Pakistan's Own BVRAAM under Project Azm.

[Pakistan Space Agency]

oh dear...i guess you know better than the man who started the jf17 program and delivered block 1 to the airforce..
thats exactly what i mean when i say our people find faults for nothing

No, that's not what I said.

Air Marshall (Retd) Shahid Latif has said that the JF-17 Thunder Block-3 will be better than the F-16s flying with the PAF.

That is true because the JF-17 Thunder program was launched to match a fighter technologically superior as the Pakistani F-16.

What he has also clarified is that the JF-17 Thunder program will only replace the Pakistani light-weight fighter fleet, not the medium-weight F-16s.

You do understand the difference between a light-weight fighter and a medium-weight fighter, don't you?

 

[Kabotar]

Is this an educated guess or from some source?

Jf-17 came with SD-10A

AZM will have an indigenous AAM that is being worked on at xyz facility. Ramjet, long range, dual datalink.

 

[araz]

problem is we also have an inferiority complex...experts like Shahid Lateef who initaited the project is telling is that JF17 bl3 is far better than f16 blk 52 but we have people here saying no we need f16.
so no matter how good the missile is people will say let's buy American or Chinese.

Disagree that this is the case. What is being reminded to all of us is that JFT irrespective of its maturity and development remains a light weight fighter with its own limitations. We need a medium weight fighter which in our case is the 16. Just having one or the other will be inadequate and we need both to mount a defence. The utility of M3/5S is another thing that fits in well with our plans.
A

 

[MastanKhan]

No problem brother what people say because PAF doesn't consult PDF for their plans and acquisition.... Their planning and view of the analyzing the equipment is best then anyone here... So Trust your Armed forces

Hi,

That is the worst thing to do---. Large corporations in the US invite outsiders to come in anonymously and analyze their business working---.

Why is it that you pakistani kids preach failure over success---.

What information that Paf has in this day and age that an outsider will not have other than flying and air combat---.

A human being is born with a few natural instincts---food is a neccessity---and life and living is as well---.

You have a baby child---are you a father---try squeezing your baby;s neck to kill the baby---see what the baby does---will try to grab your hands and try to part them---.

So---everyone has a natural instinct for survival and as you train yourself in life---with examples---like MQM---they called themselves Tilliar Macchar Makkar---but then one day they turned to become the most vicious offensive and defensive killing machines---.


What the PAF had done to pakistan's safety and integrity---if this was your personal business---you would have fired the CEO's many a times---and would have been willing to give them negative reviews that they would never get a job in leading any business---.

So---please get this out of your head that Paf knows everything and they are right on every issue---.

 

[Trango Towers]

No, that's not what I said.

Air Marshall (Retd) Shahid Latif has said that the JF-17 Thunder Block-3 will be better than the F-16s flying with the PAF.

That is true because the JF-17 Thunder program was launched to match a fighter technologically superior as the Pakistani F-16.

What he has also clarified is that the JF-17 Thunder program will only replace the Pakistani light-weight fighter fleet, not the medium-weight F-16s.

You do understand the difference between a light-weight fighter and a medium-weight fighter, don't you?

let me say something

I am a graduate of Cranfield institute of technology. a master's in aircraft design. I won't tell you what I used to do. my 1st degree was also aerospace engineering. I just mess around here. so please spare me.

my original post was inferiority complex. not a comparison of lightweight and medium weight fighters. perhaps you should revisit my post

 

[MastanKhan]

JVs means we don't waste money on reinventing the wheel

Half of India's problems have been caused by trying to reinvent the wheel and all they ended up with was a square vedic wheel

Then forced to repeatedly go back to the drawing board, buy off the shelf and get other countries involved to fix the problems

Hi,

Thank you---absolutely---how bad was this experience---that even with blue prints and all the backing---the tank diesel engine could barely produce half the horse power that it was designed to and the fighter aircraft engine could not fly the aircraft---.

A JV would have had the products running in no time and by this time with the past experience they would be building / manufacturing their own engines with the needed output---.

If you an average wealth nation---JV is a God given opportunity to establish yourself in the field of required industry---.

JV's just don't happen just like that---you really have to be fortunate to latch on to and engineering consortium already in the business---.

 

[Trango Towers]

Hi,

That is the worst thing to do---. Large corporations in the US invite outsiders to come in anonymously and analyze their business working---.

Why is it that you pakistani kids preach failure over success---.

What information that Paf has in this day and age that an outsider will not have other than flying and air combat---.

A human being is born with a few natural instincts---fooed is a neccessity---and life and living is as well---.

You have a baby child---are you a father---try squeezing your baby;s neck to kill the baby---see what the baby does---will try to grab your hands and try to part them---.

So---everyone has a natural instinct for survival and as you train yourself in life---with examples---like MQM---they called themselves Tilliar Macchar Makkar---but then one day they turned to become the most vicious offensive and defensive killing machines---.


What the PAF had done to pakistan's safety and integrity---if this was your personal business---you would have fired the CEO's many a times---and would have been willing to give them negative reviews that they would never get a job in leading any business---.

So---please get this out of your head that Paf knows everything and they are right on every issue---.

oh, the drunk anti Pakistan rant from a man who lives in the states and has achieved nothing. but he can talk like any indian

 

[Syed1.]

Pakistan produces 20,000 IT graduates, engineers annually.
https://www.thenews.com.pk/print/54...it-graduates-engineers-annually-says-minister

Even though this number is tiny compared to what we should be producing but even if these 20,000 are given world class education they will lift up Pakistan to unimaginable heights. Unfortunately, I have some first hand experience of how engineering studies are conducted in Pakistan. The focus is more on passing the next exam or securing a good GPA through rote learning, rather than developing a creative, ingenious mind that can analyze a problem and come up with out-of-the-box solutions for it.

We seriously need to rethink our STEM education system if we have to dream big with regards to Project Azm.

 

[Shabi1]

Missiles have limited flight hours afterwards they get disposed or need to be overhauled. Making a indigenous AA missile system would give PAF self reliance in this field and give it a platform for use in local made SAM units.

Judging how India who had delays because they were reinventing the wheel as always and looking at Turkish approach who's designs are similar to Aim-9 and Aim-120. Would make sense Pakistan works on local variant of a Chinese/South African system via TOT. We have the advantage that both these countries will provide unrestricted access and willing to share the tech. for eg Raad CMs use tech inputs like the wings and tail from H-2/4 systems and perhaps even Raptor 3.

I believe for WVR as has been discussed alot here A-Dartar variant looks attractive and for BVR can look at something in bw PL-12 and PL-15. Wont be surprised if we are already making SD-10s unadvertised as we have the same missile in SAM configuration too.

Infact my own opinion is PL-10 has similarity with A-Darter and Pakistan could have been the bridge between both sides.

 

[Pakistani Fighter]

Jf-17 came with SD-10A

AZM will have an indigenous AAM that is being worked on at xyz facility. Ramjet, long range, dual datalink.

So there is something really got with Ramjet. No wonder Indians really hype Brahmos and Meteor

we have the same missile in SAM configuration too.

Really?

 

[Shabi1]

So there is something really got with Ramjet. No wonder Indians really hype Brahmos and Meteor


Really?

with Ramjet you can reduce the amount of fuel (total weight as result) needed for when compared with a rocket for same range, downside is added drag slows down missile faster near final stages. Also ramjet engine needs to be supersonic before ignition work around is a ducted rocket which is a Ramjet rocket hybrid.
PL-15 uses a pulsed solid rocket gives the best performance at all altitudes but is heavier for the added fuel.

Basically two technologies to do the same thing with their pros and cons.

So there is something really got with Ramjet. No wonder Indians really hype Brahmos and Meteor


Really?

We first got them on our type-21 frigates as LY-60 SAMs

 

[Pakistani Fighter]

We first got them on our type-21 frigates as LY-60 SAMs

DK 10s right with 70km range?

 

[bananarepublic]

Hi,

Thank you---absolutely---how bad was this experience---that even with blue prints and all the backing---the tank diesel engine could barely produce half the horse power that it was designed to and the fighter aircraft engine could not fly the aircraft---.

A JV would have had the products running in no time and by this time with the past experience they would be building / manufacturing their own engines with the needed output---.

If you an average wealth nation---JV is a God given opportunity to establish yourself in the field of required industry---.

JV's just don't happen just like that---you really have to be fortunate to latch on to and engineering consortium already in the business---.

JV for Pakistan always comes with no offsets and thats not something because of our incompetence. It has more to do with our current postion in the world as a very shaky country.
No country wants to provide offsets even the Chinese because they know that Pakistan has very few suppliers willing to provide Pakistan with its needs.
Now with the recent warming up with the Turks has given us more leverage with the Chinese, that they are not the only source for Pakistan.
Plus the turks have been very generous regarding our military procurements, a stark contrast to "agosta" deal.
We must remember our limits but also should push for our needs. In house development of core technology is a must if we are to move away from being dependent.

 

[Armchair]

Missiles have limited flight hours afterwards they get disposed or need to be overhauled. Making a indigenous AA missile system would give PAF self reliance in this field and give it a platform for use in local made SAM units.

Judging how India who had delays because they were reinventing the wheel as always and looking at Turkish approach who's designs are similar to Aim-9 and Aim-120. Would make sense Pakistan works on local variant of a Chinese/South African system via TOT. We have the advantage that both these countries will provide unrestricted access and willing to share the tech. for eg Raad CMs use tech inputs like the wings and tail from H-2/4 systems and perhaps even Raptor 3.

I believe for WVR as has been discussed alot here A-Dartar variant looks attractive and for BVR can look at something in bw PL-12 and PL-15. Wont be surprised if we are already making SD-10s unadvertised as we have the same missile in SAM configuration too.

Infact my own opinion is PL-10 has similarity with A-Darter and Pakistan could have been the bridge between both sides.

What SAMs in Pak service use SD-10 types? Sounds interesting.

 

[abrar khan]

Nice. We finished Bozdoğan WVRAAM and Gökdoğan BVRAAM land tests. Soon air tests will begin.

Here is Gökdoğan BVRAAM

Hope Pakistan will finish the project succesfully.

Testing BVRAAM from land field is something new for me its just like one testing SAM. My (silly) question, what is the difference in technology of SAM and BVRAAM? Why one cannot make some changes in radar to use BVRAAM missiles to launch from land or sea assets?