Pakistan Military Officer Pay Scale/Recruitment

[EyelessInGaza]

^^ 3% from a deal, as a rule? That's not possible.

 

[Patriot]

It is unfortunately.You can confirm from Muradk or X-man.Mr Zia totally screwed the Army.I also read in a pilot book that Zia used to pay for expenses of some guy in Japan (from GOP Revenue) who was i think Zia's relative.

 

[qsaark]

Oh Qsaark the same old ... (now you are again going to accuse me of foul language).................

Now this is the xeric I appericiate. Thanks dude, there are things in your post I dont agree completely with, but overall, I am pretty much convinced.

 

[sonicboom]

The examples you have given above do not apply here. There is a discussion going on here, and people may write things that you don’t like of one or several reasons. However, let loose your anger and start using a foul language is against the rules and norms of carrying out a discussion. The forum members are not anyone’s parents, friends, or brothers, but they are not enemies as well. I carefully went through all the posts and found that you used the foul language first. Using foul language and expecting that other won’t retaliate, is not a good idea. Following are quotations from your posts:

Post # 18 “You need to get your brains refurbished”
Post# 21 “Ok how that fu** would it bother anybody”
Post # 23 “You are an idiot! Let me be very rude this time!”

It is only than that SB retaliated and used less than civil language. Even in reply to my post # 55, you started with “Lolzz.. qsaark”. Come on yaar, how lowly and insignificant you think others and their opinions are? Again in response to MK’s post you said “people on this thread stopped using their brains”.

As per your own statement, an officer with a full service of 35 years or so may have around 2-3 plots. If this is true, how will you explain the following property made by General Musharraf? Musharraf is not a son of a rich father, his father got promoted to the rank of a section officer (grade 17) just before his retirement.

(1) Under construction House in Army Housing Scheme Pt-II, Karachi.
(2) 2000 Sq. Yards in DHA, Karachi.
(3) 2xKanals in Morgah Housing Scheme, Rawalpindi.
(4) 1 and half Kanal in AWT (Army Welfare Trust) Housing Scheme, Peshawar.
(5) 8xMarlas in LCCHS, Lahore.
(6) 2xSquare agriculture land at Bahawalpur.

b. Parents' house in F-7/3, Islamabad.
c. Daughter's house in DHA (Defence), Karachi.
d. 1xKanal plot in Eastridge Scheme (09).
e. 2xKanals in Sangar Housing Scheme, Gwadar.

I hate to bring my personal stuff into discussion, but only for the sake of making it clear. My Dad retired after 36 year of service as a Director General (grade 21) from a government department. He managed to buy a house (Rs ~12 lakh) and a plot (Rs 3 lakh) only after his retirement from the money he got from his provident fund etc. And my parents are very careful when it comes to spend money. And this is all an honest officer would get at the end of his service even after retiring as a grade 21 officer in civilian sector. He is happy with whatever he has; his biggest investment was in his son’s education which surely is now paying him back. I have not mentioned this because I or my parents want more (Alhamdulillah, I managed to save in past 4 years more than my father saved during his entire government service), but just so that you can compare the difference between the Military and Civilian (Government) sector benefits.

An excellent post! And I very much regret that I used foul language once or twice in my post but I was forced to do so. Honestly I have no grudge against army officers and I respect them very much.

However, at the same time I also feel that they earn their salary from a department which runs on taxes paid by Pakistani people and I considered them as their servants.

My only concern is their involvement in real estate business and the double standard set by the GHQ, controlled by officers, when it comes to offering perks and benefits to army Officers and NCO’s/JCO’s.

Few quotes from the national assembly:

“The National Assembly was informed on Monday, September 8, 2003 that during the last 12 years of both political and military regimes (1990-2002) a total of 34 defense officers housing schemes of various sizes for officers of the Pakistan Army was established over an area of almost 1,000 acres of land. Out of 34, only two housing schemes of 15 acres have been launched for NCO’s/JCOs.”

“During question hour in the parliament it has transpired that military officers get one after 15 years of service, a second one after 25, a third one after 28 years and a fourth one after 33 years of service each worth more than 15 million rupees in the open market.”

Would it be wrong to say that those housing schemes are denying the right of hundred and thousands of NOC’s/JCO’s, who also remain on the frontline while laying down their lives in the defense of the mother home land?

Just compare the ratio of NCO’s/JCO’s to the officers and its mind boggling that officers being less than 2% of the population are being rewarded 98% of the real estate benefits. Put it in simple words, GHQ controlled by officers, is busy in ‘bandar bant’, creating lucrative housing societies for the chosen people (officers) by awarding them large plots at dirt-cheap prices and in turn they sell them off to civilians and make huge profits while at the same time ignoring NCO’s/JCO’s.

It would be interesting to check how many of the original allottees still lived in these housing societies and how many have made quick money by disposing their plots of. Morale is very low and the poor soldiers and ranks have a seething hatred towards the top brass who have become millionairs. It is for these reasons that recently general Kayani has given wage raises and few other privileges to the lower ranks and soldiers to rectify the situation. But is that enough?

Wasalam

 

[Muradk]

It is unfortunately.You can confirm from Muradk or X-man.Mr Zia totally screwed the Army.I also read in a pilot book that Zia used to pay for expenses of some guy in Japan (from GOP Revenue) who was i think Zia's relative.

Ok lets start from here members please this is to tell you that it was not Zia who put Islam in every thing it was his chumchas/lota Polititians who did it.
Second yes all 3 COAS (ARMY), PAF, NAVY get 3 % commission because when they take over there pension plan go into any other project he desires, Tanveer's C-pension of 36 lacks went to PAF ACADEMY.
Third you serve your country for Max 29 to 36 years in that time you are given medals, Each medal has its perks. SJ gets more pay plus a plot for free and 10 acres of Agricultural land, TJ gets the same, TBT and SBT get a free plot other medals get perks as welll but after you serve 14 years you are completely vested in it and you get a plot to make a house. A Civilian will never understand that a fauji wakes up at 4 in the morning at 6 am he is on work and no time stated for him to go home , We were always told you guys are GDPs the best of the best bull we had to wake up 3am used to comeback at 4pm, while the engg and other branches used to work 7am to 2.30 pm.

 

[sonicboom]

SJ gets more pay plus a plot for free and 10 acres of Agricultural land, TJ gets the same, TBT and SBT get a free plot other medals get perks as welll but after you serve 14 years you are completely vested in it and you get a plot to make a house.

Sir an excellent point. And I would like to add that it should also be observed that generals are getting commercial plots in city centers, which were worth 200 times more in market value than the million rupees and any plot given to the dependents of a Nishan-i-Haider Shaheed. This shows the low priority attached to gallantry and the high priority attached to other qualities.

 

[Muradk]

Sir an excellent point. And I would like to add that it should also be observed that generals are getting commercial plots in city centers, which were worth 200 times more in market value than the million rupees and any plot given to the dependents of a Nishan-i-Haider Shaheed. This shows the low priority attached to gallantry and the high priority attached to other qualities.

Very true when I was appointed as Add Sec Def , Army put there foot down on the MIN that first 9 officer of ours will get appointment then your PAF guy gets his. Gis ki Lathi us ki Bhense bro

 

[EyelessInGaza]

It is unfortunately.You can confirm from Muradk or X-man.Mr Zia totally screwed the Army.I also read in a pilot book that Zia used to pay for expenses of some guy in Japan (from GOP Revenue) who was i think Zia's relative.

Thanks for the reply bro. But I am still not sure I understand this completely. I think Muradk mentioned that the chief's pensions go to some charitable/socially relevant project and, presumably, in return they get the 3%. I get that - so far.

But 3% of the value of a deal (if that is the case) can be a heck of a lot! You can easily have billion dollar defence deals these days; 3% of a deal that's worth just a billion dollars is 30 million USD.

 

[sonicboom]

x_man

Sorry for delayed reply as I just came back from forced leave (was banned). (lol)

Thank you for being so courteous in your reply and that's what I expect at least from Military Professionals.

Errrrr…. he actually runs the forum if you couldn’t figure it out till now…
:

I just did after you told me. Thank you!

Wrong once again….You know how many members this forum has: 17, 349 and out of these how many Mil Prof ??? Well just 16. And not all these MPs are from Pakistan. They are from Australia, USA , UK and even INDIA , so saying that PDF only supports Pakistani POV, is way off the mark.

No forum member even an MP ( previous Think Tanks) is above the forum rules. If you do not know, I too have been banned once from this forum for being unreasonable. There have been TT wwho were stripped off their titles and many other senior Pakistani members banned for trespassing the rules. So if you think that Admin of this forum is protecting MPs then you are putting just another baseless allegation that you have been doing uptill now.:

Well I did have some concerns as indicated by other members too but now I am ok. Thank you again!

Yeh truth is bitter and sometimes counter Truth is even bitter. Xeric has very well countered all the missiles you fired at him and forces , and I guess you have nothing to add on the subject.

I do have but I as stated in one of my other posts, I consider that discussion to be closed. Thank you again!

Gibberish….I know countless guys whose dads were in Armed forces and the boys never made it thru ISSB in both attempts. Hundreds and thousands of guys appear in ISSB each year and very few are selected. And all those who never get it thru, have only one thing to say: ISSB main sirf sifarish chalti hai….So typical. Have you ever met a single guy who said that he couldn’t do well in the group tasks, or intelligence tests or Interview??? They all blame it on ISSB as you are doing too….Just out of curiosity, have you ever been to ISSB???

Once again I had some concerns that I had seen or heard and you had given me the clarfication that I accept. In addition to that, you could have also said in their support that sons and daughters of officers live on the bases and they are raised accordingly and they know the process. Also they have the privilege to go to Public schools on highly subsidized rates giving them an overall advantage in ISSB.

If you are here to win anything then you never will. Because there is nothing to win or lose here. ….No one really gives a hoot..

In PAF one and this thread, you first tried to divide the opinion of members against our Armed forces by misleading them with false information and now you are attempting to divide people by directly confronting the Admin team and their powers on this forum. No MOD or Webby send you the invitation at your home to join PDF….If you cant stand them or other members then no one is compelling you to stay here…..

No Sir, I am not here to win but to participate in some of the debates those concerned me the most.

Once again it was not my intention to divide anyone and I would be careful in future in that regards.

You are absolutely correct that no one invited me to this forum and I also have the option not to stay here. However, in a same token, I can also point out that anyone who is complaining about the hardship in the military have the same options. They joined the officer cadre with their own desire and no one invited or forced them to do so and they did it with the understanding of what is expected of them. In return they are handsomely paid with all the perks and benefits. Where in the Pakistan, a FA or at the most BA passed can get a job like a commissioned officer and at retirement being a millionaire? If they don’t like it, then they have the option to leave and I am sure there is 1000’s in line that would be happy to take their place as jobless rate in Pakistan is very high.

Thanks again!
Wasalam

 

[AgNoStiC MuSliM]

Thank you everyone for returning to civil discourse.

I see that both sides are accepting some points from the opposing side as being valid.

Please continue in this vein and try and listen (figuratively speaking) to the explanations/arguments from the other side.

 

[AgNoStiC MuSliM]

Where in the Pakistan, a FA or at the most BA passed can get a job like a commissioned officer and at retirement being a millionaire?

I don't like the fact that even if I finish my PhD in Engineering, I won't earn close to what a Physician does (in most cases).

That's life - the Military has taken care of its own, and invested in businesses and projects that provide benefits for military retirees, avenues for continued employment for military retirees as well as plenty of taxes for the State.

Military Officers therefore perhaps retire relatively better off than other government employees - but that alone is not reason enough to criticize them.

 

[sonicboom]

I don't like the fact that even if I finish my PhD in Engineering, I won't earn close to what a Physician does (in most cases).

That's life - the Military has taken care of its own, and invested in businesses and projects that provide benefits for military retirees, avenues for continued employment for military retirees as well as plenty of taxes for the State.

Military Officers therefore perhaps retire relatively better off than other government employees - but that alone is not reason enough to criticize them.

Congratulations on you Phd. What's your major?

Sir your point very well taken. But I was pointing more to hardship complaints than anything else. How about having the same for the NCO's/JCO's too? Why to have this disparity? Let the standard be the same.

 

[AgNoStiC MuSliM]

Congratulations on you Phd. What's your major?

Haven't even started it yet - on my masters. In fact I may drop my plans for the PhD and do a second masters in Polit. Science/Finance/Economics (yes, even after the financial fiasco).

Sir your point very well taken. But I would like to see the same for the NCO's/JCO's too. Why to have this disparity? Let the standard be the same.

I don't think you will have equality in terms of the quantity of compensation between officers and Jawans, just like you cannot have equality of compensation for two individuals in the same corporation - one with a high school degree and one with a masters.

I think where the Military should focus (and Gen. Kiyani seems to have initiated steps in this regard), is on trying to reduce the disparity in benefits and facilities such as equal access to health care, schools, housing etc.

Xeric may be able to better elucidate upon the extent of the disparities in these areas, if any.

 

[Muradk]

Congratulations on you Phd. What's your major?

Sir your point very well taken. But I was pointing more to hardship complaints than anything else. How about having the same for the NCO's/JCO's too? Why to have this disparity? Let the standard be the same.

If you have a PHD in Engg interested in working on JF-17s.

 

[AgNoStiC MuSliM]

If you have a PHD in Engg interested in working on JF-17s.

I would love to sir, and thank you for the offer, but I am still working on my first masters in EE, and as I said, I am not sure if I have the drive to go for a PhD.

But thank you again for suggesting the possibility - perhaps when I am done with my education, and if there is still a need and my qualifications suffice ...