Pakistan Navy Frigates & Destroyers Information pool

[帅的一匹]

The additional two 054 frigates are under negotiation.

PN will have at least three 054P(Pakistan) in the future.

They will form the mainstay fleet of anti-air and ASW operation of PN.

 

[Readerdefence]

054A is powered by four MTU120163-TB92 high speed disel engine with TOT from Germany, with 6400KW output per. China mass produced these engine domestically.

German and France sell lots of goodies to China from 1980s to early 2000s.


Hey ask for more firepower.

Hi what kind of sam is on 054a for China at the moment?
Thank you

 

[帅的一匹]

Hi what kind of sam is on 054a for China at the moment?
Thank you

HHQ16b with 70KM+range.

 

[ziaulislam]

looks like we are going for HHQ 10 instead of Type 730 dont know why but Gattling gun seems better as it is multi purpose while hq10 is simply anti air PDMS.

What Medium range missile system will be in type 054A or B version?

no HHQ 10 is a MILLION times better than gun..
you can add as many of 12.7mm guns you want on ship, you also have a large cannon what else do you want?

 

[khanasifm]

054a vs b ASUb vertical launched so not just anti air


The Type 054A frigates have an overall beam of 16 m and a full-load displacement of about 4,000 tonnes. Fitted with a flight deck and hangar, each of the vessels is likely to operate a Z-9 helicopter.

The frigates are equipped with a vertical launch system comprising 32 cells that can fire HHQ-16 surface-to-air missiles (SAMs) as well as torpedo-carrying anti-submarine missiles. The armament also includes eight C-802 anti-ship missiles and a 76 mm gun.


http://www.janes.com/article/71766/...-frigate-enters-service-with-the-chinese-navy

 

[Tank131]

News about the type 54 frigate ordered by the PN from China:
1. 100mm naval gun will be choosed instead of PJ26 76mm gun
2. PN ask CSIC to add HQ10 SAM on the type 054 variant to reinforce its ability to intercept incoming missiles in terminal defense
3. Russian Ka28 ASW will be onboard
4. PN will order some sensors and electronic instrument from overseas and integrate them in China

Overall, it's a tailored made version with Pakistan specialty.

View attachment 469112

https://mil.sina.cn/sd/2018-04-24/d...r=0&doct=0&rfunc=38&tj=none&tr=36&vt=4&pos=24

Can you post info regarding the range of the missile? I haven't found any reference to it being 80km. The HQ-16A was 40km and the B variant was said to be 70km. That being said there was a very good article regarding other aspects of this missile.

http://www.eastpendulum.com/ly-80n-systeme-vls-naval-export

It will be interesting to see what radar controls they will use. Given it is a SARH the LY-80N needs the target to be illuminated continuously. As such the Type 54A has 4 MR-90s. But this is enough to engage 8 targets which may mot be enough to overcome saturation attacks. This is why the chinese developed the an AESA radar for the land variant so that the multiple T/R modules can illuminate multiple targets at once. As the article states, there is an LY-80N radar that will be fitted into the integrated mast of the "new C28A" which appears to be a variant of the aesa radar used on HQ-16A/B. This same mast should be used in Pakistan's variant of the 054A. That will give good multi-target engagement capability.

looks like we are going for HHQ 10 instead of Type 730 dont know why but Gattling gun seems better as it is multi purpose while hq10 is simply anti air PDMS.

What Medium range missile system will be in type 054A or B version?

The PN version will likely have both the PDMS (HQ-10/FL-3000N). There is a platform above the hangar where there are numerous sensors including what appear to be 2 of the 4 MR-90 fire control radars. They will either be repositioned or replaced by an aforementioned AESA radar suite capable of muti-target engagement(ideally through a integrated mast allowing the saving of space) and improved stealth characteristics. That will allow for mounting a 18-21 cell FL-3000N unit. These are superior to the Gun based systems because of the better range and speed but also their multiple engagement potential a PDMS could potentially engage 5-6 AShM with 2-3 missiles each before any of them even enter the range of the CIWS.

The gun based CIWS are mounted midship on either side of the funnel stacks. They would likely be retained and would be either a 7 barrel Type 730 or 11 barrel Type 1130.

 

[khanasifm]

CY-5 is the vertically launched version of CY-4 with folding control surfaces to fit into VLS. The range is reported to be 30 km. The existence of CY-5 type weapon was first officially revealed in 2012 when Type 054A frigate was opened to public in Hong Kong, when the governmental explanation described the modular VLS at the bow of the ship can launch both air defense missiles and rocket propelled ASW torpedoes armed with various Chinese and western torpedoes.[5] However, the exact designation of the rocket propelled ASW torpedo was not revealed. Because CY series was also first intended for export and armed with torpedoes of western origin, CY-5 is thus also most likely armed with Chinese Y-7, or other western light torpedoes such as A244-S. CY-5 is reportedly also deployed onboard Type 052D destroyer.[6][7]

Yu-8 anti sub missile

http://errymath.blogspot.com/2016/05/yu-8-anti-submarine-missile-has.html

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CJ-1

 

[Tank131]

It may just be me, but i dont think its a good idea to utilize any of the 32 cells with an ASROC unless PN finds a quad-pack capable missile for the Type 054A. The 054A will be the Air defense centerpiece for any flotilla it is part of. Ideally they will have 4 of them each heading a battlegroup of 054A, an F-22P, a Milgem and 2 subs. Between the 3 choppers 2 subs and the 3 ships, i think the CY-5 will not be as needed, but the 8 or so SAMs that it will replace may be. If they can get a quad packed missile, then they could easily give up 16 cells to LACMs and ASROCs while still fielding 64 MR-SAMs.

 

[khanasifm]

Per this report quoting pn 054a will have similar armament as Chinese navy 054a

Also the case per Turkish source for Turkish ship, modification are expensive for initial buy as well as maintance but let’s see what the final product once delivered

In a years or two at most as Chinese are producing/ building 054a 4 /5 at a time so it’s should be in next year or two

https://www.defensenews.com/naval/2...s-to-replace-british-frigates-modernize-navy/

A naval spokesman told Defense News that a “contract has been placed in June 2017” for one Type 054A Jiangkai II frigate featuring the same sensors and weaponry as Chinese ships. An order for two more is under consideration.

A representative for Turkish defense firm STM, which designed the Ada corvette, previously told Defense News that Pakistan’s corvettes would feature the same systems as those in Turkish service.

 

[khanasifm]

054a update

http://www.military-today.com/navy/type_054a_class.htm

 

[LKJ86]

What about 052D?

 

[Muhammad Omar]

What about 052D?
View attachment 472760

I think PN should focus on procuring 5-6 Type 054-A frigates and after that look for 2 type 52-D

 

[ziaulislam]

I think PN should focus on procuring 5-6 Type 054-A frigates and after that look for 2 type 52-D

no money no honey

we need domestic cheap solutions that would support domestic economy...

if it would me, i would ditched the turkish system and did JV or solo corvette project of 8-12 ships built over 20 years to support local industry..

same should have done for utility helicopter(JV/licence or solo) and jet fighter(we did it right here) and tank, APC, artillery gun, rifle..basically anything that is mass procured

 

[Armchair]

no money no honey

we need domestic cheap solutions that would support domestic economy...

if it would me, i would ditched the turkish system and did JV or solo corvette project of 8-12 ships built over 20 years to support local industry..

same should have done for utility helicopter(JV/licence or solo) and jet fighter(we did it right here) and tank, APC, artillery gun, rifle..basically anything that is mass procured

I've always been fascinated by the vast difference in price between a hangar and helicopter equiped corvette and a large FAC. I think a few of the weapons systems make up a big part of the cost. Perhaps:

1. Radars and EW equipment (much more comprehensive than an FAC)
2. SAMs
3. AShMs
4. Hangar / ASW Helicopter
5. Propulsion

If these can be replicated or substitutes found, one could model a cheap, mass produced fighting ship (for lack of a better term).

AShMs are now being locally built so that's one problem down. There is a rumor (admittedly that's all one has) of a local SAM R&D.

Helicopters can't be built locally within any meaningful timeframe due to lack of any base R&D. But given Pakistan's defensive maritime posture, can a turboprop aircraft replace the need? You could basically have the same equipment as an ASW helicopter and combined with a plane's natural longer range, greater payload, greater speed. Being based from shore, they could play a similar support role to the national warships. Basically a prop driven S-3 Viking. Would be cheap to source / build locally given expertise accumulated in Kamra.

Due to the curvature of the earth, radar systems in naval use, beyond a point have to be relatively sophisticated to get meaningful ranges. At the same time, AESA radars pack a powerful and light punch for a given power output. IF you built a lightweight radar and put it on a kite-like powered airship, you could inflate it and have it run on the back of the national warship. A bit like a giant kite being towed by the proposed warship. This would mean you'd get a decent detection range at relatively low cost. Power for the airship-cum-kite can be sourced from the ship, further lowering complexity, weight and cost.

Maybe PN should have a unit like the Israelis whose job is to think out of the box and critically, and come up with unconventional solutions. Just my 0.02

 

[帅的一匹]

no money no honey

we need domestic cheap solutions that would support domestic economy...

if it would me, i would ditched the turkish system and did JV or solo corvette project of 8-12 ships built over 20 years to support local industry..

same should have done for utility helicopter(JV/licence or solo) and jet fighter(we did it right here) and tank, APC, artillery gun, rifle..basically anything that is mass procured

1.5 billions for only 30 helis, period.