Featured Project Azm: Pakistan's Ambitious Quest to Develop 5th Generation Military Technologies.

[PakFactor]

That is what the AZM project was really about - and there is a lot of young talent participating. Many are being cultivated and those that can understand and tolerate the system are and will continue to make big impacts.

Nothing goes to waste even in a proverbially rotten system such as Pakistan’s. There are plenty of honest, intelligent and hardworking people in all walks of life - within state structure and in private sectors that are the primary reason Pakistan still exists. Their shoulders burdened and knotted with stress but they keep smiling as best as they can and go on. Frankly the rest of Pakistan should offer Shukrana nafls every day just because these people exist.

Azm did not begin with ACM Aman - I heard it from the first team back in the late 2010s when the J-20 images were still being hidden away. But the requirements were refined and refined until what is now being sent as RFPs on components from sources abroad and internal. PCB boards being ordered to specifications and designs done in Pakistan.

You are exactly right, this is what makes me proud to be a Pakistani Nationalist, despite traitors within our nation who keep stabbing us in our stomach, we still hand, I truly feel we have a special purpose.

I tried to ask my friend about the AZM Project, I'm just surprised he wouldn't reveal much.
This is one item in Pakistan that has me curious.

 

[Moon]

There's been a lot of discussion about AI in warfare in this thread, but what about designing and manufacturing?

The designer changing the way aircraft are built

By dreaming up radical new structures, designers are helping aircraft to become lighter, stronger and more efficient. Yet the minds behind these innovations are not human.

www.bbc.com

I know this is a bit off topic, but AI is already being used to build motor vehicles (high performance ones afaik) so why do we not let a computer AI completely build a fighter jet? We feed in design parameters, materials, RCS requirements, existing flight data and let the AI build a highly detailed CAD? We would need to teach it how to make airframes etc... But it's all doable.

We can then use another AI to essentially design jigs and whatnot for our aircraft to rapidly manufacture it.
PAF is already working on AI so this could be possible too.

An example of an AI built car:

Well?

PS, We dont have to 3d print stuff, we can set those things in our hypothetical IA

 

[JamD]

There's been a lot of discussion about AI in warfare in this thread, but what about designing and manufacturing?

The designer changing the way aircraft are built

By dreaming up radical new structures, designers are helping aircraft to become lighter, stronger and more efficient. Yet the minds behind these innovations are not human.

www.bbc.com

I know this is a bit off topic, but AI is already being used to build motor vehicles (high performance ones afaik) so why do we not let a computer AI completely build a fighter jet? We feed in design parameters, materials, RCS requirements, existing flight data and let the AI build a highly detailed CAD? We would need to teach it how to make airframes etc... But it's all doable.

We can then use another AI to essentially design jigs and whatnot for our aircraft to rapidly manufacture it.
PAF is already working on AI so this could be possible too.

An example of an AI built car:

Well?

PS, We dont have to 3d print stuff, we can set those things in our hypothetical IA

Unfortunately AI has become the hot new thing and consequently the hype train tends to exaggerate what it can do. AI cannot do all of the things you are suggesting - at least not current AI's. Secondly, even if you wanted to construct such an AI, that AI would need to be trained (or train itself), which will require either tonnes of data from actual aircraft design, or basically a ridiculous amount of compute power.

With that being said, AI does have a crucial place in design. Digital twins/digital engineering is one. There's a lot of work that can be sped up and made cheaper. But AI is not a magic lamp.

 

[Scorpiooo]

prototype kub a raha hay ? its been 4 years, any idea? 2024 ?

Alteast one decade or more away

Just remember my dream, "Bilal, I don't think next-generation has to be fifth generation..."

It's coming true.

@Bilal Khan (Quwa) you mean it can be 5th gen plus something like 5th + or 5.5th ?

 

[SQ8]

Unfortunately AI has become the hot new thing and consequently the hype train tends to exaggerate what it can do. AI cannot do all of the things you are suggesting - at least not current AI's. Secondly, even if you wanted to construct such an AI, that AI would need to be trained (or train itself), which will require either tonnes of data from actual aircraft design, or basically a ridiculous amount of compute power.

With that being said, AI does have a crucial place in design. Digital twins/digital engineering is one. There's a lot of work that can be sped up and made cheaper. But AI is not a magic lamp.

Ten IF-ELSE statements can be qualified as AI.
True AI is more than the ability to reach a decision and the ability to change that decision matrix not just by parameters but by structure itself. Unfortunately, in my view a lot of “fuzzy-logic” type programming is qualified as AI.

The day an artificial program is given a problem that it doesn’t have the answer for immediately and then automatically thinks of other worse things that could happen to it is when true AI will emerge.

 

[Moon]

Unfortunately AI has become the hot new thing and consequently the hype train tends to exaggerate what it can do. AI cannot do all of the things you are suggesting - at least not current AI's. Secondly, even if you wanted to construct such an AI, that AI would need to be trained (or train itself), which will require either tonnes of data from actual aircraft design, or basically a ridiculous amount of compute power.

With that being said, AI does have a crucial place in design. Digital twins/digital engineering is one. There's a lot of work that can be sped up and made cheaper. But AI is not a magic lamp.

Even if AI can do half the things mentioned (design efficient low RCS shapes, aid in finding the most efficient manufacturing techniques etc... It's already being done as mentioned in the article) we can greatly speed up the process.
For feeding in data for shapes, we can use 3D scanners on accurate aircraft models (or real ones). For flight data we can use all we've gathered from the JF-17 project and feed it in.
I can bet you, if we had AI during Thunders development, it would be a very different beast.

And what about my second point? If we build a CAD of the aircraft, can an AI be used to to manufacture or at least design jigs and tooling that complement it?

 

[JamD]

Even if AI can do half the things mentioned (design efficient low RCS shapes, aid in finding the most efficient manufacturing techniques etc... It's already being done as mentioned in the article) we can greatly speed up the process.
For feeding in data for shapes, we can use 3D scanners on accurate aircraft models (or real ones). For flight data we can use all we've gathered from the JF-17 project and feed it in.
I can bet you, if we had AI during Thunders development, it would be a very different beast.

And what about my second point? If we build a CAD of the aircraft, can an AI be used to to manufacture or at least design jigs and tooling that complement it?

AI in its current form is basically optimization/curve fitting. Basically. These kinds of nontechnical articles ride precisely the hype train I was mentioning, exaggerating what the AI actually achieved. Optimization (AI) can and is used for structural design, RCS reduction, and all the good things you're thinking of but in a very very curated manner done by subject matter experts. Its NOT as easy (or possible) as you're making it out to be.

And when I said you need data for aircraft design you dont need JF17s data you need hundreds and thousands of different aircraft designs. AI overcomes the lack of understanding by VERY large amounts of data. I repeat: AI is not magic.

 

[Mk-313]

I didn't see this news being discussed:

US congratulates Pakistani students after they beat MIT, Stanford in aeronautics contest

Some people keep undermining our talent, brains and potential!
Pessimism kills more dreams than anything! We need to appreciate our talent and promote it too.

why? because your newspaper would be utterly humiliated for posting fake news. anyway here are the results of the 2020 . the 2021 competition is still underway maybe pakistan wins the current one. i have attached the link to the most current results

Previous Competitions

www.aiaa.org

 

[maverick1977]

Alteast one decade or more away

@Bilal Khan (Quwa) you mean it can be 5th gen plus something like 5th + or 5.5th ?

Thats too far out…

 

[Scorpiooo]

Thats too far out…

Yes apx 2 decades away

 

[Bilal.]

why? because your newspaper would be utterly humiliated for posting fake news. anyway here are the results of the 2020 . the 2021 competition is still underway maybe pakistan wins the current one. i have attached the link to the most current results

View attachment 756861

Previous Competitions

www.aiaa.org

Not our news paper, it’s the US embassy who gave the news:

https://twitter.com/x/status/1362049199047667712

 

[That Guy]

There's been a lot of discussion about AI in warfare in this thread, but what about designing and manufacturing?

The designer changing the way aircraft are built

By dreaming up radical new structures, designers are helping aircraft to become lighter, stronger and more efficient. Yet the minds behind these innovations are not human.

www.bbc.com

I know this is a bit off topic, but AI is already being used to build motor vehicles (high performance ones afaik) so why do we not let a computer AI completely build a fighter jet? We feed in design parameters, materials, RCS requirements, existing flight data and let the AI build a highly detailed CAD? We would need to teach it how to make airframes etc... But it's all doable.

We can then use another AI to essentially design jigs and whatnot for our aircraft to rapidly manufacture it.
PAF is already working on AI so this could be possible too.

An example of an AI built car:

Well?

PS, We dont have to 3d print stuff, we can set those things in our hypothetical IA

Ai has already been used to design and develop fighter jets. Most recently, AI was used by the US to design a basic prototype of a 6th generation fighter, which the US manufactured and flew within 1 year, which is absolutely insane speed.

So yeah, it's possible with a super computer using a properly designed AI. The timeline of going from the blue print design, to manufacturing would shorten significantly.

 

[That Guy]

On a side note, since we're talking about AI, download AI dungeon on your phone, or play in your browser. It's a text adventure game entirely run by AI. While it does make mistakes quite often, some of the scenarios its presents, and the story telling it does can be extremely mindblowing.

If you want a taste of what a civilian level advanced ai can do, this is a good start.

https://play.aidungeon.io/

 

[SQ8]

On a side note, since we're talking about AI, download AI dungeon on your phone, or play in your browser. It's a text adventure game entirely run by AI. While it does make mistakes quite often, some of the scenarios its presents, and the story telling it does can be extremely mindblowing.

If you want a taste of what a civilian level advanced ai can do, this is a good start.

https://play.aidungeon.io/

Not AI as such. A bit of ML that is learning statements by picking key words and matching to stored responses for keywords.

 

[PakFactor]

On a side note, since we're talking about AI, download AI dungeon on your phone, or play in your browser. It's a text adventure game entirely run by AI. While it does make mistakes quite often, some of the scenarios its presents, and the story telling it does can be extremely mindblowing.

If you want a taste of what a civilian level advanced ai can do, this is a good start.

https://play.aidungeon.io/

I messed with it a bit.

This is interesting, but it did do a mistake right of the back.

> You throw oil on the Orcs from the walls and light them up.
You send men down to the gate with torches, and they light the gates. The orcs pour into the castle and begin attacking the walls. You strategize about how to proceed.