Pakistan to skip US summit on democracy

[Khan vilatey]

Wow that’s big news, U-turn khan decided to wake up and smell the dragon

k

 

[Ghessan]

We don’t want to enter bloc politics: PM | The Express Tribune

Imran says Pakistan desires to cool off US-China tensions

tribune.com.pk

 

[Meengla]

Counterproductive move, bravado and making a statement, it's good to maintain a balance. They could have sent a delegation of lower ranked bureaucrats or something to make a statement.
Wonder how much of a role the Sino-Pak relationship played here, Pak clearly views China as their future market for defence acquisition.

I think this was correct decision. And more than China's exclusion, Biden's refusal to engage with Imran Khan made it extremely difficult to attend this farcical summit. Biden is a truly arrogant, self-absorbed old rooster! His insulting remarks about the Ghani govt--even before it was toppled--showed the guy lacks diplomatic acumen. Maybe he doesn't care much as his innings in life is ending. And, btw, this is a 'summit', meaning some very high level, if not the topmost level, attendance is expected.

 

[SIPRA]

I think this was correct decision. And more than China's exclusion, Biden's refusal to engage with Imran Khan made it extremely difficult to attend this farcical summit. Biden is a truly arrogant, self-absorbed old rooster! His insulting remarks about the Ghani govt--even before it was toppled--showed the guy lacks diplomatic acumen. Maybe he doesn't care much as his innings in life is ending. And, btw, this is a 'summit', meaning some very high level, if not the topmost level, attendance is expected.

I don't the think that Biden is in any position to make any key decision. He is merely a facade. He has turned senile and hardly knows, what is happening around him.

 

[Riz]

Wow that’s big news, U-turn khan decided to wake up and smell the dragon

k

One more small brain victim spotted

 

[RoadRunner401]

you seems don't know the ground realities or do i say i am talking about my country and we have reservations even with CPEC.

we are trapped with countless institutions, organizations, banks and many other security and human rights related departments that work in several ways particularly related to economy. we cannot ignore them.

these all can play with us anytime they want or to serve their purposes on geopolitics, one example is FATF. and if i continue you will get bored.

and i come to your point:
"Why not make your position clear and stand with the one who will always support u?"

ok support us:
improve balance of trade with us
remove duty from Pakistan imports into China
get us out of FATF
influence IMF, World Bank, ADB and other financial institutions to ease up
to some extent convert CPEC projects into "support your partner"
help us establish trade with the countries that you can influence
we are defaulting on committed tariff on power projects under CPEC, so?
we are defaulting on loan pay back, so?

any single of above will never be served that is what i am sure and the world is always this way hence we have to deal with them our way as those are either our blunders or are imposed.

Why should IMF, world bank or any other financial institution ease up on Pakistan? What have you done to fix the chronic problems? Give me one good reason, why should China jumps in and bail you out if you heaven learn what to do after 70 plus years why should the world help you?

We have over 200 crown corporations bleeding billions per year? What have we done to fix it?
We have a negligible amount of people registrar as tax payers? What have we done to fix it?
Your politicians that govern Pakistan have residence and bank accounts overseas, what have you done to fix it?

Oil prices around the world goes up except Pakistan why because of (poor people) ghareeb awam? Literally giving away billions in tax revenue just so Ghareeb awam driving around in 100 million rupee car can get cheap oil and somehow the word or China should look at us poor people and give us a break?

Countries around the world that have taken difficult but necessary decision have come out strong, I love it how you are cleverly claiming the old way of beg, borrow, aid and repeat is a better system and Pakistan being in debt is some how worlds fault.

 

[KaiserX]

Why should IMF, world bank or any other financial institution ease up on Pakistan? What have you done to fix the chronic problems? Give me one good reason, why should China jumps in and bail you out if you heaven learn what to do after 70 plus years why should the world help you?

We have over 200 crown corporations bleeding billions per year? What have we done to fix it?
We have a negligible amount of people registrar as tax payers? What have we done to fix it?
Your politicians that govern Pakistan have residence and bank accounts overseas, what have you done to fix it?

Oil prices around the world goes up except Pakistan why because of (poor people) ghareeb awam? Literally giving away billions in tax revenue just so Ghareeb awam driving around in 100 million rupee car can get cheap oil and somehow the word or China should look at us poor people and give us a break?

Countries around the world that have taken difficult but necessary decision have come out strong, I love it how you are cleverly claiming the old way of beg, borrow, aid and repeat is a better system and Pakistan being in debt is some how worlds fault.

IK has been a complete failure. I am tired of listening to his lame excuses and speeches. He has had 3 years to push reforms. Privitization of money loosing industries, building dams, etc... all talk while being surrounded by PPP/PMLNQ cronies from previous admins.

 

[TsAr]

Not a surprise at all, a new cold war is brewing, going to the summit when China has not been invited would have meant siding with USA. I think the summit has been skipped on behest of China and Russia.

 

[-=virus=-]

Each country should weight pros and cons of its diplomatic decisions. Personally, I believe that a US-Pakistan relation is much more beneficial for Pakistan than the Sino-Pak relation. It is because we are constantly in need of financial assistance and will remain that way for the foreseeable future. China, practically, is too petty with finances and all their assistance is in the shape of loans and/or advances with conditions attached (interest on finances or materialistic). Whereas the US has generally been happy just with services and is a whole lot generous with financial assistance than any other country. What we need is to walk a fine line between both the US and China with inclination towards our own benefits on each matter.

Furthermore, the US has a hegemony on global politics and finances; it is outright insane antagonizing the US. US can very simply crush Pakistani economy and China will sit in a corner and watch, just as the US did to North Korea, Iran and Afghanistan amongst other countries which have faced the US wrath. And worst of all is the unrealistic fear that the US is after our Nuclear Weapons. It is my opinion that the US only cares that our Nuclear Weapons do not fall into the wrong hands and hence has game planned eventualities but those are only in circumstances where the Military is defeated by terrorists/extremists and so negligible and inconsequential.

Could it be China behind the scenes who convinced (don't want to say coerced) Pak to do this ?

Seems pretty well not thought out tbh.

I think this was correct decision. And more than China's exclusion, Biden's refusal to engage with Imran Khan made it extremely difficult to attend this farcical summit. Biden is a truly arrogant, self-absorbed old rooster! His insulting remarks about the Ghani govt--even before it was toppled--showed the guy lacks diplomatic acumen. Maybe he doesn't care much as his innings in life is ending. And, btw, this is a 'summit', meaning some very high level, if not the topmost level, attendance is expected.

Like I said earlier, could have sent a lower level delegation.. would have made as much a statement, but a snub puts you in a not very good grouping of countries.

Not about bravado or herogiri, spl considering the economic stuff that's going on...

100% neutral view here.. cool to see, but.. probably a stupid thing to do.

oh well, your payr, your kulhadi.. sanu ki ?

 

[AZADPAKISTAN2009]

No real purpose of such summit , it was waste of time
Boycott calls against China are also stupid in Chinese Olympics

 

[Meengla]

Like I said earlier, could have sent a lower level delegation.. would have made as much a statement, but a snub puts you in a not very good grouping of countries. Not about bravado or herogiri, spl considering the economic stuff that's going on... 100% neutral view here.. cool to see, but.. probably a stupid thing to do. oh well, your payr, your kulhadi.. sanu ki ?

I am not questioning your intentions. I maintain that this being a 'summit', sending some low-level would be a 'snub' anyway. As for the consequences, I think Pakistani strategists have perfected the art of tango dance with the Americans... decades of experience.

 

[-=virus=-]

I am not questioning your intentions. I maintain that this being a 'summit', sending some low-level would be a 'snub' anyway. As for the consequences, I think Pakistani strategists have perfected the art of tango dance with the Americans... decades of experience.

sure, well played

but now it's their move...

 

[Meengla]

sure, well played. but now it's their move...

Well, I am well aware of the consequences if/when America decides to punish Pakistan. I just don't see the non-attendance is going to be the catalyst for a big rupture. That Pakistan was invited over presumed allies like Hungary shows that there is a need for Pakistan, at least as of now.
PS. A recent video by a respected Pakistani blogger Saleem Safi says that Pakistan is being pressured into joining the American camp and ditch China and CPEC and even make compromises with India. According to Safi, time is running out for Pakistan and Pakistan has to decide. FYI.

 

[khail007]

although a bold step but to me it seems it will have consequences though we already are going through in certain forms.

it also seems our foreign ministry is not keeping a balance when it comes to China and US which leads to, we are not clear with our foreign policy and still taking influences.
but, this time there may not be much hue and cry because it is China this time? then this too is wrong indeed.

IMO State of Pakistan is very well aware of the situation and the past experience while trapped between USA & USSR. Though the documentaries of that era show only a bright dimension of the events and stayed short of bitter truth about the consequential effect on Pakistan and how we were transformed to lapdog of USA. Till today we are looking for our identity back.

A good decision on the part of state of Pakistan:


Pakistan desires to bridge gaps between US, China instead of joining any bloc: PM Imran
Dawn.comPublished December 9, 2021 - Updated about 4 hours ago
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Prime Minister Imran Khan addresses Islamabad Conclave 2021. — DawnNewsTV
Prime Minister Imran Khan on Thursday said Pakistan desired not be a part of any political bloc but instead wanted to play its role in bridging gaps between the United States and China.
Addressing the Islamabad Conclave 2021, which had the theme "Peaceful and Prosperous South Asia", the prime minister said: "The situation is going towards a [new] Cold War and blocs are forming.
"Pakistan should try its best to stop the formation of these blocs because we should not become a part of any bloc."
The premier said the original Cold War between the US and the then Soviet Union had caused great loss to the world and so Pakistan did not want to get trapped in a potentially new one.
Instead, Pakistan wanted to "unite people" such as its efforts in cooling the stand-off between Saudi Arabia and Iran, he said.
"Both countries appreciated that we tried our best during a very critical phase where conflict could have occurred between them."
The prime minister added that Pakistan wanted to play a similar role in the current US-China relations and "stop their growing distances".
His comments come a day after Pakistan indicated that it may not attend President Joe Biden’s Democracy Summit, adding it would like to engage with Washington on the issue of democracy “at an opportune time in the future”.
Biden has invited around 110 countries, including major Western allies but also Iraq, India and Pakistan, to a virtual summit on democracy that is being held on December 9-10.
The US invitation had put Pakistan in a difficult spot as Washington invited Taiwan, instead of Beijing, to represent China at the summit. Russia, another major world power, was also kept out. China is Pakistan’s closest ally while Islamabad is trying to improve its ties with Moscow as well.
Policymakers in Islamabad are worried that not attending the summit would give India a free hand, which already has a strong influence in the US. But a strong Chinese reaction to the US decision to invite Taiwan made it obvious that attending the summit could seriously damage Islamabad’s relations with Beijing, a risk Pakistan could not take.
China and the US are currently undergoing a turbulent period of political relations marked by competition at various fronts. The US has also announced a boycott of the Beijing Winter Olympics over human rights concerns for which China said it would "pay the price".
Read more: China’s push on multiple fronts rattles Pentagon
UN Secretary General Antonio Guterres warned of a potential new Cold War in September. He implored China and the US to repair their “completely dysfunctional” relationship before problems between the two large and deeply influential countries spill over even further into the rest of the planet.
'Futures are connected'
The prime minister, in his speech today, also commented on the regional situation, saying the biggest problem keeping South Asia "hostage" was the Kashmir issue.
He said his government had reached out to for peace to India but got "no positive response".
"Unfortunately we weren't having an interaction with a normal Indian government but the RSS (Rashtriya Swayamsevak Sangh) ideology ... and it is very difficult to negotiate with this ideology," the prime minister rued.
Pointing to India's domestic affairs and communal divides, he said the marginalisation of certain societal segments would have "severe repercussions" on Indian society and others.
"History tells us that when you exclude people then you marginalise [people] and then you radicalise them as well," he said.
The premier said in his view, problems solved through military means and wars were subject to "miscalculations".
"Those who decide to solve problems through warfare have two traits: they don't learn from history and they have pride in their weapons," he added.
"Miscalculations happen because of these two traits and weeks-long wars kept continuing," the prime minister said, pointing to the Afghan conflict and Pakistan's internal military operations.
'Pakistan, India should focus on climate change together'
Turning to climate change, the prime minister emphasised that both Pakistan and India were vulnerable to climate change.
"Our futures are connected. We both should focus on climate change together but till now I'm not seeing that seriousness in world leaders because their commercial interests are clashing with steps needed to stop climate change," he said.
The premier stressed that countries connected together develop as a region rather than individually. "There are two problems in our region: trade is low because of political differences and conflicts and secondly we are connected because of climate change," he said.
He said that once the Kashmir dispute is sorted, other issues could be jointly tackled as well such as smog and pollution. "Until both countries don't sit together, no matter how much we do in Lahore [to control smog] we will only solve half the problem," the prime minister explained.

Pakistan desires to bridge gaps between US, China instead of joining any bloc: PM Imran

PM says Cold War had caused great loss to the world and so Pakistan does not want to be trapped in another similar tussle.

www.dawn.com

 

[Khan vilatey]

although a bold step but to me it seems it will have consequences though we already are going through in certain forms.

it also seems our foreign ministry is not keeping a balance when it comes to China and US which leads to, we are not clear with our foreign policy and still taking influences.
but, this time there may not be much hue and cry because it is China this time? then this too is wrong indeed.

I must admit this is shocking news but unfortunately, I do not believe the government had a choice and under duress they made the right choice. Here is my reasons for thinking like I do

one can choose their friends but can’t choose their Neibiour. We can not alienate China who has stood by our side through thick or thin especially after Taiwan was invited and a diplomatic blockade of China’s Winter Olympics is taking place.

The wrong decisions America is taking is happening because too many people with Indians heritage are in the US administration. Since there is heridictal bios these folks come up with Half baked, no consequence measures with only down sides to keep one’s pagri higher. Case and point alienate Pakistan when dealing with Afghanistan by allowing india to run rough shot. Why would America get into a fight with its biggest trading partner. In a pandemic where 95 % of Americans who are not of Indian decent do not care about china’s issues with india and hence do not hate China.

The fact that educated first and second generation Indians spent years working hard to earn this right to provide guidance by spending time in the us government is a separate conversation yet I find it strange that there is not a more diverse set of folks at the state department to help guide this policy.

As for Pakistan’s establishment goes the old adage is fitting which goes something like“ one can survive americas ire as an enemy but one never survives americas friendship”
in Paskitan’s case America would want paksitan to give up terrify and disintegrate so it becomes harmless to American interests in India and a bulwark like Taiwan against China. Hence
choosing between America and China was simple, choose the power that lives next to you! Moreover if one has choose between taking a bold decision and fight or destroying one’s self the choice is simple

K