Pakistan Army's VT-4 Main Battle Tank | Updates & Discussions

[arslank03]

I see nothing wrong in buying Chinese equipment, especially if they come with transfer of technology.

Fvck buying Western shit.

Western shit is overpriced anyways.

lol western equip is more advanced in every way.

 

[TheSolution]

lol western equip is more advanced in every way.

Chinese can't be too far off can they? They've been closing the gap at a fast pace and sinking a lot of funds

 

[arslank03]

Chinese can't be too far off can they? They've been closing the gap at a fast pace and sinking a lot of funds

potentially, in some areas, but i think in alot of areas they will stay supreme, especially metallurgy, the example i love using is the F-16, current SLEP programs are extending service lives to 12,000 hours, however, Lockheed belives they can push further after testing the airframes for up to 27,000 hours. The goal was for an aircraft with a 4000 hour service life, they doubled it with the design, then tripled it, and will likely further extend it.

 

[TheSolution]

potentially, in some areas, but i think in alot of areas they will stay supreme, especially metallurgy, the example i love using is the F-16, current SLEP programs are extending service lives to 12,000 hours, however, Lockheed belives they can push further after testing the airframes for up to 27,000 hours. The goal was for an aircraft with a 4000 hour service life, they doubled it with the design, then tripled it, and will likely further extend it.

Nice that's amazing, quick question though, are we manufacturing the VT4 tanks fully in-house?

 

[arslank03]

Nice that's amazing, quick question though, are we manufacturing the VT4 tanks fully in-house?

license producing them with full localisation of certain aspects i.e the gun is fully domestically sourced parts

 

[farooqbhai007]

license producing them with full localisation of certain aspects i.e the gun is fully domestically sourced parts

Nice that's amazing, quick question though, are we manufacturing the VT4 tanks fully in-house?

Afaik Gun barrels used was never Chinese. Instead HIT origin barrels were to be fitted onto them.
Secondly a significant number of other parts have been localized with tot and gradually full tank will be localized.
For Example VT4 Drivers thermal sight made locally.

 

[Muji.Iqbal]

you have blasphemed

Western equipment may be more advanced than Chinese technology, but after Iraq was destroyed in Iraq war, West can never be trusted.

 

[arslank03]

Western equipment may be more advanced than Chinese technology, but after Iraq was destroyed in Iraq war, West can never be trusted.

why can china be trusted? they specifically export downgraded hardware, why are they trusted?

 

[Signalian]

why can china be trusted? they specifically export downgraded hardware, why are they trusted?

Pakistan conducts JVs with China so if the equipment is considered inadequate in any way, it’s upgraded either by Pakistan or China is asked to upgrade it otherwise a third party solution is put in place.

 

[TheSolution]

why can china be trusted? they specifically export downgraded hardware, why are they trusted?

There's an irrational level of Sinophilia on PDF to the point where its just not pragmatic at all

I've heard some very distasteful stories of collaborations with them, like petty stories from their side to extract as much cash as possible

 

[Muji.Iqbal]

Pakistan conducts JVs with China so if the equipment is considered inadequate in any way, it’s upgraded either by Pakistan or China is asked to upgrade it otherwise a third party solution is put in place.

Exactly, China has always helped Pakistan. There are many Pakistani students studying in China as well.

 

[arslank03]

There's an irrational level of Sinophilia on PDF to the point where its just not pragmatic at all

I've heard some very distasteful stories of collaborations with them, like petty stories from their side to extract as much cash as possible

they're not just stories, they are fact, infact, i literally had a conversation with the head of APF where he told me CATIC withholds part numbers to prevent pac from buying from elsewhere, alongside this, they refuse to sell the parts needed unless pac buys other things they may not need alongside it. i.e if we need a screw, we cant buy it, they make us buy the washer, the nut, the screwdriver and then some or tell us to kick rocks if we dont want it all. They know we dont have a choice since we dont have the required info to source elswhere

Exactly, China has always helped Pakistan. There are many Pakistani students studying in China as well.

lol read my post and let me know how much china "helps" pakistan. BTW, Those Pakistani students, are they there on their own money or Chinese state funds? lol

Pakistan conducts JVs with China so if the equipment is considered inadequate in any way, it’s upgraded either by Pakistan or China is asked to upgrade it otherwise a third party solution is put in place.

Theres no way to be certain whether equipment will perform as it should in a conflict scenario. Just look up the soviets and their history of Monkey models, something the Russians still practice (which bit the Indians, even after their rigorous testing and extensive experience with the R77) and likely the Chinese too.

There's an irrational level of Sinophilia on PDF to the point where its just not pragmatic at all

I've heard some very distasteful stories of collaborations with them, like petty stories from their side to extract as much cash as possible

it's just this embarrassing thing of Pakistanis becoming so desperate they will bend over backwards for whoever can show them any sort of attention. Tomorrow Israel could say one good thig about Pakistan andd it will all be "izrael pakistan bhai bhai sem 2 sem i want 2 marry izrael womans"

 

[TheSolution]

it's just this embarrassing thing of Pakistanis becoming so desperate they will bend over backwards for whoever can show them any sort of attention. Tomorrow Israel could say one good thig about Pakistan andd it will all be "izrael pakistan bhai bhai sem 2 sem i want 2 marry izrael womans"

I blame the state partially because it so heavily exaggerates relationships to its population and really makes them think it goes beyond politics, like the saying with Turkey how they exaggerate "1 nation 2 states" and then the whole saying with Chinese friendship being "higher than the Himalayans, sweeter than honey" etc, etc.

Too much exaggeration and our people tend to be naive and take it at face value.

Theres no way to be certain whether equipment will perform as it should in a conflict scenario. Just look up the soviets and their history of Monkey models, something the Russians still practice (which bit the Indians, even after their rigorous testing and extensive experience with the R77) and likely the Chinese too.

How does the western world manage to produce comparatively better performing and more reliable systems? I guess harsher and more rigorous testing

Also with the Indians, in the early days they didn't have much modern American tech to experience in comparison to the Soviet stuff

I hope Pakistan's experience with high quality US weapon systems gives it a benchmark of quality to always meet

 

[iLION12345_1]

license producing them with full localisation of certain aspects i.e the gun is fully domestically sourced parts

In just a couple years, more of the VT4 will be made locally than the Al-Khalid ever was. Currently it’s license production of some parts, local production go some parts, and full local assembly, however soon components down to the base armor will be locally produced, as was the case with AK

 

[Signalian]

Theres no way to be certain whether equipment will perform as it should in a conflict scenario. Just look up the soviets and their history of Monkey models, something the Russians still practice (which bit the Indians, even after their rigorous testing and extensive experience with the R77) and likely the Chinese too.

There are SOPs in place which ensure the mechanisms, effectiveness and upgradation of equipment that Pakistan buys from China. The equipment or weapon is thoroughly tested under different conditions of realistic scenarios.

You should talk to test pilots, engineers and drivers/loaders etc.