the world (Gen Musharraf inclusive)!! Where did your democracy go then? A democracy that doesnt suite you would automatically fall into the wrong side of the fall, a one-man-show that favors you has to be right, always right. Isn't it a bit selective, my free friend?

Yes, they are corrupt and inept but to paint them as unscrupulous oppressors...

i must appreciate that you do make use of that tiny thing up in your head sometimes

well, like I said before, good luck convincing anyone with that and using that to get Kashmir's "freedom".

Dont blame Muslims for (god-forbidden) another 9/11 (or Mumbai attack) next time.

 

[Abu Zolfiqar]

what did the creation of Kosovo bring to the world? Are our pockets lining? Is the world any safer or worse off? NO! NO! and NO!

the people demanded a homeland, a long overdue demand that eventually became realized -despite serbian/russian resistance

 

[toppys]

What is the situation in azad kashmir. Is that a highly developed area and kashmiris there feel happy that they are part of pakistan.Or there also groups who want full freedom of kashmir operate? Is there any surveys or polls. Just curious. How are minorities treated there?
When we already have an example we should look at it and see how it performs.

 

[RollingStones]

Being beneficial for the world is NOT the ONLY criterion basing on which one would the right for its inception. If that be the case every baby born should first be checked if he/she would bring some guud to the world or not. If yes, it has the right to survive or else it must perish!

That's stupid!


You should also have stayed the way you were before the civil war.

Germany should have also stayed the way it was during the WWs (remember what the treaty of versailles bring to the world?)

The jews should also have stayed the same way they were being treated during the holocaust. How did they qaulify to get an independent land AMIDST a settled land where some other race had already living, but the same cannot be garaunteed to the Kashmiris? Now should i say, are YOU racist of what..??!!

i dont want to refresh your general knowledge by writing many other examples but then you must understand that the size or the race dont matter, it is humanity that we are concerned about.

You probably want that the Kashmiris should continue to live the same miserable life that they have been since the past decades, without giving a single thought that they are no lesser humans than you or your likes!

And seriously, if you think the Kashmiris are 'happy' under the indian control (read occupation) than you are sadly mistaken. North Koreans are also 'free' and so were the Soviets, so, a simple question now, are you ready to renounce your (free) life and lead the one being lead by Kashmiris (or for that matter the Koreans, Chinese etc etc)?



Lolz... So that's the only criteria full-fling which would only allow the world to step ahead into the Kashmir Issue, and if not then Kashmiris are suppose to burn for life and the indians have a free ticket to ruin their lives, right?



Oh yes you are!

And you may not even know



Oookay....Right, right.

A reason....hmm.... a reason like another holocaust or another Nagasaki. Perfect!


The prevalent reason is more than enough for THOSE who are not communists and racists.


Ok. Please enlighten us, what else they must do to prove that they are being oppersed by the indian military and state?

Mass suicide?

Another Mumbai Attack?

More terrorism/terrorists?

More suffering and human right violations?

Choose you pick!


May be i should post those YT vids where you would see everyone calling india a monster and a devil (guud selection of words, BTW )


I mean it is laughable to paint a Superpower (a democracy too) as an oppressor, but guess what, the world does that.

Just because i keep a beard (though i dont) doesnt make me a better Muslim (or a terrorist - suite yourself, please), just as you having sarcastic (read communist) views dont make you a communist, similarly, a 'parliamentary democracy' doest absolve india from being an oppressor.

If that be the case, your country would not have supported Dictators all around the world (Gen Musharraf inclusive)!! Where did your democracy go then? A democracy that doesnt suite you would automatically fall into the wrong side of the fall, a one-man-show that favors you has to be right, always right. Isn't it a bit selective, my free friend?


i must appreciate that you do make use of that tiny thing up in your head sometimes



Dont blame Muslims for (god-forbidden) another 9/11 (or Mumbai attack) next time.

Your kind of speech is exactly the one that is refuted in the world today. If you go out and say these things, you will find that even moderate Muslim countries such as Turkey and Malaysia would support you. Looking at your answers, there is no chance of global support for Kashmiris. In your replies, there's a lot of shouting but a lot less reasoning. If you take your replies and go talk to another person disconnected with kashmir conflict, you would have failed to convince that person that India is an oppressor.

 

[Xeric]

Your kind of speech is exactly the one that is refuted in the world today. If you go out and say these things, you will find that even moderate Muslim countries such as Turkey and Malaysia would support you. Looking at your answers, there is no chance of global support for Kashmiris. In your replies, there's a lot of shouting but a lot less reasoning. If you take your replies and go talk to another person disconnected with kashmir conflict, you would have failed to convince that person that India is an oppressor.

Dont teach me how convince. i am not here for that purpose. You, RS are very much in picture of the Kashmir Issue and the problems connected to it, so there's no point in 'convincing' you, as you are already 'indoctrinated.'

i was actually awaiting that you could counter my 'reasoning' but alas, you just ducked it out with your rant.

Have a guud day or night, whatever.

 

[Indiarox]

What is the situation in azad kashmir. Is that a highly developed area and kashmiris there feel happy that they are part of pakistan.Or there also groups who want full freedom of kashmir operate? Is there any surveys or polls. Just curious. How are minorities treated there?
When we already have an example we should look at it and see how it performs.

Care full man to talk about Azad Kashmir not developing and facing many problems is a crime ,but to do India bashing on the situation of people on Indian side of the border is a well appreciated thing . what Hypocrisy!!!!!!!!

 

[Abu Zolfiqar]

no Pakistani/Kashmiri even was given the chance to anwer the question prior to your uncalled for rant!

there are issues existing in Azad Kashmir as well; economic and social. We can outline those issues gladly. Don't get emotional and resort to diversionary tactics however, as it is highly frowned upon.

 

[RollingStones]

Dont teach me how convince. i am not here for that purpose. You, RS are very much in picture of the Kashmir Issue and the problems connected to it, so there's no point in 'convincing' you, as you are already 'indoctrinated.'

i was actually awaiting that you could counter my 'reasoning' but alas, you just ducked it out with your rant.

Have a guud day or night, whatever.

You cannot go to the world with emotional rants. Simply put, only rational reasoning can be rationally debated with. Emotional opinions are rather like beliefs - no point debating those. I am of the firm opinion that the Kashmir district can be made mostly independent within the Indian federation and that is enough for everyone. India has the resources and the leadership to bring prosperity to Kashmir district and that's all that matters. Everything else is just noise, which the world does not want.