Tamil cannot be Madras HC's Official language : India rejects Tamilnadu request -

[manlion]

In that case, no state would call themselves Indians as the concept of India never existed before. The moment a state is included in the Union of India, they should identify themselves as Indians first and anything only after that. Moreover, you ill informed pakistani naysayers and false flaggers feel our Tamil brothers want to secede from India but I myself am a South Indian with 4 years of my bachelors education in Chennai and my fellow Tamilians are as much Indians as any of us are

You should read my response in the context between race vs nationality, which comes first. Nationality can change but not race. An Indian who takes up another country's citizenship ceases to be Indian but doesnt lose his/her racial identity.

Your logic using Chennai as a sample - is misleading as more than 30 % of Chennai pop comprises of non Tamils.

When India treats Tamilnadu like an enemy country, why should Tamils identify themselves as Indians ? India's enemies Pakistan and China , are not Tamils enemies. Ancient Tamils have had long trade/cultural links with China, so its meaningless for Tamils to fight Indian's enemies, just because they live under Indian Union. This will further illustrate my point. Pakistan owes Tamils a favour ....

By the 1940s, Periyar supported Muslim League's claim for a separate Pakistan, and expected its support in return.

In an interview with the Governor of Madras, Jinnah, the main leader of Muslim League, said that India should be divided into four regions: Dravidistan, Hindustan, Bengalistan and Pakistan; Dravidistan would approximately consist of the area under the Madras Presidency.

Jinnah stated "I have every sympathy and shall do all to help, and you establish Dravidistan where the 7 per cent Muslim population will stretch its hands of friendship and live with you on lines of security, justice and fairplay."

https://www.siasat.pk/forum/showthr...it-Leader-B-R-Ambedkar-is-also-in-the-picture

 

[manlion]

@sinait
Singapore Launches English-Tamil Glossary

Singapore: A first-of-its-kind English-Tamil glossary with over 4,000 common English terms and their corresponding Tamil words has been launched in Singapore to help translate public communication materials to the Indian language.

Tamil is Singapore's fourth official language along with English, Chinese and Malay.

The 200-page glossary contains a glossary in alphabetical order, a compilation of names of government organisations, as well as lists of educational terms and titles of statutes, The Sunday Times reported.

The glossary was produced by the Tamil Resource Panel under the National Translation Committee (NTC) in collaboration with the Tamil Language Council, the Ministry of Communications and Information (MCI) said in a statement yesterday.

It aims to be a guide for the practitioners of the Tamil language, including the media, teachers, students and government agencies who need to translate public communication materials to the Tamil language.

The NTC has also identified a list of experienced translators and vetters for government agencies to tap to improve vetting of Tamil translations.

In his speech at the launch of the glossary at The Indian Heritage Centre, Senior Minister of State for Communications and Information Chee Hong Tat said government agencies have not been consistent when tapping a list of experienced Tamil translators and vetters.

"Some have implemented it well, others I suspect, pay lip service and just go through (the) motion," Chee was quoted as saying by the Times.

"I had to knock some heads over the past year, something which I did not particularly enjoy doing, but until we see consistent improvement across the public sector, we have no choice but to continue enforcing the standards to hold agencies accountable for the quality of their translations." Last year, pamphlets used in National Day Parade rehearsals contained errors in Tamil translation.

Following that, Minister Ng Eng Hen had told Parliament in August that the original Tamil translation submitted was correct but errors were made by the printers. (PTI)

http://english.sakshi.com/news/2018/02/04/singapore-launches-english-tamil-glossary

 

[shootingstar]

Sorry about that confusion from me.
I cannot agree with you that the majority should force themselves upon their minorities.
Minority rights must be RESPECTED.
India is a recent British construct and as such should not be used as an excuse to obliterate an ancient and proud culture that the Tamils represent.
This dictatorial behavior of the majority Indians are increasingly alienating all their neighboring countries and soon even their constituent states.

Do you know how many Telugu people live in Tamilnadu? If you knew you would not be speaking about minority right. For a start Periyar E. V. Ramasamy who started the whole dravidian movement was a telugu not a Tamil. It is Tamils would need to think about minority rights of Telugu people in Tamilnadu rather than trying to impose Tamil on the Telugu people.

You should read my response in the context between race vs nationality, which comes first. Nationality can change but not race. An Indian who takes up another country's citizenship ceases to be Indian but doesnt lose his/her racial identity.

Your logic using Chennai as a sample - is misleading as more than 30 % of Chennai pop comprises of non Tamils.

When India treats Tamilnadu like an enemy country, why should Tamils identify themselves as Indians ? India's enemies Pakistan and China , are not Tamils enemies. Ancient Tamils have had long trade/cultural links with China, so its meaningless for Tamils to fight Indian's enemies, just because they live under Indian Union. This will further illustrate my point. Pakistan owes Tamils a favour ....

By the 1940s, Periyar supported Muslim League's claim for a separate Pakistan, and expected its support in return.

In an interview with the Governor of Madras, Jinnah, the main leader of Muslim League, said that India should be divided into four regions: Dravidistan, Hindustan, Bengalistan and Pakistan; Dravidistan would approximately consist of the area under the Madras Presidency.

Jinnah stated "I have every sympathy and shall do all to help, and you establish Dravidistan where the 7 per cent Muslim population will stretch its hands of friendship and live with you on lines of security, justice and fairplay."

https://www.siasat.pk/forum/showthr...it-Leader-B-R-Ambedkar-is-also-in-the-picture

And Periyar E. V. Ramasamy who started the whole dravidian movement was a telugu not a Tamil.

 

[ohmrlobalobayeh]

How likely is a Tamil Nadu secession in the future? What are other boiling matters at hand- besides lingusitics- that are causing all the friction now?

Do Tamils feel proud of being called Indians? Or they would feel better at being called Tamils/Tamilians?

 

[sinait]

Singapore Launches English-Tamil Glossary

Singapore: A first-of-its-kind English-Tamil glossary with over 4,000 common English terms and their corresponding Tamil words has been launched in Singapore to help translate public communication materials to the Indian language.

Tamil is Singapore's fourth official language along with English, Chinese and Malay.

The 200-page glossary contains a glossary in alphabetical order, a compilation of names of government organisations, as well as lists of educational terms and titles of statutes, The Sunday Times reported.

The glossary was produced by the Tamil Resource Panel under the National Translation Committee (NTC) in collaboration with the Tamil Language Council, the Ministry of Communications and Information (MCI) said in a statement yesterday.

It aims to be a guide for the practitioners of the Tamil language, including the media, teachers, students and government agencies who need to translate public communication materials to the Tamil language.

The NTC has also identified a list of experienced translators and vetters for government agencies to tap to improve vetting of Tamil translations.

In his speech at the launch of the glossary at The Indian Heritage Centre, Senior Minister of State for Communications and Information Chee Hong Tat said government agencies have not been consistent when tapping a list of experienced Tamil translators and vetters.

"Some have implemented it well, others I suspect, pay lip service and just go through (the) motion," Chee was quoted as saying by the Times.

"I had to knock some heads over the past year, something which I did not particularly enjoy doing, but until we see consistent improvement across the public sector, we have no choice but to continue enforcing the standards to hold agencies accountable for the quality of their translations." Last year, pamphlets used in National Day Parade rehearsals contained errors in Tamil translation.

Following that, Minister Ng Eng Hen had told Parliament in August that the original Tamil translation submitted was correct but errors were made by the printers. (PTI)

http://english.sakshi.com/news/2018/02/04/singapore-launches-english-tamil-glossary

If Singapore can put much effort into improving Tamil translation to English, Tamil Nadu with 67 million population can definitely do a better job.
I get the feeling the Tamils are being oppressed in India.

Its telling that no Tamil member has come forth with their views on this.
Its good you opened this thread, a lot of us don't know much about India.
Or rather we do not bother to find out more about India.
.

 

[manlion]

Do you know how many Telugu people live in Tamilnadu? If you knew you would not be speaking about minority right. For a start Periyar E. V. Ramasamy who started the whole dravidian movement was a telugu not a Tamil. It is Tamils would need to think about minority rights of Telugu people in Tamilnadu rather than trying to impose Tamil on the Telugu people.

Telugus in Tamilnadu are either remnants of the nayak/vijayanagar rulers or migrants who arrived with the nayaks. Over 400 yrs in Tamilandu, they have assimilated with in main stream Tamils, Vaiko, Vijayakanth, Karunanidhi (Vishal Reddy aspiring) etc are Telugus politicians in Tamilnadu. Karunanidhi (MGR a Malayali) had been Tamilnadu CM and Vijayakanth was the opposition leader once. In fact all the Tamilnadu Dravidian parties (except present ADMK) are under Telugu leadership.

Can a non Tamil be a CM or opposition leader in Kerala or AP/Karnataka ?

Show proof where Tamil is imposed on Telugus ?

20 Shot Dead in Andhra Forests, Strong Protests in Tamil Nadu

https://www.ndtv.com/india-news/enc...sandalwood-smugglers-in-andhra-pradesh-752816

AP (Karnataka) kills Tamil using the pretext - smugglers (Kaveri water agitation)

Periyar E. V. Ramasamy who started the whole dravidian movement was a telugu not a Tamil.

EVR didnt start the Dravidian movement, it was founded in 1916 to fight Brahmin domination and tyranny. Periyar started his self respect movement in 1925 , founded his radicalized Dravidian movement (Dravida Kazhagam) in 1944

Erode Venkata Ramasami was born on 17 September 1879, in Erode, then a part of the Coimbatore district of the Madras Presidency.[15] E.V. Ramasamy's father, a rich Kannada Baliga businessman, was Venkatappa Naicker (or Venkata), and his mother was Chinna Thayammal, alias Muthammal.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Periyar_E._V._Ramasamy

 

[manlion]

Telugu and Tamil are separate, they are not derived from each other. Tamilnadu is Indian as such should follow the common rules agreed and accepted by majority. Their identity should be Indian first not Tamil first. If everyone start relating themselves as separate, there won't be a country called India.

Also nobody cares if southeast asians perceives Indians as Tamilians. India provides for individual choice w.r.t to their vocal communication but written records in courts should be either in Hindi or English as both are recognised as official languages.

If Tamilians are treated differently, there'll equal protest from all other language champions, given there are other languages spoken more widely than Tamil in the country for example Telugu.

It matters to Tamils, when they are perceived as Indians in SE Asia. As India/Hindi chauvinists/racists cunningly use Indian to replace the Tamil identity and official recognition accorded in SE Asian countries. Hijacking Tamil achievements and claim/entitlement to infrastructures established by Tamils. E.g India govt planting North Indian monuments in Malaysia/Singapore's Little Indias which has nothing to do with Indians

Little India Malaysia - the Ugly North Indian Torana Gate inaugurated by Modi has no relevance to Malaysian Tamils

Indian embassy Hindianisation of Tamil temples e.g in Vietnam infiltration of mini shrines for north Hindián/Hindutva gods - Hare Krishna/Puri Jagananth/Rama, Santoshi maa /etc.

Mariamman Temple in Ho Chi Min City - under Vietnamese govt control

indirectly impose Hindi on SE Asian Tamils. This happened in Singapore sometime late 90s to early 2000s. India requested Singapore govt to replace Tamil with Hindi as the official languages. The reason - they are Índians' and Hindi is India's official/national language (widely spoken /used in govt/ business etc) .

Singapore govt's official response - Tamil official status is constitutional and the govt cant amend the constitution to entertain India request.

Tamils dont owe India a living but it isnt the case with India. India needs Tamilnadu for its resources and strategic location. Breaking up India is of no concern to Tamils if their survival and existence is threaten under Indian/Hindián occupation.

BTW Tamil is in the top 20 languages used in the world and the only surviving classical language apart from Chinese.

 

[protest]

It matters to Tamils, when they are perceived as Indians in SE Asia. As India/Hindi chauvinists/racists cunningly use Indian to replace the Tamil identity and official recognition accorded in SE Asian countries. Hijacking Tamil achievements and claim/entitlement to infrastructures established by Tamils. E.g India govt planting North Indian monuments in Malaysia/Singapore's Little Indias which has nothing to do with Indians

Little India Malaysia - the Ugly North Indian Torana Gate inaugurated by Modi has no relevance to Malaysian Tamils

Indian embassy Hindianisation of Tamil temples e.g in Vietnam infiltration of mini shrines for north Hindián/Hindutva gods - Hare Krishna/Puri Jagananth/Rama, Santoshi maa /etc.

Mariamman Temple in Ho Chi Min City - under Vietnamese govt control

Try and impose Hindi on SE Asian Tamils. This happened in Singapore sometime late 90s to early 2000s. India requested Singapore govt to replace Tamil with Hindi as the official languages. The reason - they are Índians' and Hindi is India's official/national language (widely spoken /used in govt/ business etc) .

Singapore govt's official response - Tamil official status is constitutional and the govt cant amend the constitution to entertain India request.

Tamils dont owe India a living but it isnt the case with India. India needs Tamilnadu for its resources and strategic location. Breaking up India is of no concern to Tamils if their survival and existence is threaten under Indian/Hindián occupation.

BTW Tamil is in the top 20 languages used in the world and the only surviving classical language apart from Chinese.

Now are we supposing that somehow you represent Tamils? How so? Tamil culture is Indian culture as such my culture as well just as north Indian culture is also my culture. We have the motto 'unity in diversity'. Unlike you, most Tamils are sane bunch and know what is better for them. And stop the nonsense with 'Hindian occupation'. Why not stop 'English teaching' also as it is alien to Tamil culture as well.

Tamilnadu is a state of India but only a state not country itself, everyone adjusted to this new reality but somehow you got stuck under a rock. I'm sure you are grateful to PDF to vent your frustration, i know how it is like for you in real life.

 

[manlion]

Now are we supposing that somehow you represent Tamils? How so? Tamil culture is Indian culture as such my culture as well just as north Indian culture is also my culture. We have the motto 'unity in diversity'. Unlike you, most Tamils are sane bunch and know what is better for them. And stop the nonsense with 'Hindian occupation'. Why not stop 'English teaching' as well as it is alien to Tamil culture as well.

Funny how you equate Tamil culture with Indian culture - when Tamil speak a different language from Indians.

1) where did I claim to represent Tamil ? I have only highlighted the injustice meted to minorities (Tamils included) under Indian rule.

2) these 2 Tamil culture are/were banned by India as barbaric . How can Tamil = Indian when Indians deride Tamil and their culture as barbaric ?

Tamils

Chinese

3) English an international language is taught and used all over the world. Hindi is a regional language confined to the cow belt region.

FYI, Tamils have closer cultural connection with Chinese (or African/Yezidis) than with Indians

 

[protest]

Funny how you equate Tamil culture with Indian culture - when Tamil speak a different language from Indians.

1) where did I claim to represent Tamil ? I have only highlighted the injustice meted to minorities (Tamils included) under Indian rule.

2) these 2 Tamil culture are/were banned by India as barbaric . How can Tamil = Indian when Indians deride Tamil and their culture as barbaric ?

Tamils

Chinese

3) English an international language is taught and used all over the world. Hindi is a regional language confined to the cow belt region.

FYI, Tamils have closer cultural connection with Chinese (or African/Yezidis) than with Indians

It is barbaric when your ritual involves harming an animal or the person himself otherwise Sati would still be prevalent in India. Also the ruling was given by the supreme court of India to which we are all bound by constitution. In any case, if you are not representing Tamils, then i don't need to bother replying to you.

'Tamils have closer cultural connection to Chinese' is the most moronic statement ever came out of your mouth. That just goes to show to what extent your willing to go to justify your propaganda.

 

[Yingluck]

Telugus in Tamilnadu are either remnants of the nayak/vijayanagar rulers or migrants who arrived with the nayaks. Over 400 yrs in Tamilandu, they have assimilated with in main stream Tamils, Vaiko, Vijayakanth, Karunanidhi (Vishal Reddy aspiring) etc are Telugus politicians in Tamilnadu. Karunanidhi (MGR a Malayali) had been Tamilnadu CM and Vijayakanth was the opposition leader once. In fact all the Tamilnadu Dravidian parties (except present ADMK) are under Telugu leadership.

Can a non Tamil be a CM or opposition leader in Kerala or AP/Karnataka ?

Show proof where Tamil is imposed on Telugus ?

20 Shot Dead in Andhra Forests, Strong Protests in Tamil Nadu

https://www.ndtv.com/india-news/enc...sandalwood-smugglers-in-andhra-pradesh-752816

AP (Karnataka) kills Tamil using the pretext - smugglers (Kaveri water agitation)



EVR didnt start the Dravidian movement, it was founded in 1916 to fight Brahmin domination and tyranny. Periyar started his self respect movement in 1925 , founded his radicalized Dravidian movement (Dravida Kazhagam) in 1944

Erode Venkata Ramasami was born on 17 September 1879, in Erode, then a part of the Coimbatore district of the Madras Presidency.[15] E.V. Ramasamy's father, a rich Kannada Baliga businessman, was Venkatappa Naicker (or Venkata), and his mother was Chinna Thayammal, alias Muthammal.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Periyar_E._V._Ramasamy

Do you know how many Telugu people live in Tamilnadu? If you knew you would not be speaking about minority right. For a start Periyar E. V. Ramasamy who started the whole dravidian movement was a telugu not a Tamil. It is Tamils would need to think about minority rights of Telugu people in Tamilnadu rather than trying to impose Tamil on the Telugu people.




And Periyar E. V. Ramasamy who started the whole dravidian movement was a telugu not a Tamil.

There was only Dravidians. Telegu was borned when the local increasingly mixed it with the lect of savage Aryan.

 

[protest]

There was only Dravidians. Telegu was borned when the local increasingly mix it with the lect of savage Aryan.

Buddy, have your head checked first.

 

[KapitaanAli]

As for the rest of these so called South Indians - Telugus, Kannadigas and Keralites they identify themselves as Aryans and hence have no qualms with use of Hindi or being Hindián slaves. This isnt the case with Tamils as culturally and racially they are different from the rest of these Indians.

Kerala rightfully identifies as Arya-Dravidan with Abrahamic influences. There's nothing wrong with it since the state is exactly that. Anyone who has been to Kerala and Tamizhnaad will know the difference.

And yet, look at the report below. Tell me again how the people are slaves. We do think that learning more languages makes us stronger, but Malayalam rules.

High court language is tricky because of the matter of convenience. But I agree Hindi should have no significant place in southern or NE high courts.

Malayalam to be only official language in state
By: Aneesh Jacob
November 27, 2015, 10:58 AM IST
Thiruvananthapuram: Malayalam will soon become the only official language in the state. Malayalam will be the first language in educational institutions and learning of Malayalam will be compulsory. Language development department will also be formed. These are the conditions in the final draft of the Bill aimed at promotion and development of Malayalam language, approved by the Cabinet the other day.


The Bill will be presented in the next Assembly session.


According to the Kerala official Languages Act, 1969, English and Malayalam are official languages in the state. The plan is to bring a comprehensive Malayalam law instead.


The questions in the competitive examinations conducted by the PSC and other government agencies should be prepared in Malayalam also. Cases in lower courts and judgments will be in Malayalam.


The orders, laws, and bylaws prepared on the basis of Central and state laws should be in Malayalam. They should also be translated to English. The Central laws published in English should be translated to Malayalam.


Malayalam will be the official language in government, semi-government, public sector, self-governing, and cooperative institutions. The letters to Central government, other states, High Court, and Supreme Court can be in English. Kannada and Tamil language minorities can write to the government in their language. They will get the replies in those languages or English.


The children whose mother-tongue is different should get the opportunity to learn Malayalam, too. However, they will be exempted from writing the Malayalam exams in ninth, 10th, 11th and 12th standards.


Those appointed in government services who have not learnt Malayalam as a subject in 10th, higher secondary, and degree classes should pass a PSC exam which is equivalent to the senior higher diploma conducted by the Malayalam Mission.


Cases in lower courts and judgments will be in Malayalam. The High Court should take necessary steps in this regard. The judgments in petty cases should be pronounced in Malayalam. The orders issued by all quasi-judicial bodies should be in Malayalam.


The names of all industrial products produced or sold in Kerala should be written in Malayalam. Their uses should be described in Malayalam, too.


A fine of Rs 5000-25,000 will be imposed on those violating the conditions.

 

[kvpak]

Unlike you, most Tamils are sane bunch and know what is better for them. And stop the nonsense with 'Hindian occupation'. Why not stop 'English teaching' also as it is alien to Tamil culture as well.

I oppose Hindian occupation and so are millions of Tamils. Hold a plebiscite in Tamil Nadu. I will abide by the results.

Tamilnadu is a state of India but only a state not country

Nazis occupied Austria and called it German Province. Once Nazis were sent to hell along with their leader Hitler, Austria regained its country status. Lesson for Tamil Nadu ?

'Tamils have closer cultural connection to Chinese' is the most moronic statement ever came out of your mouth.

Tamils had an embassy in China in around 1050. Tamil embassy was close to the Emperor's palace showing the close, friendly relations.

China broadcasts a Tamil radio program internationally. India broadcasts internationally only Hindi and Sanskrit.

High court language is tricky because of the matter of convenience.

What is so tricky? If Hind-ians can use Hindi in Uttar Pradesh High Court why not Tamil in Tamil Nadu? Supreme Court is outright biased and refuse to give the reason.

SC should give the reason. They cannot hide under their black riobes

 

[manlion]

It is barbaric when your ritual involves harming an animal or the person himself otherwise Sati would still be prevalent in India. Also the ruling was given by the supreme court of India to which we are all bound by constitution. In any case, if you are not representing Tamils, then i don't need to bother replying to you.

'Tamils have closer cultural connection to Chinese' is the most moronic statement ever came out of your mouth. That just goes to show to what extent your willing to go to justify your propaganda.

India/Hindutva/SC are being selective in targeting Tamil's tradition (although there a hidden agenda) why no action against abuse of animals used in Hindu temple rituals, sports or Indian army ?

Captive elephants are exploited for profit in the name of culture and religion

Jallikattu is only a 1 day festival , where the bull run takes less than 1 min, however these other animals are perpetually abused in the name of religion, sports, military

Before the invasion of Brahamnism, Tamils had nothing in common with rest of The Indians e.g caste system. The invasion of Brahmins/Jews via the west coast and migration during the 11th AD led to the dilution of Tamil culture.

few e.gs
1) Tamil siddha/assevaham religion wiped out to be replaced by Vedic Brahamanism
2) Introduction of caste system
3) appropriation of Tamil culture - including gods/literature/scriptures -into Brahmanism via sanskrit and destroying the original works in Tamil (e.g Adi Sankara)

some basic difference between Indians and Tamils

Indian heroine - Draupadi - the common wife of 5 Pandavas
Tamil heroine - Kannagi - who burnt Madurai - a faithful wife to kovalan

Indian holy book - racist and caste system advocating/ sectarian Bhagavad Gita
Tamil Holy book - secular /universal Tirukural

Since and before - 2 BC Tamils had cultural contacts with Chinese, out of the prominent 18 Tamil siddhas, some were Chinese

Cholas had cultural/trade/ and diplomatic relationship with China

The Chinese connection of Tamil medicine
https://www.researchgate.net/publication/224897812_The_chinese_connection_of_Tamil_medicine

The fact is Indians have closer racial/cultural affinity with Sinhalas than with Tamils, if not they wouldnt have sponsored the Tamil genocide, train/provide military logistics/intel to Lankan army and allow Lankan navy to kill Tamil fishermen

Sad & Tragic Maj. Gen. Shavendra De Silva who was earlier expelled fr UN & now Brigadier Priyanka Fernando who threatened to behead Tamil protesters in the UK-both went to India for studies & joint training exercises after their role in war crimes & the "genocidal slaughter" of Tamils and in the targeted shelling of No Fire Zones and hospitals!