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Rouhani calls on Erdoğan to take united stance against U.S. agresssion

The problem with Pakistan is its a weak state on the ideology basis what is to "mean to be a Pakistani" all these problems with Iran and Saudi or others interfering with our nation will only stop when our people see hope in the ideology of the state
If you ask me its more about the language and baradari system than ideology..Pakistanis have never been taught their true history at school.A lot of stuff we talk about here on pdf.
but i dont want to derail the thread here..
 
If you ask me its more about the language and baradari system than ideology..Pakistanis have never been taught their true history at school.A lot of stuff we talk about here on pdf.
but i dont want to derail the thread here..

And tell me why cause the state has no concrete ideology to back up its history
 
And tell me why cause the state has no concrete ideology to back up its history

No because we like easy money..

we like to stay in our small communal structures and build for only our little communities.
Secondly we liek to import islam from outside and love being tag team partners.
 
NATO forms a threat for Iran and turkey hosts them and is a part of Nato. Turkey got happy with the terror strike on Suleimani.
 
No because we like easy money..

we like to stay in our small communal structures and build for only our little communities.
Secondly we liek to import islam from outside and love being tag team partners.

Pakistanis are the people of IVC, Ghaznavid, Mughals..We ruled part of the Turko-mongol empire and persian empire while sitting in Lahore..
Our ideology is not on lines of blood but on heritage and may be thats why we are close to Turks and different from Iranians or Indians.

Again lets leave it for some other thread.
 
No because we like easy money..

we like to stay in our small communal structures and build for only our little communities.
Secondly we liek to import islam from outside and love being tag team partners.

I think you are rephrasing what I was saying I agree if there is one thing we need to purge is these "Punjabi" clans and feudal crap asap, and being rentier state does not help

Pakistanis are the people of IVC, Ghaznavid, Mughals..We ruled part of the Turko-mongol empire and persian empire while sitting in Lahore..
Our ideology is not on lines of blood but on heritage and may be thats why we are close to Turks and different from Iranians or Indians.

Again lets leave it for some other thread.
 
Yes I can agree with you, and it looks really hilarious from my perspective that, while Iran harrasing Pakistani air space with UAV's (Your airforce shot down few Iranian Uavs, right?) while Iran supports India for their spy traffic your people still loves Iran. Is this some sort of masochistic pleasure? Do they like to hurt by Iran and after that they ask for more?

Turks have far better relations with Iran than Pakistan ever had with Iran.Your people-to-people contact is better.You gave them a good business by risking sanctions on that pipeline after what they do to you.. Turkey continues to maintain those relations ,Erdogan reading Farsi poems etc. etc.

The point is states continue to work together despite ifs and buts here and there.You cant open a war front with all.As for the Pakistani public dont mind these buffoons who even believe Iran has busted Us a$$,its not their fault..Pakistani media was 90% pro-iran in the recent Us-Iran spat.. For Paks US is an axis of evil and anything that appears countering it is doing good.
 
Turks have far better relations with Iran than Pakistan ever had with Iran.Your people-to-people contact is better.You gave them a good business by risking sanctions on that pipeline after what they do to you.. Turkey continues to maintain those relations ,Erdogan reading Farsi poems etc. etc.

The point is states continue to work together despite ifs and buts here and there.You cant open a war front with all.As for the Pakistani public dont mind these buffoons who believe Iran has busted Us a$$,its not their fault..Pakistani media was 90% pro-iran in the recent Us-Iran spat.. For Paks US is an axis of evil and anything that appears countering it is doing good.

Turkey has much more trade than Pakistan could ever imagine with Iran first we have too look at Iran proper thats mainly the western portion of the country Tehran is right in the middle they are not very far from Turkey and ex Soviet republics Armenia Azerbaijan,Turkmenistan right across the Caspian is Russia itself Pakistan borders the frontier which is basically desert and small towns like Zahedan not ideal for trade and by Iranian standards Sistan Balochistan is poor asf while Iranian Azeribaijan or Western Azerbaijan is the most wealthy and trade province in Iran and Azeris have long history in Iran's politics and society

The point is states continue to work together despite ifs and buts here and there.You cant open a war front with all.As for the Pakistani public dont mind these buffoons who even believe Iran has busted Us a$$,its not their fault..Pakistani media was 90% pro-iran in the recent Us-Iran spat.. For Paks US is an axis of evil and anything that appears countering it is doing good.[/QUOTE]

There is big disconnect between the populace I would say the public despite their hesitation of Iran in last few years would side with in case of US aggression and the US is viewed more negative than by the elites
 
So Pakistan should negotiate while Turkey should fight.

What lunacy is this?
 
Turks ruled persians for centuries, persians rules South Azerbaijan, it is just what history is. But yes, we are never gonna be allies, because of your traitor nature. So, you are alone, enjoy it.
Those were Iranian Turks and have nothing to do with your country. Anyways, lets not forget that the whole Turko-Persian wars and rivalry started after Ottomans decided to invade Persia and failed. There were no rivalry between Ottoman and Persian Empire prior to Ottoman invasion. Dont act like you are innocent and we are traitors. You started the whole rivalry. You even invaded us from west when Russians invaded from North. Still you failed.

The Achaemenid Persian Empire ruled both east and west, it collapsed after Alexanders invasion. Alexanders Empire collapsed shortly after ruling east and west.

History teaches us it is impossible to rule and hold both the east and west. The Sassanian Persian Empire collapsed after decades of wars with Byzants. Persians tried to conquer Byzants in the west, Byzants tried to concqer Persians in the east. Both Empires were exhausted and when the Arabs invaded the Persian Empire it was a cakewalk because of decades with endless wars.

The Caliphate ruled east and west, the empire used a Persian model and had Persian bureaucrats, it collapsed after Persians revolted.

Ottoman Empire became vulnerable and collapsed after decades of war trying to invade the Persian Empire.

It is strategically impossible to hold and rule both the east and west.

Both Ottomans and Persians recognized this fact and signed the treaty of Chalderan.

Today Iran and Turkey may never become true allies, but we are not enemies, we are simply rivals.

I just thank god Iranians are not sectarian by nature, in the presence of war and distress. All minorities, religions rally behind the same Iranian flag. This have been proven countless times. If Turks of Iran revolt, Iran collapses. But thankfully during the Ottoman and Russian invasions. Turks of Iran proved their loyalty belongs to Iran.

Our only weaklink are the treacherous Kurds. But this is also a common problem in Turkey. If anything, Iran and Turkey need to work together on the Kurd issue, or we might face a bitter reality in the future.

Kurds are reproducing like crazy, and moving in to all Turkish cities in Iran. If something is not done, Turkey will not share a border with friendly Iranian Turks, they will share a border with hostile Kurds. The last thing we need is a unified Kurdish buffer state that links both Turkey and Iran.

Western Azerbaijan is the most wealthy and trade province in Iran and Azeris have long history in Iran's politics and society

I am from Western Azerbaijan, you are right that Azeris have a long history in politics and Iranian society. Iran have been ruled by Turkish dynasties longer than Persian ones. But Western Azerbaijan is not a rich province at all. We lack oil. We would not survive without support from the government. But Western Azerbaijan is probably the most important strategic location in Iran. If you manage to take control over Western Azerbaijan, you can invade the rest of Iran without difficulties. The richest province is Khuzestan, thats were all the oil comes from.
 
One of the most ridiculous fights in this forum is the attempt to use the heraldic wars of ancient times (Even the concept of modern nationalism had not been formed yet, culture and religious motifs were in the foreground) as a means of todays nationalism.

Very deep historical topics cannot be discussed with slogans. And population and migration movements cannot be ignored in the inter-state hegemony war. Oghuzes, who established the first attachments to todays Iraq and Syria, came from Khazar basin over Iran. An important part of the early Anatolian Turks (that Marco Polo referred to as "Turcomans" on his map) came directly from the Iranian territory of today. This bridge has even created a wonderful civilization like the Seljuks.

Iranian peoples and Oghuz Turks are people who are very close brotherhood and have a culture of living together. If you look at historical sources academically, not ideologically, you will see this easily. There are many hybrid nation were arised from the combination of Turkish and Iranian culture in wide range geography. However, i think everyone has some ideas about the political consequences of the Safavid and Ottoman conflict. Religious separation and dynasty struggles weakened these ties over time, not everywhere but mostly between two mainlands.

Anyway, today, Iranian Turks are an inseparable part of Iran; Azeris or Turkmens whatever. And Turkish people from TR will always continue to support Iran's territorial integrity. demographically world's 3rd or 4rd largest Turkish country is Iran. Despite USA's deep structuring provoke to TR in everytime; Turkey never been support the separatist activities in Iran.

Despite all the contradictions and difficulties between Turkey and Iran , they are still the two major stronghold of the region and if one of them will become dissapeared, the complete and permanent inavsion on the region can be done.

Iran's current regime is also appreciated by majority of the Iranian people.If there is a problem, it is the Iranian people who will solve it. Military coup or foreign intervention; All interventions, except the will of the Iranian people, will have an unacceptable status. Not just from Iranians here but also from us.
 
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Is it not your interest side with Muslim countries when they are against US?? If you can not support another Muslim country and formulate a common goal to safe guard Muslim nations then what is point in meeting in Malaysia??
I know my interests, thanks.
 
Iran was the first Muslim country cheerleading the invasion of Afghanistan after 9/11. Today, their time has come to pay for that cheerleading mistake.
Don't spread lies and disinformation .iran was the country who opposed both attack on Iraq and Afghanistan. And don't let me write the list of the countries who supported twice invasions of Iraq and invasions of Afghanistan . don't let me again write the list of countries who gave their bases to USA and NATO for those invasion .
Be assured you will not like that list.
 
Turkey is allowing money laundering for iran
Also iranian companies are opening branches in Turkey so that they can escape sanctions
In fact Turkey is already helping Iran too much we shouldn’t forget that Iraq banned turkish eggs and other products and started importing iranian eggs which are much more expensive Turkey could sabotage this ban but didn’t do it
In the event of US-Iranian conflict incirlik base won’t be used that’s for sure
Only if iranian armed forces loose control over turkish-iranian border cities then turkish military intervention is inevitable
I think iranians would rather choose turkish TEMPORARY control rather than pkkstan inside iran
In fact i have feeling that iranians would rather choose even permanent turkish military control over western iran than qurdistan
 
Turkey is allowing money laundering for iran
Also iranian companies are opening branches in Turkey so that they can escape sanctions
In fact Turkey is already helping Iran too much we shouldn’t forget that Iraq banned turkish eggs and other products and started importing iranian eggs which are much more expensive Turkey could sabotage this ban but didn’t do it
In the event of US-Iranian conflict incirlik base won’t be used that’s for sure
Only if iranian armed forces loose control over turkish-iranian border cities then turkish military intervention is inevitable
I think iranians would rather choose turkish TEMPORARY control rather than pkkstan inside iran
In fact i have feeling that iranians would rather choose even permanent turkish military control over western iran than qurdistan
Halkbank is still targeted by the US Senate. Most important reason were the crude oil export to Turkey and India over Iran's Halkbank offshore accounts, in other words it is attempt to pierce the USA's unjust Iran embargo. The bank's USA operations chief executive, Hakan Atilla, was in prison for a long time because he refused the US prosecutor's request for an agreement. He stood upright heroically, and when he was released and returned to the country, he was made head of Istanbul Stock Exchange . In other words, a very clear message was given to the foreign investor.
 

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