SUPARCO is sleeping! Can someone wake it up?

[SOHEIL]

Pakistan economy is healing and money is not the problem, its just that our government isnt really interested. They are wasting money on useless things. They should have setup some good institutions for this field. Usually in pakistan people are more inclined towards software, electrical & mechanical engineering. Space isnt really the priority to people either.

Do you want the launch capability or an operational launcher !?

Iran has good space program in spite of the sanctions. So, there is no reason why Pakistan cannot have one, but Pakistan priorities are elsewhere. Even on education, Pakistan is the lowest spender in South Asia.

It is not good ! when we have no recon sats up there !

 

[amardeep mishra]

It is such dismal situation that SUPARCO which was set up well before ISRO .. is lost like all other good things happened to Pakistan viz., BECO, Pakistan Steel Mills and PIA etc..

Hi dear @MM_Haider
Allow me to shed some light on this situation based on my experience. Firstly let me ask you a couple of very easy questions-
(a) What according you are the ingredients for developing space vehicles?
(b) What do you think are the primary reasons for india and china to be way ahead of pakistan in aerospace research in general and space research in particular?

The establishment of SUPARCO well before ISRO should have given them some head-start provided there existed some sort of "research culture" and "industries" in pakistan. Firstly,to have any kind of space research activity you need
1) Your own indigenous research
2) A decent industrial base
3) Young population motivated to pursue research in Aerospace
4)And above all decent "funding"
sadly in pakistan,all the 4 are sourly lacking! all the points from 1 to 3 would become invalid if #4 is not adequate or worse doesnt exist! Sadly,if i recall correctly,pakistan's total space related funding is paltry $7mn(kindly correct me if I am wrong-from authentic sources)- Compared to that ISRO's annual budget is now gradually touching $1.5bn and would exceed $3bn in next 5 years- Now that is a respectable figure.
At the moment,pakistan doesnt really produce either quality or quantity research in Aerospace. I mean come on,you cant really dream of sending your own satellites into space with no equivalent of JPL(NASA's) or LPSC(ISRO's) in pakistan! You need to have solid research facilities that are dedicated to development of propulsion systems be it cryogenic,semi cryogenic,hyper-gollic or even ion propulsion!Solid rockets are just too in-efficient to send satellites into space- their mass fractions are pathetic compared to cryogenic rockets.If you see all the modern launchers be it from china,japan,US,or india- the trend is to use either fully cryo or semi cryo as main stage.Sometimes large solid rockets are used as boosters though like ISRO's S-200 in GSLV-mk3 design.

 

[ito]

Do you want the launch capability or an operational launcher !?



It is not good ! when we have no recon sats up there !

I guess now as sanctions are over, Iran can avail lot of technologies from around world and incorporate into their space program. But the important thing is Iran has that scientific bend that is quite unique in Islamic world.

It is also a good idea to have a MOU between Iranian Space Agency and ISRO for collaborative research. I am sure India will be very happy

 

[somebozo]

What is the budget of SUPARCO???
I bet shab e barat crackers make more money than SUPARCO budget.

 

[Silent_Killer]

Do you want the launch capability or an operational launcher !?

Launch capability is not the problem, we had launched many satellites in past and recently with help of china. But the thing is its trend is fading away. Many space scientist got retired and we dont have others to replace them.

 

[544_delta]

The another main reason why we are lagging behind in this sector is because there are only few universities offering courses in this field

i know...i had to give that dream up and settle for electrical engg because i didnt know of any uni programs related to space studies/cosmology/astronomy...but things are looking up now...theres IST, AIR..plus nust is offering a pretty dope program at masters level...so i think things are looking up

 

[SOHEIL]

2) A decent industrial base

I guess now as sanctions are over, Iran can avail lot of technologies from around world and incorporate into their space program. But the important thing is Iran has that scientific bend that is quite unique in Islamic world.

It is also a good idea to have a MOU between Iranian Space Agency and ISRO for collaborative research. I am sure India will be very happy

Sanctions are here to stay !

Nothing changed !!!

 

[ito]

Sanctions are here to stay !

Nothing changed !!!

The sanctions are in a way gone. I read some where that China and Russia are welcoming Iran to be a part of SCO. India has promised investments in Iran and there are many countries that have committed investments in Iran. With in next 5 years, Iran will be main stream

 

[amardeep mishra]

Hi dear @SOHEIL
I do not understand what do you imply by the picture but I am sure you are really not that naive to think the shaheen was designed in pakistan. Till date,there is no available technical discussion,research paper or patents on shaheen missile systems that casts serious doubts as to who holds various IPRs in the case of shaheen.The lesser said the better!

 

[SOHEIL]

Launch capability is not the problem, we had launched many satellites in past and recently with help of china. But the thing is its trend is fading away. Many space scientist got retired and we dont have others to replace them.

Launch capability is not the problem !? Only a limited selection of countries possess the ability to launch something into orbit around the Earth. To date there are 9 countries that have orbital launch capability. These are Russia, the United States, France, Japan, China, India, Israel, Iran and North Korea. These 9 countries have the ability to build and launch an orbit capable vehicle. Great Britain developed launch capacity in the 1970’s but did not join the European consortium Arianespace, therefore losing this ability. A few other countries have inherited technology allowing them to make orbital flights. These include Ukraine and South Korea, and nine other European countries who have access through the combined effort of ESA and Arianespace.

The sanctions are in a way gone. I read some where that China and Russia are welcoming Iran to be a part of SCO. India has promised investments in Iran and there are many countries that have committed investments in Iran. With in next 5 years, Iran will be main stream

Space program & it's connection with BM tech is the problem !

I am 100% sure china won't help pakistan in SLV tech !

Because SLV capability = ICBM capability !

not a single chance ... maybe as russian did for S.korea !

 

[litman]

all pak institutes are in tatters. corruption is the rule every where and when some one asks about the poor performance everyone blames lack of funds.

 

[faisal6309]

Last time I checked, they were working on some satellite and its launch in orbit. But they also didn't have any funds at all.

 

[SOHEIL]

Hi dear @SOHEIL
I do not understand what do you imply by the picture but I am sure you are really not that naive to think the shaheen was designed in pakistan. Till date,there is no available technical discussion,research paper or patents on shaheen missile systems that casts serious doubts as to who holds various IPRs in the case of shaheen.The lesser said the better!

It can not be denied, that the Pakistani solid fuel rockets Ghaznavi and Shaheen-1 are similar to the Chinese DF-11 missile type.
On photos is recognizable, that the Chinese DF-11 and DF-11A by set of some solid fuel segments are built. The DF-11 uses two segments. For the DF-11A is a third segment added.
For the Pakistani Shaheen-1 is a further half segment added. All rocket types have the same diameter of 0.88 m. The Shaheen-1 have however a striking extended skirt in the nozzle area, because the missile has another control system and a larger nozzle (?).

On photos is clearly recognizable, that also the Chinese DF-15 and DF-15A by set of several short solid fuel segments are built. Four segments uses the DF-15, and the extended DF-15A uses five segments. All rockets have a diameter of ~1.10 m. The DF-15 missile type is obviously not exported.

Unknown are the Chinese rocket variants M-9 and M-18. They are referred as export variants. So is suspected that the Pakistani Shaheen-1 corresponds to the M-9. The M-18 probably corresponds to the Pakistani Shaheen-2. The Chinese M-18 was allegedly shown at the 1987 Beijing air show. Now I have found Photos of the M-18 missile ! (see below)

The Shaheen-2 is totally different to the DF-11 and DF-15 missile types. The diameter is significantly 1.40 m. China Hexi Chemical & Mechanical Company presents solid motors for first stages with the name L-SpaB. Very capable for the Shaheen-2 is the motor L-SpaB-140B with 1.40 m in diameter and a length of 7.15 m. For the second stage is a shorter solid motor SpaB-140 capable. A candidate for the M-18 is the completely unknown DF-25.

It is also not known whether the Iran from China have bought M-9 or M-18 missiles. This is unlikely. The new Iranian Sejil (syn. Ashura, Ghadr 110) missile is not of Chinese origin. It is not known that China have builded solid rockets with a diameter of 1.25 m.

Nozzle comparison
DF-15/DF-11​

 

[SOHEIL]

Chinese DF-11

[URL='http://www.b14643.de/Spacerockets/Diverse/Dong-Feng/DF-11_4big.jpg'][/URL]

Pakistani Ghaznavi

 

[SOHEIL]

Chinese DF-11A

DF-11A (is stretched DF-11)

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