Pakistan F-16 Discussions 2

[Signalian]

Simple ~ Money speaks

Not really.
Agreement/undertaking/commitment/Contracts/deals should be kept. USA didn't.

 

[Shane]

You know every once in a while...I feel like working on Photoshop - taking a break from Editing & do something crazy like this.

Imagine my car in rush hour with...this!

View attachment 558390

By the way, the above image is Photoshop, but the Sunshade below isn't. I had it custom made from one of my earlier designs...

View attachment 558392
@Horus @Dubious @araz @AZADPAKISTAN2009 @Bilal Khan (Quwa) @Dazzler @fatman17 @ghazi52 @Hodor @Irfan Baloch @Imran Khan @Knuckles @Oscar @waz @Windjammer
@aeromerix @Ali_Baba @Falcon26 @Haroon Baloch @HRK @khanasifm @Liquidmetal @Maxpane @crankthatskunk @Gillani88 @graphican @GriffinsRule @Hakikat ve Hikmet @I S I @khansaheeb @member.exe @Microsoft @mingle @Mrc @Myth_buster_1 @Rafi @Sabretooth @salman-1 @Okasha Zahid @Ozee @Pakhtoon yum @PAKISTANFOREVER @Path-Finder @PWFI @Starlord @Super Falcon @TheTallGuy @Thorough Pro @TOPGUN @Tps43 @Shane @_Sherdils_ @Umair Nawaz @war&peace @War Thunder @Vortex @ziaulislam @Zulfiqar

Hmm, is that Sharjah Corniche street area in the back drop? My brother used to live in Bukhatir Tower.

 

[Trailer23]

Hmm, is that Sharjah Corniche street area in the back drop? My brother used to live in Bukhatir Tower.

Not exactly. Its actually Al Khan Corniche, which links with Mamzar (Dubai).

 

[ziaulislam]

I am not saying that PAF shouldn't negotiate or shouldn't try to get the best F-16 variant. PAF should even ask for 18 Block 70's instead of remaining 18 Block 52+ from the CSF package. Also PAF should ask V-upgrade on any further induction of used F-16's instead of the M3/M5 MLU upgrade.

EAF eventually saw F-16 Block 52+ in service in 2012-13 after constantly following up on the issue (though only 12, compared to 100 of IAF's F-16I s of similar/better capability). After 3 years Israelis had F-35's.

Since USA is keen on keeping a balance in the Pak-Indo region, PAF could argue about IAF's Rafale acquisition and S-400 SAM system.

I disagree with your thinking
Why has not this logic applied to taiwan? When they have been refused weapons

Donald trump approved weapon purely to boasts sales(economical measure)

So you see its more likley that usa would want this gap to increase and allow india overwhelming power rather than keeping it narrow

 

[Readerdefence]

Highly doubt it that USA would allow Aselsan AESA but if it allows, then that would benefit both Turkey and PAF while USA may ask for a percentage. My guess is that USA would want full business for itself. Second batch of RJAF F-16's met the same fate.

Hi signalian thx for your reply you have my doubts cleared that’s the line I’m also towing
What’s the American interest to empower Turkish company to install indigenous gadgets on
Their products either They pay Americans something or give them some good to offer the goodies
To their desired countries
I’m highly sceptical about getting AESA from Turkish company without prior approval from LM
Of USA
Thank you

 

[denel]

Not just new Jets.
USA prefers that PAF buys new as well as used jets from USA.


Difficult to agree here.
PAF decided on Jordan's F-16s but USA intervened. Funding has been sidelined, USA wants PAF to pay full price.
Sir Bilal Reported possibility of F-16 Block 40's for PAF, these are flown by USAF, Bahrain, Egypt, Turkey and Korea. Amongst them, only USAF could sell as EDA, all the other countries use them as front line jets.



USA can sell aircrafts to PAF, just at full price and not top line stuff (like F-16 Block 70 or F-35) Vis-a-vis India. It will be like Egypt and Israel saga. Egypt wanted F-15E's, Israel intervened. Similarly PAF' F-16 Block 52+ are less capable than F-16 Block 70/72 offered to India. For full price PAF can get 50 more F-16 Block 52+, but PAF wants for free or atleast funded. PAF can also go for used F-16's from USA.


13.
12 A + 1 B.

Not following you, are you saying more jets could follow via EDA?

 

[Trailer23]

India seem to be in a tight fix, themselves. Not only are they (probably/most certainly) not going to go for the F-21, which will surly upset the US - but they also have to deal with the US in regard to the Sanctions looming over their heads for procuring Oil from Iran.

Not sure what hand PAK will play in order to get new/used jets from the US.

I wish there was more clarity as to what is the Defence Budget & how much of it is allotted to the PAF - annually.

 

[Silicon0000]

Wishes, wishes, wishes & wishes

 

[Raider 21]

Not exactly. Its actually Al Khan Corniche, which links with Mamzar (Dubai).

I remember when it started developing. Now it has changed so much between 15 years and now. Mamzar park brings back a lot of BBQ memories (and one unique airshow with the Red Arrows).

 

[Signalian]

Not following you, are you saying more jets could follow via EDA?

https://defence.pk/pdf/threads/paki...an-russia-france.434792/page-17#post-11409031

I disagree with your thinking
Why has not this logic applied to taiwan? When they have been refused weapons

Donald trump approved weapon purely to boasts sales(economical measure)

So you see its more likley that usa would want this gap to increase and allow india overwhelming power rather than keeping it narrow

how is Taiwan related to this scenario?

 

[ziaulislam]

https://defence.pk/pdf/threads/paki...an-russia-france.434792/page-17#post-11409031


how is Taiwan related to this scenario?

the delusion that Pakistanis have that USA want parity of power in south asia..nothing can be far from truth

the same delusion reminds of the USA fleet of 1971

 

[Signalian]

the delusion that Pakistanis have that USA want parity of power in south asia..nothing can be far from truth

the same delusion reminds of the USA fleet of 1971

Irrelevant

 

[ziaulislam]

Irrelevant

congress is hostile to pakistan so no executive can give pakistan f16s..even if they want to..it is as simple as that..
why is congress hostile..
decades of poor diplomacy, WOT duplicity by both sides, propoganda and intense lobbying from india

now is this relevant??

you saw what happened to Obama push

Since USA is keen on keeping a balance in the Pak-Indo region, PAF could argue about IAF's Rafale acquisition and S-400 SAM system.

 

[Signalian]

congress is hostile to pakistan so no executive can give pakistan f16s..even if they want to..it is as simple as that..
why is congress hostile..
decades of poor diplomacy, WOT duplicity by both sides, propoganda and intense lobbying from india

now is this relevant??

you saw what happened to Obama push

You are trying so hard that you keep hopping from one point to another without thinking what you want to say, take a breath.
In F-16's case, CSF needs to be sorted out, procurement of F-16 itself is not an issue currently from USA.

 

[ziaulislam]

You are trying so hard that you keep hopping from one point to another without thinking what you want to say, take a breath.
In F-16's case, CSF needs to be sorted out, procurement of F-16 itself is not an issue currently from USA.

fact 1: congress is hostile to pakistan and thus will not allow FMF any more
facts 2: you mentioned USA want a parity in indo--pak scenrio which is wrong(this started the discussion)
fact 3: CSF fund is dead, if resumed will need approval from congress which again is going to be difficult
fact 4: india is investing heavily in lobbying in USA which pakistan ignores
fact 5: afghan leverage that pakistan has is strong but USA has a stronger IMF leverage
Fact 6: most pakistanis live in delusions of early 2000s and 1970s that USA favours pakistan, nothing can be far from the turth


best case scenario USA allows full pay f16s(too expensive not worth it anymore, the reason why PAF walked from B52) or used f16s via EDA(less likley, as even israel sales were blocked)