Pakistan Inadvertantly Admits That Its First Strike Capability Is Neutered:--

[911]

Hi,

I do not think that any pakistani had noticed that in the recent statements by pakistani officials---the state of pakistan has advertantly admitted that it has lost its first strike capability over indian soil.

The suggestion that we are going to use the nucs on our soil to destroy the incoming enemy force was a tantamount to admission of a failed nuc strike capability across the border.

What that means is that pakistan is now admitting that india has ABM's that will take out its nucs during flight---and the next frightening thing for pakistan is that the long range nuc tipped missiles would be taken out on the pakistani side by indian ABM capabilities.

As the hostilities will grow---the U S navy would also be deploying its Aegis class frigates in the arabian sea closer to the pakistan indian borders----. The sole purpose would be to intercept the pakistani nuc tipped missiles that could fly into india.

They could also intercept any indian nuc tipped missiles flying into pakistan----but due to the geography and geometry----all the pakistan launched missiles could be intercepted---because they would be coming in---but the indian missiles would not be---even though the american missiles try as much---because they would be going away from the launch vehicle---.

View attachment 288123

Just for reference sake---if you look at the map of pakistan and india----an aegis class cruiser off the coast of gujrat can intercept many a missiles coming into india.

The indian ABM's will cover the rest halfway above rajasthan. This is what I have been trying to explain in my last few posts---I did not want to get directly into the tactical issue---but the thing is that the U S is not going to allow pakistan to use its nucs successfully.

The U S is going to be a player in the game---whether pakistan likes it or don't. That is why I have been writing over here---there is no way out for pakistan other than gaining conventional strength.

If the generals are saying that cannot happen---then those generals need to be FIRED and those who can---need to be put incharge.

And again for that reason---I bring back the Yemen issue---. A 15--20 billion dollars cash upfront for the first year would have taken care of most of the strike capabilities of pakistan and 5 billion a year after that would have taken care of the major issues.

It would also had given air force bases to pakistan on the arab land to strike deep into the indian flank---and alongwith another extra 150 k troops to gain strength from at time of crisis---.

And again to thos who have not read my yemen strike force numbers here they are----.

Pakistan would release 50 K troops on the go---and in return it would ask saudi arabia to deploy one sqdrn of F15SA's at jacobabad---it would also ask emirate to deploy a sqdrn of BLK60 a J'abad and 2 sqdrn's of Mirage 2K9's at karachi----these would neuter any indian strike threat.

Pakistan would build a military cantonment at gwadar---a full blooded campaign would be started for new recruits---all newly retd general staff and officers be recalled to active duty.

With the funds----pakistan would purchase at least 100 J10C's or100 SU35's----around a 100 JH7B's or a 100 SU34's----.

For the navy---at least 2 to 4 latest models of 052's and the 054's---between 5000 to 8000 + tonnage range----10 + upgraded F22 frigate

For the army a build up to at least 10 divs of armor and artillery and 5 battalions of LR sams etc----and 5 divs of infantry.

Pakistan's salvation is in a conventional force---a strike force that can take out the cities around mumbai and beneath----.

Mumbai is the jewle in the crown---a destruction of mumbai would stop india from starting a war---.

We already know that karachi and lahore and multan would be destroyed---so we need to destroy what the enemy loves the most---where it would hurt the most.

Basically the time for a nuclear is over for pakistan. Nuclear wars look good to poor nations---nations who are in the recovery mode and see a light at the end of he tunnel---must refrain and find other means to counter---.

Its very easy to talk about nukes and wars while sitting in America. No one wants war here.

 

[MastanKhan]

You really lost me there

Pakistan would release 50 K troops on the go---and in return it would ask saudi arabia to deploy one sqdrn of F15SA's at jacobabad---it would also ask emirate to deploy a sqdrn of BLK60 a J'abad and 2 sqdrn's of Mirage 2K9's at karachi----these would neuter any indian strike threat.

Hi,

Well---if you send 50 k troops to the gulf immediately---you are supposedly going to have a void---a loss of strength at your home plate.

So---how are you going to counter that so that the enemy does not get any ideas.

Do you think that 4 sqdrn's of most modern air superiority and strike aircraft deployed in pakistan might discourage the enemy of thinking otherwise or getting ideas----.

What you are doing is balancing out your force---you giving much needed manpower and getting much needed air superiority----.

It is going to be till you acquire your own. Now imagine if you have a long range strike aircraft and you fly it from your base from yemen or saudi---how far down can you go and strike your enemy---you can hit them where they never imagined that you could reach---.

The problem I see with you kids is that you have lived under this nuclear umbrella for so long and have felt so secure under it---that any thing that negates its effectiveness is a direct insult and threat to your integrity and decision making capabilities----.

And that is a fact---because who would want to look stupid in front of the whole world---in admitting that we were wrong---our nuclear umbrella is not invincible---.

do you know how dangerous cruise missiles are especially ones that can be fired mobile launchers.


you could have a few of these Babur systems behind a mountain and fire in front and have the missile do a U turn towards the enemy.

the U.S isn't all knowing all seeing.

Hi,

Absolutely---and there is a rumor that none of the scud missiles launcher could be targetted. But the problem is---that nuc umbrella is a no return place.

Pakistan had the opportunity to equip its military conventionally---the world cannot afford a nuclear threat---specially from two itching neighbors like pakistan and india---why should the rest of the world suffer because of these two---.

And for this reason alone---the world is going to go against pakistan---because the world media is against pakistan---world public thinking is against pakistan---another major catastrophe will just push things over the edge.

This topic has a reason behind it----what if the nuc threat fails---what then. If you don't have conventional means you are toast.

 

[Humble Analyst]

Hi,

I do not think that any pakistani had noticed that in the recent statements by pakistani officials---the state of pakistan has advertantly admitted that it has lost its first strike capability over indian soil.

The suggestion that we are going to use the nucs on our soil to destroy the incoming enemy force was a tantamount to admission of a failed nuc strike capability across the border.

What that means is that pakistan is now admitting that india has ABM's that will take out its nucs during flight---and the next frightening thing for pakistan is that the long range nuc tipped missiles would be taken out on the pakistani side by indian ABM capabilities.

As the hostilities will grow---the U S navy would also be deploying its Aegis class frigates in the arabian sea closer to the pakistan indian borders----. The sole purpose would be to intercept the pakistani nuc tipped missiles that could fly into india.

They could also intercept any indian nuc tipped missiles flying into pakistan----but due to the geography and geometry----all the pakistan launched missiles could be intercepted---because they would be coming in---but the indian missiles would not be---even though the american missiles try as much---because they would be going away from the launch vehicle---.

View attachment 288123

Just for reference sake---if you look at the map of pakistan and india----an aegis class cruiser off the coast of gujrat can intercept many a missiles coming into india.

The indian ABM's will cover the rest halfway above rajasthan. This is what I have been trying to explain in my last few posts---I did not want to get directly into the tactical issue---but the thing is that the U S is not going to allow pakistan to use its nucs successfully.

The U S is going to be a player in the game---whether pakistan likes it or don't. That is why I have been writing over here---there is no way out for pakistan other than gaining conventional strength.

If the generals are saying that cannot happen---then those generals need to be FIRED and those who can---need to be put incharge.

And again for that reason---I bring back the Yemen issue---. A 15--20 billion dollars cash upfront for the first year would have taken care of most of the strike capabilities of pakistan and 5 billion a year after that would have taken care of the major issues.

It would also had given air force bases to pakistan on the arab land to strike deep into the indian flank---and alongwith another extra 150 k troops to gain strength from at time of crisis---.

And again to thos who have not read my yemen strike force numbers here they are----.

Pakistan would release 50 K troops on the go---and in return it would ask saudi arabia to deploy one sqdrn of F15SA's at jacobabad---it would also ask emirate to deploy a sqdrn of BLK60 a J'abad and 2 sqdrn's of Mirage 2K9's at karachi----these would neuter any indian strike threat.

Pakistan would build a military cantonment at gwadar---a full blooded campaign would be started for new recruits---all newly retd general staff and officers be recalled to active duty.

With the funds----pakistan would purchase at least 100 J10C's or100 SU35's----around a 100 JH7B's or a 100 SU34's----.

For the navy---at least 2 to 4 latest models of 052's and the 054's---between 5000 to 8000 + tonnage range----10 + upgraded F22 frigate

For the army a build up to at least 10 divs of armor and artillery and 5 battalions of LR sams etc----and 5 divs of infantry.

Pakistan's salvation is in a conventional force---a strike force that can take out the cities around mumbai and beneath----.

Mumbai is the jewle in the crown---a destruction of mumbai would stop india from starting a war---.

We already know that karachi and lahore and multan would be destroyed---so we need to destroy what the enemy loves the most---where it would hurt the most.

Basically the time for a nuclear is over for pakistan. Nuclear wars look good to poor nations---nations who are in the recovery mode and see a light at the end of he tunnel---must refrain and find other means to counter---.

While I agree with the fact that Pakistan should enhance its conventional arms so the thresh hold is not met quickly, however do not agree that Pakistan's nuclear strike capabilities are neutered based upon logic presented. Nuclear weapons are not a joke to use but a country which maybe nuclear power trying to attack another nuclear country is possible but will be a disaster for both and neighbors.
Pakistan should get better planes (deep strike, air superiority and naval strike), a new Air defense system, some tanks some good helis and NV aids to stop Indians thinking of surgical strikes, cold starts etc. History tells us almost always wars have exceeded their intended scope. India cannot bully Pakistan no matter what except through Western countries controlling IMF and WB. India should try to accept sensible offers from Pakistan instead of pushing Pakistan always.
Pakistan has to stop corruption and sectarian conflicts.
I do strongly agree that Pakistan has to balance the conventional weapons.

 

[MastanKhan]

Its very easy to talk about nukes and wars while sitting in America. No one wants war here.

So---what do you think the purpose of this thread is---no war. If pakistan is conventionally strong---there will be no threat of war.

 

[dadeechi]

Hi,

I do not think that any pakistani had noticed that in the recent statements by pakistani officials---the state of pakistan has advertantly admitted that it has lost its first strike capability over indian soil.

The suggestion that we are going to use the nucs on our soil to destroy the incoming enemy force was a tantamount to admission of a failed nuc strike capability across the border.

What that means is that pakistan is now admitting that india has ABM's that will take out its nucs during flight---and the next frightening thing for pakistan is that the long range nuc tipped missiles would be taken out on the pakistani side by indian ABM capabilities.

As the hostilities will grow---the U S navy would also be deploying its Aegis class frigates in the arabian sea closer to the pakistan indian borders----. The sole purpose would be to intercept the pakistani nuc tipped missiles that could fly into india.

They could also intercept any indian nuc tipped missiles flying into pakistan----but due to the geography and geometry----all the pakistan launched missiles could be intercepted---because they would be coming in---but the indian missiles would not be---even though the american missiles try as much---because they would be going away from the launch vehicle---.

View attachment 288123

Just for reference sake---if you look at the map of pakistan and india----an aegis class cruiser off the coast of gujrat can intercept many a missiles coming into india.

The indian ABM's will cover the rest halfway above rajasthan. This is what I have been trying to explain in my last few posts---I did not want to get directly into the tactical issue---but the thing is that the U S is not going to allow pakistan to use its nucs successfully.

The U S is going to be a player in the game---whether pakistan likes it or don't. That is why I have been writing over here---there is no way out for pakistan other than gaining conventional strength.

If the generals are saying that cannot happen---then those generals need to be FIRED and those who can---need to be put incharge.

And again for that reason---I bring back the Yemen issue---. A 15--20 billion dollars cash upfront for the first year would have taken care of most of the strike capabilities of pakistan and 5 billion a year after that would have taken care of the major issues.

It would also had given air force bases to pakistan on the arab land to strike deep into the indian flank---and alongwith another extra 150 k troops to gain strength from at time of crisis---.

And again to thos who have not read my yemen strike force numbers here they are----.

Pakistan would release 50 K troops on the go---and in return it would ask saudi arabia to deploy one sqdrn of F15SA's at jacobabad---it would also ask emirate to deploy a sqdrn of BLK60 a J'abad and 2 sqdrn's of Mirage 2K9's at karachi----these would neuter any indian strike threat.

Pakistan would build a military cantonment at gwadar---a full blooded campaign would be started for new recruits---all newly retd general staff and officers be recalled to active duty.

With the funds----pakistan would purchase at least 100 J10C's or100 SU35's----around a 100 JH7B's or a 100 SU34's----.

For the navy---at least 2 to 4 latest models of 052's and the 054's---between 5000 to 8000 + tonnage range----10 + upgraded F22 frigate

For the army a build up to at least 10 divs of armor and artillery and 5 battalions of LR sams etc----and 5 divs of infantry.

Pakistan's salvation is in a conventional force---a strike force that can take out the cities around mumbai and beneath----.

Mumbai is the jewle in the crown---a destruction of mumbai would stop india from starting a war---.

We already know that karachi and lahore and multan would be destroyed---so we need to destroy what the enemy loves the most---where it would hurt the most.

Basically the time for a nuclear is over for pakistan. Nuclear wars look good to poor nations---nations who are in thFee recovery mode and see a light at the end of he tunnel---must refrain and find other means to counter---.

Excellent post.

Couple of questions

Why would US intervene? Are you assuming that Pakistan would have been totally on China's side? If yes, Wouldn't China too launch missiles at India to save it's investments in Pakistan (CPEC) ?

Also, are you assuming that after India signs LSA, US would permanently berth it's naval resources on the coasts of Gujarat and Bengal?

 

[Signalian]

Hi,

I do not think that any pakistani had noticed that in the recent statements by pakistani officials---the state of pakistan has advertantly admitted that it has lost its first strike capability over indian soil.

The suggestion that we are going to use the nucs on our soil to destroy the incoming enemy force was a tantamount to admission of a failed nuc strike capability across the border.

What that means is that pakistan is now admitting that india has ABM's that will take out its nucs during flight---and the next frightening thing for pakistan is that the long range nuc tipped missiles would be taken out on the pakistani side by indian ABM capabilities.

As the hostilities will grow---the U S navy would also be deploying its Aegis class frigates in the arabian sea closer to the pakistan indian borders----. The sole purpose would be to intercept the pakistani nuc tipped missiles that could fly into india.

They could also intercept any indian nuc tipped missiles flying into pakistan----but due to the geography and geometry----all the pakistan launched missiles could be intercepted---because they would be coming in---but the indian missiles would not be---even though the american missiles try as much---because they would be going away from the launch vehicle---.

View attachment 288123

Just for reference sake---if you look at the map of pakistan and india----an aegis class cruiser off the coast of gujrat can intercept many a missiles coming into india.

The indian ABM's will cover the rest halfway above rajasthan. This is what I have been trying to explain in my last few posts---I did not want to get directly into the tactical issue---but the thing is that the U S is not going to allow pakistan to use its nucs successfully.

The U S is going to be a player in the game---whether pakistan likes it or don't. That is why I have been writing over here---there is no way out for pakistan other than gaining conventional strength.

If the generals are saying that cannot happen---then those generals need to be FIRED and those who can---need to be put incharge.

Any future Pak-India war will be based on kashmir. With Nukes or without nukes, its still impossible to take kashmir conventionally for PA. However Pakistan can defend its side of Kashmir.
Its difficult to take Kashmir because:
1. The population of Kashmir is not tilted towards Pakistan to think of it as its saviour. It was a rude shock in 1965, Op Gibraltar.

2. Conventionally, PA would need to break into and take pathankot (6th armoured Div, 17th infantry Div, 37 Infantry Div) and keep the IA engaged there, till PA Mountain forces (FNCA, 12th infantry Div) from North make inroads towards Kargil, Dras and Leh while the others (19th Infantry Div(Mangla), 23 Infantry Div(jhelum) reinforced by 7th Infantry Div and 9th infantry Div from Peshawar) take on Anantnag,Srinagar and Jammu. This is an inadequate force of 6 Mountain and Infantry divisions which would be facing 7 Mountain and Infantry divisions of IA. The equation is good for pakistan from defensive pov. For an offensive force, 3:1 superiority is required.

Even if Pakistan can field 21 divisions to IA 7 divs, a very fast approach for capture of Kashmir would be required. By-passing strong points of defense by a massive heliborne force(prone to lots of losses), landing in weak spots throughout IOK and exploiting them to keep the IA engaged while the advancing force faces resistance on the borders only.

Any delay will cause International intervention and all the sacrifices will be in vain.

3. Instead of moving USN AEGIS systems in the sea for an India-Pakistan war, USA will start diplomatic ways and means to end this war within days. First will be embargo followed by sanctions for use of nukes. USA will make sure that the war ends before nukes are used ( 7-10 days war).

Pakistan Armed Forces objective is not nuking Mumbai, its objective is taking kashmir. This matter should be handled through dialogue, not war.

I personally wish there are no more wars between Pakistan-India. Wars cause deaths and damages to both sides. It takes a country backwards by many years. Its a logistical and medical strain.
Nuke war is more destructive and unforgiving. It destroys man kind in the worst way possible.

The generals whom you are cursing have seen all forms of Armed Forces Services, Operational area and Administration. They have a far better perception of enemy threat than you and are far capable of leading a force or this nation than you. Show some respect.

And again for that reason---I bring back the Yemen issue---. A 15--20 billion dollars cash upfront for the first year would have taken care of most of the strike capabilities of pakistan and 5 billion a year after that would have taken care of the major issues.

It would also had given air force bases to pakistan on the arab land to strike deep into the indian flank---and alongwith another extra 150 k troops to gain strength from at time of crisis---.

And again to thos who have not read my yemen strike force numbers here they are----.

Pakistan Army should not be made a mercenary Army. Its a professional Army, it fights on orders and for Homeland, not for money. The Arabs can keep their money and spare lives of Pakistan soldiers.

Pakistan would release 50 K troops on the go---and in return it would ask saudi arabia to deploy one sqdrn of F15SA's at jacobabad---it would also ask emirate to deploy a sqdrn of BLK60 a J'abad and 2 sqdrn's of Mirage 2K9's at karachi----these would neuter any indian strike threat.

Oil is enough to keep country going through sanctions, in an event of war.
PAF is a good defensive force with offensive capability. If nuke missiles can be intercepted, then so can aircrafts be. There is no guarantee that F-15S or F-16 Block 60 will get through and make it back.

Pakistan would build a military cantonment at gwadar---a full blooded campaign would be started for new recruits---all newly retd general staff and officers be recalled to active duty.

Gawadar is envisioned as an economic hub, not a military base to scare away potential investors and international trading.

With the funds----pakistan would purchase at least 100 J10C's or100 SU35's----around a 100 JH7B's or a 100 SU34's----

Thats is just a wishlist, those numbers suit Russia or China, not Pakistan

For the size of country, PAF has enough aircrafts already to be an offensive and defensive force. PAF knows how, when ,where to use its aircrafts. It knows strengths and weaknesses of own and enemy aircrafts. The strategies and tactics are constantly evolving and new doctrines being followed.

.

For the navy---at least 2 to 4 latest models of 052's and the 054's---between 5000 to 8000 + tonnage range----10 + upgraded F22 frigate

Even 6 Frigates are more than enough for the coastline that PN is defending, and all the forces will be deployed towards east, unlike India which has a huge coastline to defend.

For the army a build up to at least 10 divs of armor and artillery and 5 battalions of LR sams etc----and 5 divs of infantry.

Army has cut down its troops. Your plan is inducting another 300,000 active troops.
Lighter forces are being formed and equipped to fight the new type of warfare Aka WOT.

10 divisons of armour and artillery? what are you planning to do with extra 2500 tanks, 4000 APC, 1500 SP Guns, 1500 AD SP and thousands and thousand of logistical trucks and other vehicles and troops to support them?

Pakistan's salvation is in a conventional force---a strike force that can take out the cities around mumbai and beneath----.

Nuke is a deterrent and a very effective one. if things turn ugly, this remains a threat but i hope its never used.

Mumbai is the jewle in the crown---a destruction of mumbai would stop india from starting a war---.

We already know that karachi and lahore and multan would be destroyed---so we need to destroy what the enemy loves the most---where it would hurt the most.

Basically the time for a nuclear is over for pakistan. Nuclear wars look good to poor nations---nations who are in the recovery mode and see a light at the end of he tunnel---must refrain and find other means to counter---.

Please, lets not even talk about destruction of cities. There are millions of innocents living in these cities.
India and Pakistan both know this and there are some cool heads at important designations in both nations which is why both are not at war at this time.

 

[That Guy]

@MastanKhan Can you tell me when and where they admitted to such a thing? I can't seem to find it within your OP.

 

[PakSword]

This is called making minds of Pakistanis on accepting the false fact that nuclear capability is useless to have and the only solution is conventional strength. This is the agenda of current government as well that is hell bent on coercing Pakistan to handover it's nuclear warheads to UN in return of write-off of certain loans. Issuing high interest bearing bonds and increase in external debt everyday (despite the fact that oil prices are at lowest level of past decade and Pakistan saving much of its reserves by not decreasing the prices of oil products) is one of the many clues that lead us to think why we are taking loans when we don't need them, that too with high interest rates.

We Pakistanis will start reading these kind of statements soon by our beloved politicians in Government.

Thank you democracy, you are making us proud.

 

[Viper0011.]

Hi,

I do not think that any pakistani had noticed that in the recent statements by pakistani officials---the state of pakistan has advertantly admitted that it has lost its first strike capability over indian soil.

The suggestion that we are going to use the nucs on our soil to destroy the incoming enemy force was a tantamount to admission of a failed nuc strike capability across the border.

What that means is that pakistan is now admitting that india has ABM's that will take out its nucs during flight---and the next frightening thing for pakistan is that the long range nuc tipped missiles would be taken out on the pakistani side by indian ABM capabilities..

Hey MK, man, you go away for a day and then come back with a new conspiracy theory, I like the pattern. Keeps things interesting and "gossipy" around here

The offensive missile systems are designed to create a shield or a sphere of impact if you will, starting from 288 KM's from around 100 KM inside of Pakistan's borders.

You are way over stating Indian ABM capability. If they continue to work with Israel, may be in about 15 years they'll get to the level of sophistication you are mentioning but by then, many new weapons systems will come out and ballistic missiles will start to look like Mig-21's of the 60's . Good topic though

 

[Alpha BeeTee]

The title is absolutely misleading which shows the desparation of Mr.Mastan Khan to have a free jab at our nukes.
Allah will safeguard our land as long as He wills,untill then,no power or pressure or stupidity can undo us.
These type of irrational threads immersed in the smell of biased opinions with turning and twisting of facts mushroomed with horrible day dreaming are not adding any positive contribution to this forum.
I'm so sorry.

 

[MastanKhan]

The title is absolutely misleading which shows the desparation of Mr.Mastan Khan to have a free jab at our nukes.
Allah will safeguard our land as long as He wills,untill then,no power or pressure or stupidity can undo us.
These type of irrational threads immersed in the smell of biased opinions with turning and twisting of facts mushroomed with horrible day dreaming are not adding any positive contribution to this forum.
I'm so sorry.

Son,

You are so blind in your conviction---Allah has left you---there is no God in pakistan anymore---. You really think that Allah would bless such a criminal and pervert society that pakistan is---where the most heinious crimes are committed under the name and umbrella of the religion Islam.

 

[cloud4000]

And again for that reason---I bring back the Yemen issue---. A 15--20 billion dollars cash upfront for the first year would have taken care of most of the strike capabilities of pakistan and 5 billion a year after that would have taken care of the major issues.

It would also had given air force bases to pakistan on the arab land to strike deep into the indian flank---and alongwith another extra 150 k troops to gain strength from at time of crisis---.

And again to thos who have not read my yemen strike force numbers here they are----.

Pakistan would release 50 K troops on the go---and in return it would ask saudi arabia to deploy one sqdrn of F15SA's at jacobabad---it would also ask emirate to deploy a sqdrn of BLK60 a J'abad and 2 sqdrn's of Mirage 2K9's at karachi----these would neuter any indian strike threat.

In essence, the Gulf States will become India's enemies in order to get Pakistan's soldiers to fight their wars? And for a modest down payment of $15-20 billion and $5 billion a year. It would be cheaper to hire mercenaries.

Honestly, I find the whole scheme to be crazy.

 

[thepakistani]

Hi,

I do not think that any pakistani had noticed that in the recent statements by pakistani officials---the state of pakistan has advertantly admitted that it has lost its first strike capability over indian soil.

The suggestion that we are going to use the nucs on our soil to destroy the incoming enemy force was a tantamount to admission of a failed nuc strike capability across the border.

What that means is that pakistan is now admitting that india has ABM's that will take out its nucs during flight---and the next frightening thing for pakistan is that the long range nuc tipped missiles would be taken out on the pakistani side by indian ABM capabilities.

As the hostilities will grow---the U S navy would also be deploying its Aegis class frigates in the arabian sea closer to the pakistan indian borders----. The sole purpose would be to intercept the pakistani nuc tipped missiles that could fly into india.

They could also intercept any indian nuc tipped missiles flying into pakistan----but due to the geography and geometry----all the pakistan launched missiles could be intercepted---because they would be coming in---but the indian missiles would not be---even though the american missiles try as much---because they would be going away from the launch vehicle---.

View attachment 288123

Just for reference sake---if you look at the map of pakistan and india----an aegis class cruiser off the coast of gujrat can intercept many a missiles coming into india.

The indian ABM's will cover the rest halfway above rajasthan. This is what I have been trying to explain in my last few posts---I did not want to get directly into the tactical issue---but the thing is that the U S is not going to allow pakistan to use its nucs successfully.

The U S is going to be a player in the game---whether pakistan likes it or don't. That is why I have been writing over here---there is no way out for pakistan other than gaining conventional strength.

If the generals are saying that cannot happen---then those generals need to be FIRED and those who can---need to be put incharge.

And again for that reason---I bring back the Yemen issue---. A 15--20 billion dollars cash upfront for the first year would have taken care of most of the strike capabilities of pakistan and 5 billion a year after that would have taken care of the major issues.

It would also had given air force bases to pakistan on the arab land to strike deep into the indian flank---and alongwith another extra 150 k troops to gain strength from at time of crisis---.

And again to thos who have not read my yemen strike force numbers here they are----.

Pakistan would release 50 K troops on the go---and in return it would ask saudi arabia to deploy one sqdrn of F15SA's at jacobabad---it would also ask emirate to deploy a sqdrn of BLK60 a J'abad and 2 sqdrn's of Mirage 2K9's at karachi----these would neuter any indian strike threat.

Pakistan would build a military cantonment at gwadar---a full blooded campaign would be started for new recruits---all newly retd general staff and officers be recalled to active duty.

With the funds----pakistan would purchase at least 100 J10C's or100 SU35's----around a 100 JH7B's or a 100 SU34's----.

For the navy---at least 2 to 4 latest models of 052's and the 054's---between 5000 to 8000 + tonnage range----10 + upgraded F22 frigate

For the army a build up to at least 10 divs of armor and artillery and 5 battalions of LR sams etc----and 5 divs of infantry.

Pakistan's salvation is in a conventional force---a strike force that can take out the cities around mumbai and beneath----.

Mumbai is the jewle in the crown---a destruction of mumbai would stop india from starting a war---.

We already know that karachi and lahore and multan would be destroyed---so we need to destroy what the enemy loves the most---where it would hurt the most.

Basically the time for a nuclear is over for pakistan. Nuclear wars look good to poor nations---nations who are in the recovery mode and see a light at the end of he tunnel---must refrain and find other means to counter---.

Dear khan R you paid for this fact less article??
What happened over night??? Sleep tight and don't worry at all.

Baba gee if india getts 10,000 units of such ABM systems and overnight gets 10 year advanced than Pakistan strategically. Even than can't be the picture you tried to paint.

Don't creat havoc from no where please. The Pak army leadership is proved best in the world which you wana indicate as stupid by your article.

Please Allah is Allah. Don't try to deny the basic concept of Allah in haste of war of words. Although we are not an ideal nation with lot of anti islamic behaviors but Rehmat e Illahia is here we have grievous deeds and facing so. But future is here in a few years you would say yourself. What you wana say Allah is in Iran in India?? Not in Pakistan.

 

[MastanKhan]

Hey MK, man, you go away for a day and then come back with a new conspiracy theory, I like the pattern. Keeps things interesting and "gossipy" around here

The offensive missile systems are designed to create a shield or a sphere of impact if you will, starting from 288 KM's from around 100 KM inside of Pakistan's borders.

You are way over stating Indian ABM capability. If they continue to work with Israel, may be in about 15 years they'll get to the level of sophistication you are mentioning but by then, many new weapons systems will come out and ballistic missiles will start to look like Mig-21's of the 60's . Good topic though

Viper,

It is not a conspiracy theory---the world is simply getting tired of pakistan---there is no good word that comes out in the favor of this country.

The pakistani attitude if you have money you can get whatever you want has put them in a very tight spot. The swedes don't want to sell the---the french don't want to---the euro fighter consortium possibly against them---the americans don't want to either and russia---too unpredictable.

I eman to say Viper---just step back for a moment---and look at the scenario from a neutral / tactical observers point of view---be the Devil's Advocate and with all truth tell me---isn't the world getting tired of these pakistani comments of using nucs.

People don't understand that if 10 nucs are exchanged in war---it will crash the world's economy---we are all too dependant on each other to survive---our welfare all over the world is tied by an umbilical chord connecting all of us---.

And then with today's media access worldwide---where news travels at the speed of light----panic and chaos is an immediate after effect of the strikes---. And when panic and chaos occurs----it breeds restlessness---which creates urgency to do something---you go to a store---you start buying stuff to stock---people are on edge---shelves start to empty---you go out---you are getting nervous---you get into your car---there is long line of cars---in your urgency and hastiness---you hit a passerby or another car----heated words are exchanged---and things slowly start to go out of control.

Oppurtunits---anarchist see the moment and want to ride the wave---a fire here a fire there---traffic jams---gas tanker lit on fire on a bridge---or a tunnel---water main breaks---slowly the city is coming to a stop in a massive traffic jam---a massive panic starts to spread and then things go totally out of control---looting and plunder---rape and mayhem----fires---electricty outages---phone outages---and things like that---name a crime that can be committed will be starting to commit worldwide in cities large and small.

But---if you can shutdown the internet and media just from the gitgo---there maybe a chance to salvage the chaos.

That what I am saying---pakistan is making these nuc threats and taking it too lightly---even though it is stating that it will do it on its own soil if the indian military breaks thru.

The politicians have looted a lots of money---they have their homes in dubai and europe and america and canada and they can scoot out any time they want----and only the average will be left behind to suffer---and the problem with the politicians is that they do not have the courage to tell the nation otherwise----because they have already looted and plundered the nation and it cannot afford to get more conventional weapons in a timely manner.

See----what amazes me is that the pakistanis are so bought into the nuc drama that they are BLIND to looking seriously into other options---and that is the most scary part.

 

[ConcealCarry]

@MastanKhan

MK you reading too much in to this and just creating a mountain out of nothing. All such statements should only be read in the context of "Cold Start" doctrine and the hot air caused by that doctrine. That statement was just to prick the hot air balloon, which it did. Period!

Regarding india's ABM
India does not yet have a credible ABM system
Due to close proximity of the two countries, their ABM system's effectiveness is not certain
Due to close proximity of the two countries their ABM system can easily be defeated by swarm attack by drones/rockets/missiles
Due to extended Humint network in India their exact location can be found for quick and effective neutralization in war
and much more that is better left unsaid...

Hi,

I do not think that any pakistani had noticed that in the recent statements by pakistani officials---the state of pakistan has advertantly admitted that it has lost its first strike capability over indian soil.

The suggestion that we are going to use the nucs on our soil to destroy the incoming enemy force was a tantamount to admission of a failed nuc strike capability across the border.

What that means is that pakistan is now admitting that india has ABM's that will take out its nucs during flight---and the next frightening thing for pakistan is that the long range nuc tipped missiles would be taken out on the pakistani side by indian ABM capabilities.

As the hostilities will grow---the U S navy would also be deploying its Aegis class frigates in the arabian sea closer to the pakistan indian borders----. The sole purpose would be to intercept the pakistani nuc tipped missiles that could fly into india.

They could also intercept any indian nuc tipped missiles flying into pakistan----but due to the geography and geometry----all the pakistan launched missiles could be intercepted---because they would be coming in---but the indian missiles would not be---even though the american missiles try as much---because they would be going away from the launch vehicle---.

View attachment 288123

Just for reference sake---if you look at the map of pakistan and india----an aegis class cruiser off the coast of gujrat can intercept many a missiles coming into india.

The indian ABM's will cover the rest halfway above rajasthan. This is what I have been trying to explain in my last few posts---I did not want to get directly into the tactical issue---but the thing is that the U S is not going to allow pakistan to use its nucs successfully.

The U S is going to be a player in the game---whether pakistan likes it or don't. That is why I have been writing over here---there is no way out for pakistan other than gaining conventional strength.

If the generals are saying that cannot happen---then those generals need to be FIRED and those who can---need to be put incharge.

And again for that reason---I bring back the Yemen issue---. A 15--20 billion dollars cash upfront for the first year would have taken care of most of the strike capabilities of pakistan and 5 billion a year after that would have taken care of the major issues.

It would also had given air force bases to pakistan on the arab land to strike deep into the indian flank---and alongwith another extra 150 k troops to gain strength from at time of crisis---.

And again to thos who have not read my yemen strike force numbers here they are----.

Pakistan would release 50 K troops on the go---and in return it would ask saudi arabia to deploy one sqdrn of F15SA's at jacobabad---it would also ask emirate to deploy a sqdrn of BLK60 a J'abad and 2 sqdrn's of Mirage 2K9's at karachi----these would neuter any indian strike threat.

Pakistan would build a military cantonment at gwadar---a full blooded campaign would be started for new recruits---all newly retd general staff and officers be recalled to active duty.

With the funds----pakistan would purchase at least 100 J10C's or100 SU35's----around a 100 JH7B's or a 100 SU34's----.

For the navy---at least 2 to 4 latest models of 052's and the 054's---between 5000 to 8000 + tonnage range----10 + upgraded F22 frigate

For the army a build up to at least 10 divs of armor and artillery and 5 battalions of LR sams etc----and 5 divs of infantry.

Pakistan's salvation is in a conventional force---a strike force that can take out the cities around mumbai and beneath----.

Mumbai is the jewle in the crown---a destruction of mumbai would stop india from starting a war---.

We already know that karachi and lahore and multan would be destroyed---so we need to destroy what the enemy loves the most---where it would hurt the most.

Basically the time for a nuclear is over for pakistan. Nuclear wars look good to poor nations---nations who are in the recovery mode and see a light at the end of he tunnel---must refrain and find other means to counter---.