Punjab and the British Indian Army

[TheGreatMaratha]

I have seen many Shaikhs in Maharashtra.

Do you have relatives in Maharashtra? Shaikh might be one of the most common surname among Muslims here, maybe along with Pathan.

 

[Naofumi]

The names in the Valley are very stratified and occupation bound. Dars and Butts were originally Dhar and Bhat, but for the rest, there was a very definite assignment of names to occupations. I would rather consult one of my KP or KM friends on this.

Bhatta (or called Daal Bhatta mockingly) is used for entire KP community by KM, though there are specific list of surnames relating to different gotras and professions.

 

[ArainGang]

On the Sikh vs Muslim Jat demographics:

Most Sikh Jats were settled agricultural land owners, which the British prized as the ideal recruit. Most Muslim Jats were pastoralists, which was seen as a lifestyle that produced "lesser" soldiers.

Also, Sikhs generally considered military service to be an honorable profession, while Muslims typically saw it as a desperate option for people who had no other means to sustain themselves.

 

[Joe Shearer]

Yup, both Qanungoh and Shaikh are rather titles not caste, but Shaikh have devolved into a caste in some regions losing the different origins.

Was it you or @xeuss who objected to Khalid Anis Ansari's Pasmanda theories?

On the Sikh vs Muslim Jat demographics:

Most Sikh Jats were settled agricultural land owners, which the British prized as the ideal recruit. Most Muslim Jats were pastoralists, which was seen as a lifestyle that produced "lesser" soldiers.

Also, Sikhs generally considered military service to be an honorable profession, while Muslims typically saw it as a desperate option for people who had no other means to sustain themselves.

Still true.

 

[Naofumi]

Was it you or @xeuss who objected to Khalid Anis Ansari's Pasmanda theories?

Not me.

 

[Joe Shearer]

On the Sikh vs Muslim Jat demographics:

Most Sikh Jats were settled agricultural land owners, which the British prized as the ideal recruit. Most Muslim Jats were pastoralists, which was seen as a lifestyle that produced "lesser" soldiers.

Also, Sikhs generally considered military service to be an honorable profession, while Muslims typically saw it as a desperate option for people who had no other means to sustain themselves.

Look what a thread you started! LOL. It's going on and on.

 

[Naofumi]

Bhatta (or called Daal Bhatta mockingly) is used for entire KP community by KM, though there are specific list of surnames relating to different gotras and professions.

Daal Bhatta means Daal eating Bhatta (Hindu) like PTM etc uses Daalkhor for Punjabis, lol.

While KPs are meat eaters and love their Wazwan.

 

[xeuss]

Was it you or @xeuss who objected to Khalid Anis Ansari's Pasmanda theories?

Guilty as charged

 

[Joe Shearer]

Daal Bhatta means Daal eating Bhatta (Hindu) like PTM etc uses Daalkhor for Punjabis, lol.

While KPs are meat eaters and love their Wazwan.

Some contradiction here. Why call a meat eater a Daal Bhatta?

Guilty as charged

;-)

 

[Naofumi]

On the Sikh vs Muslim Jat demographics:

Most Sikh Jats were settled agricultural land owners, which the British prized as the ideal recruit. Most Muslim Jats were pastoralists, which was seen as a lifestyle that produced "lesser" soldiers.

Also, Sikhs generally considered military service to be an honorable profession, while Muslims typically saw it as a desperate option for people who had no other means to sustain themselves.

But Jat was somewhat synonym to a Peasant (Wikipedia states), so how Muslim Jats were pastoralists?

I mean are there some sources that dictates that?

 

[Joe Shearer]

I'm sorry, I have to leave now, residual cooking, house chores, and finishing the note in @Nilgiri 's thread that I stopped writing two days ago.

Talk to you soon.

 

[Naofumi]

Some contradiction here. Why call a meat eater a Daal Bhatta?

As a mocking word, Muslims know they eat meat but you know the logic works rarely in mockery.

 

[Pan-Islamic-Pakistan]

Looks like araingang does piss poor job at research.

Yes, another such thread. He should spend more time formulating his views by reading Pakistani sources in Urdu, or listening to lectures from respected Pakistani historians.

As many may have heard, there were many theories on why India and Pakistan came into being.

One theory that I have heard, and this is independently from both Pakistani Punjabis and Indian Sikhs, is that Nehru and the British did not want a Punjabi dominated army in a unified India. They felt that the Punjabi dominated army would sooner, rather than later, rule from Delhi and would present an existential threat to the "establishment".

@Joe Shearer @masterchief_mirza your thoughts?

Unionists failed against Muslim League.

Again Indian Muslim analysis on Pakistan formation fails.

The idea of Pakistan was popular among all regions in Pakistan, furthermore Quaid e Azam's popularity had a major part to play.

 

[Joe Shearer]

As a mocking word, Muslims know they eat meat but you know the logic works rarely in mockery.

<sigh!>

They are notorious among Brahmins (along with the Saraswats, who claim descent from them, and Bengali Brahmins of all five varieties) for being meat- and fish-eaters.

 

[xeuss]

Unionists failed against Muslim League.

Again Indian Muslim analysis on Pakistan formation fails.

The idea of Pakistan was popular among all regions in Pakistan, furthermore Quaid e Azam's popularity had a major part to play.

Perhaps you should read closely what I said. I relayed a theory that I have heard from Pakistani Punjabis and Indian Sikhs.

You can call the theory absurd or ludicrous, but don't portray it as an "Indian Muslim analysis", because I am not analyzing anything, just relaying what I heard from your own brethren. Perhaps you need to take this up with the Pakistani Punjabis who told me this.