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Sino-German Affairs

^ What is the situation with Norway? Are the people there as rabidly anti-China / pro-USA as their government? For similar reasons as Germany?

Norway and Scandinavia in general is completely infiltrated by the US. Do you remember former Swedish Prime Minister Olaf Palmer? His murder has never been solved. His mistake was his critical view of US aggression.
 
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Götterdämmerung;2557410 said:
Norway and Scandinavia in general is completely infiltrated by the US. Do you remember former Swedish Prime Minister Olaf Palmer? His murder has never been solved. His mistake was his critical view of US aggression.
If France and Germany try again to break free from US / UK dominance like Chirac and Schroeder tried, could it work?
 
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If France and Germany try again to break free from US / UK dominance like Chirac and Schroeder tried, could it work?

I don't know how the Atlantic Bridge will react. France has a better chance of breaking away, since de Gaul was a defender of French sovereignty and NATO never had any command over French military.

Look at the current situation. The US in concert with the UK have been attacking the Euro, the public has been very angry over this fact but our politicians, Merkel and Sarkozy, have been mute about this. What is the reason? What are they afraid of?
 
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Götterdämmerung;2557139 said:
Thanks guys for the lively discussion, that's the very purpose of a forum.

@ iajj

You are right in your assessment of the mentality of Germany. But there are always fringe elements in any society. I may be one of them.

Post WWII Germany has ben trapped in the Transatlantic Bridge (group) from top to the bottom, transplanted directly from the US right after the war. Our mass media and poltical parties are infiltrated by these elements, regardless what political hue they don. Anyone with a different view, regardless how reasonable and democratic they are, will be defamed, ridiculed as Communist, Nazi or simply as a wacko. Up till the fall of the Wall, people who were members of the communist party were excluded to work for any gouvernemental institutions including schools, as teachers are civil servants in Germany. As a politician, criticising Israel is the same as career suicide.

Merkel grew up in the former East Germany and she was an active member of the FDJ, a powerful youth organisation. Without a membership of this organisation, she wouldn't have been able to study at the university and get her doctorate as a physicist. After the fall of the Wall, she very much turned her head to the right and became the "girl" of former Chancellor Helmut Kohl who mentored her to where she is now. She is very much an opportunist, albeit a successful one.

It is easy to blame Germany for acting stupid, but one has to see what is underneath the surface. We are not a sovereign country. We are still an occupied country with over 60k US soldiers stationed on our territory plus the wide-spread network of the Transatlantic Bridge in practically any key position of any institution and large corporation. Our people have been brainwashed from kindergarten to the university, from the media to corparate culture.

But there is resistance, small but growing.

Also, I don't think that my Chinese friends in this forum are that simple minded to think that a few German news articles represents the majority of Germany.

Cheers

thanks, this is a very honest assessment that can really help germans and chinese alike to understand the current situation. like i said, i firmly believe germans will grow out of this, and sino-german friendship (or one between china and a franco-german political union) is inevitable. but before the german public grows out of this anglo-american political indoctrination, i want some leveling and reciprocity of chinese public opinion and german public opinion: i want chinese public opinion to turn much sourer on germany.

now this isn't because i hate germany and don't want german friendship - not at all! but for the present, i don't want a situation growing that will put chinese diplomats in a bad situation when in negotiations with germany just because germans might exploit domestic hostility and chinese goodwill to get strategic concessions from china. so anti-german feelings must be manufactured, even if temporarily: if 80% germans hate chinese, then 80% (but no more) chinese must hate germans. again, nothing either personal or perpetual. the damage can be quickly undone when the damage of denazification is undone.
 
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Götterdämmerung;2558178 said:
I don't know how the Atlantic Bridge will react. France has a better chance of breaking away, since de Gaul was a defender of French sovereignty and NATO never had any command over French military.

Look at the current situation. The US in concert with the UK have been attacking the Euro, the public has been very angry over this fact but our politicians, Merkel and Sarkozy, have been mute about this. What is the reason? What are they afraid of?

which is why i like the euro crisis today. i heard many germans saying the exact same thing we heard on papers: that ordinary germans hate bailing out greece. and i dismiss their opinions the same way i dismiss german animosity towards china (most germans received a political education that was fundamentally harmful to themselves and to their nation).

three things:
first, the bailout. it is about to accomplish that important geopolitical goal of german predominance over mittleeuropa. today germany already has firmly in its grasp the trade and commercial relations of central european nations (again, it is all geography, and also why china and germany are natural friends - even when chinese economy grows further and becomes many times the size of germany, we all know that economically mittleeuropa will be integrated only with germany and so there is not going to be any rivalry between china and germany over germany's lebensraum,), and fiscal control of these countries will make german control of these economies complete. so i am actually itching for a hungarian default as well

second, anglo-american attack on euro and german political class' (SDU and even CDU, despite the reluctance of its junior partners and rebellion of the rank and file) determination to defend the currency is going to open up the schism between germans and anglo-saxons who have long sought to reduce germany into a geopolitical dwarf and german people into political imbeciles. again, this is pure geography: anglo-americans are always the offshore balancers and cannot tolerate franco-german union (sealed by the currency) and its projected politico-economic domination over the rest of continental europe (also facilitated by the currency), and the euro crisis is going to help germans realize the rudimentary conflict of interests between germans' and anglo-americans and help them wise up to the evil designs of the latter in feeding germans the universalist propaganda and castrating germans politically.

third, encouragingly, the euro crisis also shows that france, even under a flamboyant leader like sarkozy, is willing to cede more political leadership to germany in their co-management of E.U., and this means a true political union between france and germany that many people have dreamt of will not have french hubris as its last obstacle.
 
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Alot of Chinese admire Germany. Because of their cars and electronic devices from brands like Bosh. But its paradox that Germans regard China as a cheap low technology, copying poor devil Country. U can betaken this phenomenon every day in the television and on the internet. Its like they were brainwashed. I have the feeling that all this were controlled secretly from the German Goverment. Now wonder. They are and have ever beeing pros at Propaganda.
For example the program "Galileo" compare regulary divices from low cheap copying poor devil China with a common product. They realy compared the Nintendo DS for 200€ with the cheapest fake which was bought from Ebay. Finally they come to the conclusion that China product are ******* poor... wtf... why dont they compare a mobile phone? Oh right germans dont produce that....
I can go on for ever.
 
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Alot of Chinese admire Germany. Because of their cars and electronic devices from brands like Bosh. But its paradox that Germans regard China as a cheap low technology, copying poor devil Country. U can betaken this phenomenon every day in the television and on the internet. Its like they were brainwashed. I have the feeling that all this were controlled secretly from the German Goverment. Now wonder. They are and have ever beeing pros at Propaganda.
For example the program "Galileo" compare regulary divices from low cheap copying poor devil China with a common product. They realy compared the Nintendo DS for 200€ with the cheapest fake which was bought from Ebay. Finally they come to the conclusion that China product are ******* poor... wtf... why dont they compare a mobile phone? Oh right germans dont produce that....
I can go on for ever.

germany is no longer among the geopolitical titans and this really, really affects the intellectual maturity of its people. pity, because these are the scions of clausewitz, bismarck, moltke, ludendorff. but then, even among chinese, we see this intellectual degradation among daibazis and gangbazis. so chinese blood is no insurance of great wisdom
 
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Medial china Bashing (exclude Hongkong) goes on.
I saw a regular weekly documentation on "ARD". These documentations are about half hour and were broadcast every sunday before the "Tagesschau", which is famous for their "independent" and "serious" news.
The topic was the "chinese invasion" in Hongkong. Yes i quoted from their speech.
The report says that chinese people mass invade Hongkong stealing their jobs. Also the chinese bring luxulary stores with them which suppress the traditional Honkong stores. -> Chinese in Honkong destroy the Honkong culture after 15 years china integrate Hongkong to its regime (German Journalists love this word and they never used to say that Hongkong was a british colony and was given back to china in the report. All this will have a effect to unknown people as if china confiscated Hongkong).
They interviewed Honkonger (they never use the world Honkong chinese) and Mainland Chinese.
The Hongkonger say that chinese are like locusts. They are dirty, They cant behave, they piss everywhere, stole Jobs, they are arrogant etc.
Chinese say that they have to bring more respect.
I would say that Hongkonger are arrogant but no. The report claims that Chinese are the arrogant people who dont respect the Hongkonger. I was like WTFFFfff epic propaganda. The report goes on but i dont feel like to write more.
Former time i though Germany is a domocratic constitutional state which include independent and free journalism.
 
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Götterdämmerung;2543894 said:
Hi every body,

I would like to open a new thread dealing with the bilateral relationship between China and my country Germany and how we view on China. Since Germany is part of the EU - one might say the core of the EU - I would also include news and other information of our neighbours that are related to China.

Most articles I will post will be in German, but since German and English are very much related, google translate does a pretty good job to make them understandable to the non-GErman speakers.

I would like to start with a news article from the Tagesschau, Germany's premier TV news.



China schenkt Afrikanischer Union millionenteuren Hauptsitz | tagesschau.de

Also extremly interesting is the comment section of the news. As you can see, there are quite a few of my countrymen/women who are very knowledgable of China and have a very positiv view of China. So enjoy! :pop:

China schenkt Afrikanischer Union millionenteuren Hauptsitz | meta.tagesschau.de

I am always wondering what makes US a better ally/friends to Germany than China? Seriously, China is/will be the largest market of German. And unlike US attacked euro for saving their USD, China haven't damage German in anyway and I see a lot of parternership is going on.
So it's still because of the old "commie" story? I don't get it... I only care the deed of my friend but not his political standying or race.
 
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Although there no official polls in china on this matter, but from reading forums and mini blogs around, my impression is that Chinese people have very favorable opinions of Germans and many even worship them. If the 2 countries are going to achieve closer ties, your Government , medias and the Chinese Government must do better jobs.
Dunken Schoen, oops, its been more than 20 years and I must have lost it.
Let's put Karl Marx aside(LoL). I guess that is because of the engineering culture. German industry is relatively small but with high precision, while Chinese products are often kind of rough...
And Germany gives China impression as a modest, diligent and prudent country. Chinese appreciate those qualities.
 
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Medial china Bashing (exclude Hongkong) goes on.
I saw a regular weekly documentation on "ARD". These documentations are about half hour and were broadcast every sunday before the "Tagesschau", which is famous for their "independent" and "serious" news.
The topic was the "chinese invasion" in Hongkong. Yes i quoted from their speech.
The report says that chinese people mass invade Hongkong stealing their jobs. Also the chinese bring luxulary stores with them which suppress the traditional Honkong stores. -> Chinese in Honkong destroy the Honkong culture after 15 years china integrate Hongkong to its regime (German Journalists love this word and they never used to say that Hongkong was a british colony and was given back to china in the report. All this will have a effect to unknown people as if china confiscated Hongkong).
They interviewed Honkonger (they never use the world Honkong chinese) and Mainland Chinese.
The Hongkonger say that chinese are like locusts. They are dirty, They cant behave, they piss everywhere, stole Jobs, they are arrogant etc.
Chinese say that they have to bring more respect.
I would say that Hongkonger are arrogant but no. The report claims that Chinese are the arrogant people who dont respect the Hongkonger. I was like WTFFFfff epic propaganda. The report goes on but i dont feel like to write more.
Former time i though Germany is a domocratic constitutional state which include independent and free journalism.

Germany is democratic internally (declining) and to our allies, outside of our cultural sphere you either are not geopolitically or economically important, then the ruling class would just ignore you, if not you will be demonised in unison with the US. In fact, it's the US and its moles that have been implanted in out society since 1945 that are in the key positions of our society, aka the Transatlantic Bridge.

I am always wondering what makes US a better ally/friends to Germany than China? Seriously, China is/will be the largest market of German. And unlike US attacked euro for saving their USD, China haven't damage German in anyway and I see a lot of parternership is going on.
So it's still because of the old "commie" story? I don't get it... I only care the deed of my friend but not his political standying or race.

I know, but our society has been brainwashed for over 40 years and by US propaganda and our ruling class is infested with US implants.
 
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The tagesschau has started a new series with the name China's Worldbrands of Tomorrow. Haier is the first in the series, probably because it started its success with the licence production of Liebherr (LiboHaier) fridges, Germany's numero uno fridge producer.

Serie: Chinas Weltmarken von morgen (1)
Haier - Weiße Ware aus Qingdao

China ist die zweitgrößte Volkswirtschaft der Welt - und dennoch kennt kaum jemand die Konzerne, deren Marktanteile kontinuierlich steigen. Markus Rimmele stellt in einer Serie Chinas Weltmarken von morgen vor. Zunächst hat er den Haushaltsgeräte-Hersteller Haier besucht, dessen Name einen sehr deutschen Ursprung hat.

Von Markus Rimmele, ARD-Hörfunkstudio Schanghai, aus Qingdao

Waschmaschinen, wohin das Auge blickt. Selbst über den Köpfen fahren sie auf Transportbändern vorbei. Besuch bei Haier in der ostchinesischen Küstenstadt Qingdao. Vier Produktionslinien gibt es in der Halle. An jeder stehen 70 Arbeiter. Jede Linie produziert 1300 Maschinen am Tag. An Produktionslinie 2 sind alle Beschriftungen auf den Maschinen deutsch. Diese Geräte sind für den deutschen Markt bestimmt.

"Deutschland ist ein besonders schwieriger Markt"

"Im Laden in Deutschland wird die Maschine 229 Euro kosten. Das ist das Einstiegsmodell. Die teuerste verkaufen wir derzeit für 599 Euro", erklärt Wang Xiaowei. Er ist der Produktmanager für den deutschen Markt bei Haier. Rund 70.000 Mitarbeiter beschäftigt der Konzern weltweit, von Qingdao bis Deutschland und Pakistan. Das Unternehmen produziert vor allem Weiße Ware: Waschmaschinen, Kühl- und Gefrierschränke, Geschirrspüler.

haier100~_v-grossgalerie16x9.jpg

Die angeblich kleinste automatische Waschmaschine der Welt präsentierte Haier 2011 auf der "China International Consumer Electronics Show" (Foto: picture alliance / dpa)

Die Waschmaschinen für Deutschland entstehen alle hier in Qingdao. Deutschland ist ein besonders schwieriger Markt, sagt Wang, ein wenig seufzend: "Die heimischen deutschen Marken sind sehr stark. Und die Deutschen sind sehr kritisch. Sie verzeihen auch nicht den geringsten Produktionsfehler. Sie verlangen die beste Qualität und immer zum günstigsten Preis!"

Die Nummer Eins mit 7,8 Prozent Weltmarktanteil

Doch genau aus diesem Grund sei Haier auch gleich nach Deutschland gegangen, als der Konzern anfing, in Europa zu expandieren, erzählt Sun Shubao, Europa-Geschäftsführer bei Haier. "Das ist unsere Strategie - erst in die schwierigsten Märkte gehen, dann in die anderen. Nur wenn wir in den schwierigsten Märkten erfolgreich sind, können wir auch leicht auf die anderen gelangen. Das erste Land, das wir in Angriff genommen haben in Europa, war Deutschland. Die Verbraucher dort sind besonders schwer zu überzeugen. Wir haben unsere deutsche Firma 2004 gegründet. Pro Jahr wächst unser Geschäft dort um 30 bis 40 Prozent."

Haier ist laut Umfragen nach dem Computerhersteller Lenovo die bekannteste chinesische Marke weltweit. Der Name klingt irgendwie deutsch. Und das ist auch kein Zufall. In den Achtzigerjahren war die Firma noch unter anderem Namen Lizenznehmer beim deutschen Kühlschrankhersteller Liebherr - auf chinesisch "Libohaier". Das Libo fiel weg, Haier blieb übrig. Und Haier ist heute ein Weltkonzern. Mit 7,8 Prozent Marktanteil ist das Unternehmen Weltmarktführer bei Haushaltsgeräten. In Deutschland hat der Konzern bei Waschmaschinen nach eigenen Angaben bereits einen Marktanteil von drei Prozent erobert.

Seine Herkunft hängt Haier nicht an die große Glocke

Dass Haier aus China kommt, hängt der Konzern im Ausland nicht an die große Glocke. Auf der Europa-Webseite fällt das Wort China nicht ein einziges Mal. Zhang Tieyan ist Marketing-Chefin von Haier. "Haier kommt aus China. Das ist eine Tatsache", erklärt sie. "Aber in der PR und im täglichen Geschäft ist die lokale Ausrichtung auf den Märkten wichtiger. Wir haben Forschung und Marketingabteilungen vor Ort. Also: Wir verstecken unsere Herkunft nicht, aber wir betonen sie auch nicht."

Haier tut alles, um als Weltkonzern, nicht als chinesische Marke wahrgenommen zu werden. "Made in China" steht im Ausland noch immer für billig und schlecht. Beides will Haier nicht sein.
 
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Götterdämmerung;2771716 said:
The tagesschau has started a new series with the name China's Worldbrands of Tomorrow. Haier is the first in the series, probably because it started its success with the licence production of Liebherr (LiboHaier) fridges, Germany's numero uno fridge producer.

Haier has done some very interesting things recently.

Have you seen the TV you control directly with your mind?
 
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