Pakistan defiant on Iran gas pipeline

[ziaulislam]

Why cant the Iranians build the Pakistani side as they have the necessary tech and experience to do it especially if they do it on BOT basis..this will make the IP deal more lucrative then anything else on table.

they are SELLING the gas to us at the highest rate possible thats why!

We should go for both projects for the future of our nation.

If the US is so bothered it should fund all the pipeline in TAPI and provide all funds for its security, which of course it won't as it bankrupt in fundamental terms. If it doesn't want to invest then it should shut the f up and mind its own business.

Why is there such a disparity in prices:

Iranian Gas: $12 per mmbtu
TAPI LNG: $18 per mmbtu BUT $4.5 per mmbtu with US persuasion. If the TAPI line can guarantee LNG at $4.5 for 50+ years with no increase in price in the future we should shake their hands and sign the deal.

How the hell can US get such a discount, i'm sure at that price they would save a lot in importing the gas to the US. Something fishy here.

Form a new bank that only deals with Iran and the US can stick its sanctions where the sun don't shine.

prices are always set on fuel. its 78% for iran, 70% from pipeline of Turkmenistan). now if USA can ensure it around 30-40 as it appears, then it will be absolute foolish decision to continue this project. We should then focus on TAPI,coal and hydral for long term. and LNG for short time...but i dont think so this would happen as the project has been politicised by both govt an opposition, in other words the IP proj is now a political one not a economic one.

 

[Fracker]

they are SELLING the gas to us at the highest rate possible thats why!



prices are always set on fuel. its 78% for iran, 70% from pipeline of Turkmenistan). now if USA can ensure it around 30-40 as it appears, then it will be absolute foolish decision to continue this project. We should then focus on TAPI,coal and hydral for long term. and LNG for short time...but i dont think so this would happen as the project has been politicised by both govt an opposition, in other words the IP proj is now a political one not a economic one.

Just with a small problem, USA can't secure their embassies in Afghanistan, how they gonna secure Pakistan's Pipeline which is Zero interest of US Also, May be Gas is costly for Government Pakistan, but not for the people of Pakistan, they are already paying 230% of what Iran has offered.

It will remove the burden of Oil purchases for Electricity, so again beneficiary. Lastly, Iran side of gas pipeline is complete now Pakistan needs to link it with Multan, while TAPI requires new infrastructure, so will take time.

And may be some day down the road when Pakistan Coal extraction is established they wouldn't need any import so it would be easy to discontinue or move that line to other needy ones (e.g. India, China)

 

[lem34]

$1.5 billion is a much more manageable figure. I hope that a firm deal is announced during the upcoming Russian visit. That will really give the impetus needed for the project.

I read that there is a penalty clause in the contract that Pakistan has with Iran of US8 mill dollars per day if its not complete by 2014, Also Iranians have offered to assist finance if necessary. So I think that means that Putins pipelines are more likely than American Silk Road

 

[VCheng]

I read that there is a penalty clause in the contract that Pakistan has with Iran of US8 mill dollars per day if its not complete by 2014, Also Iranians have offered to assist finance if necessary. So I think that means that Putins pipelines are more likely than American Silk Road

Pakistan surely needs the energy, so it would be a good thing if the pipeline is built. Somehow I still don't feel as optimistic as you are.

 

[lem34]

Pakistan surely needs the energy, so it would be a good thing if the pipeline is built. Somehow I still don't feel as optimistic as you are.

Well I know there is pressure from some quarters. But this shows Pakistan is totally committed. As is Iran by being prepared to pay for it all. But to be honest I want Russians to get involved.

After having distilled many conversations many of them with you too. I think the feeling can be summed up as China Russia Pakistan and Iran an alliance forged or forced on the participants by American threats to their red lines

 

[mosu]

Just with a small problem, USA can't secure their embassies in Afghanistan, how they gonna secure Pakistan's Pipeline which is Zero interest of US Also, May be Gas is costly for Government Pakistan, but not for the people of Pakistan, they are already paying 230% of what Iran has offered.

It will remove the burden of Oil purchases for Electricity, so again beneficiary. Lastly, Iran side of gas pipeline is complete now Pakistan needs to link it with Multan, while TAPI requires new infrastructure, so will take time.

And may be some day down the road when Pakistan Coal extraction is established they wouldn't need any import so it would be easy to discontinue or move that line to other needy ones (e.g. India, China)

yes you are right now we have to leave america and stand on our own and make good relations with russian with the help of iran

 

[VCheng]

Well I know there is pressure from some quarters. But this shows Pakistan is totally committed. As is Iran by being prepared to pay for it all. But to be honest I want Russians to get involved.

After having distilled many conversations many of them with you too. I think the feeling can be summed up as China Russia Pakistan and Iran an alliance forged or forced on the participants by American threats to their red lines

To be honest, I see that alliance as being even less likely than the IP pipeline.

 

[lem34]

To be honest, I see that alliance as being even less likely than the IP pipeline.

I know mate that's cos you American. But look at when you and I started talking on here. I remember you saying with authority forcefully that ip pipeline would not happen. Today we are a lot further down the road and even you are having second thoughts

 

[Abu Zolfiqar]

Last week, a senior US diplomat reportedly warned Islamabad that any attempt to go ahead with the gas pipeline would be considered as "furthering Iran's nuclear program"

to say desperation knows no bounds is one thing.......

but this is way beyond the point of ABSURD; borderline INSANITY

This is good news , Iran shouldn't be isolated

At the same time some one tell me whether there exists any rail network between pakistan and Iran and if it does wouldnt it be easier/cheaper to transport it via rail network ?

how would rail be cheaper or easier????

Why cant the Iranians build the Pakistani side as they have the necessary tech and experience to do it especially if they do it on BOT basis..this will make the IP deal more lucrative then anything else on table.

because that was not part of the deal

 

[VCheng]

I know mate that's cos you American. But look at when you and I started talking on here. I remember you saying with authority forcefully that ip pipeline would not happen. Today we are a lot further down the road and even you are having second thoughts

I am not having any second thoughts: I still think the IP pipeline is not going to happen for a long time yet.

 

[Alchemy]

how would rail be cheaper or easier????

If there is already physical infrastructure available (ie rail network ) then billions of dollors can be saved on building pipelines

If relations between Pak and Iran turns sour and you stop importing oil from them then the pipeline infrastructure goes waste

 

[Abu Zolfiqar]

Pakistan surely needs the energy, so it would be a good thing if the pipeline is built. Somehow I still don't feel as optimistic as you are.

well the onus is on the government.....will they buckle and bow before their masters or will they "bite the bullet" and realize that their own population comes first

a few months ago, I clearly stated that Pakistan - as a member state @ UN and a non-perm. member of UNSC - it is bound to meet its interational obligations. But we have gotten to the point where we're busy listening to external diktat and doing nothing to address our domestic concerns.


un-interrupted energy supplies is a TOP priority and any sane Pakistani with even a pea-size brain would agree to that since they are affected by the power shortages.....


Pakistani diplomats, spin-masters, etc. need to go into overdrive and basically explain to the UN that this is an old initiative we've had. Sanctions, resolutions change all the time. But we can't just abandon a project we've already invested time and money in.


if either UN or a few state department guys have a problem with it, show them the middle finger and move on......have some dignity and pride, for God's sakes. Nation always comes first before ANYTHING else.

If there is already physical infrastructure available (ie rail network ) then billions of dollors can be saved on building pipelines

you are kidding me, right???








p.s. as for railways -- well there is the Islamabad-Tehran-Istanbul rail-link which was inaugurated sometime last year; it has nothing to do however with energy supplies trade

 

[VCheng]

well the onus is on the government.....will they buckle and bow before their masters or will they "bite the bullet" and realize that their own population comes first....................

What odds would you give me for a bet on those two choices? Be honest now.

 

[lem34]

I am not having any second thoughts: I still think the IP pipeline is not going to happen for a long time yet.

originally you were insisting in your op ed less than six months that it was not going to happen at all. Go check your posts. So that is some movement from your traditional partisan stand. btw it has started.

to say desperation knows no bounds is one thing.......

but this is way beyond the point of ABSURD; borderline INSANITY

But that is inference to be drawn from Cheng position lol

how would rail be cheaper or easier????

Only an Indian would bring that up lol

because that was not part of the deal

Iran is fully committed they have completed their side of pipeline and they have offered to finance it

If relations between Pak and Iran turns sour and you stop importing oil from them then the pipeline infrastructure goes waste

Long term contract has been signed immaterial of relations

well the onus is on the government.....will they buckle and bow before their masters or will they "bite the bullet" and realize that their own population comes first

a few months ago, I clearly stated that Pakistan - as a member state @ UN and a non-perm. member of UNSC - it is bound to meet its interational obligations. But we have gotten to the point where we're busy listening to external diktat and doing nothing to address our domestic concerns.


un-interrupted energy supplies is a TOP priority and any sane Pakistani with even a pea-size brain would agree to that since they are affected by the power shortages.....


Pakistani diplomats, spin-masters, etc. need to go into overdrive and basically explain to the UN that this is an old initiative we've had. Sanctions, resolutions change all the time. But we can't just abandon a project we've already invested time and money in.


if either UN or a few state department guys have a problem with it, show them the middle finger and move on......have some dignity and pride, for God's sakes. Nation always comes first before ANYTHING else.

Guys a contract has been signed and Pakistan would be liable to penalty clauses. In any event others have been granted waivers to the sanctions

What odds would you give me for a bet on those two choices? Be honest now.

What odds would you have given me when you thought transit routes would be reopened in 30 days

 

[VCheng]

...............

What odds would you have given me when you thought transit routes would be reopened in 30 days

Yes, I was wrong about that; hence I am asking others to establish the odds this time.

(BTW, the NATO routes were kicked to the PCNS to make the politicians look bad intentionally by the Army, very likely, causing the delay. I did not think they would be so selfish, but there you are!)