Pakistan’s overseas assets at risk after court verdict

[Abdussamad]

Negotiations come before you go to court not after a court has decided. What exactly is our leverage in these negotiations? We've lost and must pay them.

 

[Cookie Monster]

Did you read the other parts of the reports? The company has went to UK, US, TUrkey and Germany to have this ruling implemented. That mean Pakistan govt assets in those companies can be confiscated and returned to that company. It will even go to IMF. Credit rating agencies will make hell for Pakistan making loans very very costlier for companies trying to get loans to invest in Pakistan and for Pakistani companies.

Yes I did read. It is u who didn't read my response properly

I mentioned it in my post...here I'll post it again below...
"This is where the governments of Turkey/Pakistan and the other governments this company is trying to rally(Germany and others) to seize Pak's assets...all these gov need to band together and realize that this company together with another corrupt person(with his whole group) planned a sham together." (second paragraph of my post u quoted)

 

[Zulfiqar]

Negotiations come before you go to court not after a court has decided. What exactly is our leverage in these negotiations? We've lost and must pay them.

We are asking for a government to government concurrence for usage of Turkish good offices. I am sure erdogan, TAI and Turkish military can politely ask that greedy company to back down when we file the case for another petition/hearing.

We are broke as hell and can't pay the sum but we can sure back off from T 129 purchase under such circumstances.

Z-10 me may not be that good as T 129 in certain circumstances but we can make do as we previously did if the alternative is coughing up 700 mill plus USD to pay a company that produced electricity at expensive rates at less than agreed contractual dispatch level.

 

[Abdussamad]

We are asking for a government to government concurrence for usage of Turkish good offices. I am sure erdogan, TAI and Turkish military can politely ask that greedy company to back down when we file the case for another petition/hearing.

Not going to happen. This company has lost a lot of money because of us and they will want to be paid back. Our deals to acquire military hardware are a separate matter not just for the Turks but also for us. I doubt our army will be willing to back down on its purchases because of some matter involving the civilian government. Army is happy to leech all of the country's resources without thinking of the consequences to other parts of the government. Defence spending is our second largest budgetary item after debt servicing. The army's track record has always been that it puts itself first.

 

[Arulmozhi Varman]

Yes I did read. It is u who didn't read my response properly

I mentioned it in my post...here I'll post it again below...
"This is where the governments of Turkey/Pakistan and the other governments this company is trying to rally(Germany and others) to seize Pak's assets...all these gov need to band together and realize that this company together with another corrupt person(with his whole group) planned a sham together." (second paragraph of my post u quoted)

Unless you prove that in a court of law that these process had been corrupted from the start!!! Which Pakistani govt hadnt.
It isnt a unique situation. Indian SC cancelled all 2G licenses irrespective of whether company bought it legally or not. In 2012 and Russian companies sued Indian government for it. And GoI did pay for that. And why will Turkish govt will rally with Pakistan for something that is affecting Turkish companies? Domestic politics in Turkey will fry them even for trying that.

 

[Cookie Monster]

Unless you prove that in a court of law that these process had been corrupted from the start!!! Which Pakistani govt hadnt.
It isnt a unique situation. Indian SC cancelled all 2G licenses irrespective of whether company bought it legally or not. In 2012 and Russian companies sued Indian government for it. And GoI did pay for that. And why will Turkish govt will rally with Pakistan for something that is affecting Turkish companies? Domestic politics in Turkey will fry them even for trying that.

It is not my job to prove that corruption was involved...it's NAB's job.

I never said it's a unique situation. I said it sets a precedence if foreign governments allow a private company to seize assets of a sovereign nation. The governments should be careful about this bcuz it might be Pak on the receiving end of it rn...but it could easily be some other country tomorrow.

As for why would Turkey agree to it? Bcuz Turkey stands to gain much more than one company's benefit. In the right way there's much more money Turkey can get...for example it's already getting profit from contracts for Milgem/T129/upgrading Pak's submarines. These are just some of the big ticket items in the defense sector only.

A country to country relationship is much bigger in scope than just one company's payment. It's not what Turkey should or shouldn't do...it's what Pak gov should stand for. They should complete the investigation on their end and knowing Zardari, his corrupt band of thieves, and this rental power plant drama...chances are very high that there was corruption involved. Pak gov should find the proof and use that to reach out to Turkey's gov. Show them the proof of corrupt dealings. Layout the options in front of them...
1) Either they should pressure this company to back down and Pak will welcome all their companies and give them business appropriately(in the right way)

OR

2) not pressure this company to stand down...and sure Pak will then pay for this...but Pak will not do any further business with Turkish companies since they chose to do shady dealings.

This above should be a last ditch effort if Pak loses the case in court.

 

[313ghazi]

Isnt turkey our brother country lol, Slap on the face of one's who considers turkey friend. There is no friend or brother.

Would your own brother forgive you if you stole from him?

 

[SunilM]

This above should be a last ditch effort if Pak loses the case in court.

Gosh. Pakistan HAS LOST THE CASE!! These are enforcement proceedings now!! The arbitration case was lost more than a year ago.

 

[Trango Towers]

lol where is Raja Rental? these guys have made Pakistan into a drama.

Pakistan should handover avenfield apartments to Karkey...

Good start

 

[valkyr_96]

Coming Reko Diq penalty will be reportedly be around 10 Billions. This is the result of super aggressive judiciary.

are you serious you nut head. Reko diq was given over by the caretaker government for peanuts Pakistan makes nothing on it plus the gold ore goes outside of Pakistan. They had no authority and proof was shown of foreign interference. It is upto Pakistan to fight and resist against them. TCC wants the Pakistani government to give them the mines by hook or by crook they want a settlement unlike Karkay they made no investment.

 

[SunilM]

are you serious you nut head. Reko diq was given over by the caretaker government for peanuts Pakistan makes nothing on it plus the gold ore goes outside of Pakistan. They had no authority and proof was shown of foreign interference. It is upto Pakistan to fight and resist against them. TCC wants the Pakistani government to give them the mines by hook or by crook they want a settlement unlike Karkay they made no investment.

"There are glaring flaws in the Tethyan Copper Company’s (TCC) damages claim of $11.43 billion in the Reko Diq mining case that may reduce it by as much as 61 per cent, officials maintained.

The company, they said, exaggerated its future profits by underrating tax and royalty obligations by as much as 61 per cent. The damages claim was filed in the International Court for Settlement of Investment Disputes (ICSID) of the World Bank.

The hearing for quantifying damages will start on Monday (today) in London, lasting till May 24."

https://tribune.com.pk/story/1709347/1-reko-diq-damages-claim-exaggerated/

Even if we go by the Pakistani version, they think the State owes 4 billions dollars and THATS THE PAKISTANI VERSION. The loose every international arbitration. Like each and every one of them. By early next year, IK will have to make trips again seeking.....ahem...'aid', desperately!!

 

[valkyr_96]

"There are glaring flaws in the Tethyan Copper Company’s (TCC) damages claim of $11.43 billion in the Reko Diq mining case that may reduce it by as much as 61 per cent, officials maintained.

The company, they said, exaggerated its future profits by underrating tax and royalty obligations by as much as 61 per cent. The damages claim was filed in the International Court for Settlement of Investment Disputes (ICSID) of the World Bank.

The hearing for quantifying damages will start on Monday (today) in London, lasting till May 24."

https://tribune.com.pk/story/1709347/1-reko-diq-damages-claim-exaggerated/

Even if we go by the Pakistani version, they think the State owes 4 billions dollars and THATS THE PAKISTANI VERSION. The loose every international arbitration. Like each and every one of them. By early next year, IK will have to make trips again seeking.....ahem...'aid', desperately!!

This is just one news item I had previously posted some dawn articles where the PK gov had produced evidence of Antofagasta using the Chilean government to force Pakistan to commit to this deal. Please note that no elected government did this it was a caretaker setup in Balochistan. The Balochistan government has taken no action against that person but have been requesting federal help since the past 10 years. I believe the royalty was a mere 2 % with a 40% investment from Pakistan which is peanuts compared to the Chinese operated Saindak Copper Mines. Plus the ore will be sold and not refined to standards in Pakistan. The way company is structured if Pakistan even won the case it will not be able to claim any liabilities, hence the outlandish figures. There is no investment no machinery in Pakistan TCC wants the mines and they want a settlement, who does that. It seems like the value of the mine is severely undervalued.

 

[pak-marine]

Coming Reko Diq penalty will be reportedly be around 10 Billions. This is the result of super aggressive judiciary.

You are right this and khi encroachment drive and danda up malik Riaz and NS disqualification although all actions were according to the law but it seems serious consequences

 

[maithil]

are you serious you nut head. Reko diq was given over by the caretaker government for peanuts Pakistan makes nothing on it plus the gold ore goes outside of Pakistan. They had no authority and proof was shown of foreign interference. It is upto Pakistan to fight and resist against them. TCC wants the Pakistani government to give them the mines by hook or by crook they want a settlement unlike Karkay they made no investment.

Pakistan as a state made that deal. Company and the arbitration courts will not care whether the government was a caretaker one or, elected one. If the company ends up winning, they will get substantial amount.

You are right this and khi encroachment drive and danda up malik Riaz and NS disqualification although all actions were according to the law but it seems serious consequences

Yes. What’s right is not always the best. All of the above cases you mentioned will indeed have serious implications. Not sure about Nawaz though. He is done and dusted.

 

[valkyr_96]

Pakistan as a state made that deal. Company and the arbitration courts will not care whether the government was a caretaker one or, elected one. If the company ends up winning, they will get substantial amount.

No Pakistan as a state did not make the deal as the caretaker government does not have a mandate except to ensure free and fair elections. As I have already said the government has provided the proof of meddling which TCC is denying. It is evident from the structure that even if Pakistan wins TCC will have no liability. There is no equity no investment no assets that Pakistan can claim. The best thing would be if the case is settled against the foreign assets of politicians gained through laundering. I hope with this new rules are established for transparent investment.