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Pakistan army wants peace, says Musharraf

Nepal or Bhutan don't suffer on account of being allies. As a matter of fact we respect their wishes more.

Ask them how they feel? Better yet, ask the Bengalis how they feel?

No one thinks that PA will disband. But you can see a clear trend that PAs capability vis a vis India is steadily eroding. There was a time they could more than match IA. Then there came a time they could be equal in everything. For a while there has been talk of minimum deterrence. This will also go out the window if for another two decades India grows while Pakistan stays stuck economically.

Actually PA's capabilities are increasing vis a vis India. She is slowly closing some of the major advances IA had made and is buying exactly the weapons she needs to pin down any advancing IA Armour Formations. There was never a time when PA was equivalent of IA. Putting all the propaganda theories aside, IA always had superior resources at her disposal. IA could always afford to throw more men, money and weapons against PA.

PA today doesn't have the military means to strike deep inside India except for missiles. Yes not even PAF has the capability to bomb targets deep in India.

Than you need to update yourself on Pakistan's missile capabilities. Pakistan does not has just a few missiles, it has many missiles and mind you very sophisticated missiles that can strike deep in the heart of India. Why would PAF need to to fly deep to drop bombs deep inside India when she can launch of stand off weapons near the borders and let them strike the targets with pinpoint accuracy. Your Generals are aware of Pakistan's capability to strike deep inside India, that is why they have avoided putting a show down :).

It's just a question of time if the trend of the last decade stays the same. You can imagine the costs already for Pakistan is today around 45% of Pakistan annual budget is spent on defense. Even then, their military no longer enjoys the same strength against India as it used to in the past. The economy will not be able to compete with India.

Again you need to update yourself on Pakistan's budget, the military last year consumed around 17% of the total budget. Pakistan's economy might be going through a rough patch right now, but this trend is not going to stay for the long term. There is wide consensus in Pakistan that the economy needs to grow. Even this corrupt and inefficient Government like PPP has taken notice of this and has initiated several steps to get the economy back on track. The entire premise behind your argument is flawed because you are assuming that Pakistan's economy will continue to grow at 2-3%. Anyone who has studied Pakistan's economy closely would know that for Pakistan to grow at 6-7% is not much of a big deal, we only need some reforms to initiate this growth on which we are working on.

PA recognized long back in the late 80s that they cannot win militarily. But they thought they could strategically and economically and diplomatically. Thus the strategy of using jihadis. Today they realize that this is also no longer possible.

It was at best a tactical move, never a strategic move.

The only reason that there is a change in PAs thinking is because they realize that the gap is increasing. Its not out of a change in heart. This change in thinking is a direct result of India becoming stronger in the globe in every sense.

I have no idea of what gap you are talking about, i would actually argue that PA today is a lot less vulnerable than it was in the 1980's. PA today is a much more mobile and fast force than it was in the past. She can mobilize much faster than IA and has the right weapons to pin down any advancing formations or IAF sorties. The mindset has changed on the Indian side where they have accepted that they cannot win a large scale static conventional war against Pakistan and are changing their doctrine to fight fast and mobile battles against Pakistan. I would have thought that Operation Parakram and 26/11 was proof enough of this that IA cannot defeat PA in a show down. Words alone won't make your argument any stronger, actions would and Indian actions have been contrary to your words.

That is not real politik. Why would Pakistan realistically expect equality when they know India has a stronger hand. And delaying any solution is in India's interest as India gains more with time. Let me put it the other way round. Why would India give up its advantages when it knows that Pakistan cannot take anything by force or by global diplomatic pressure. When Pakistan is grappling with a massive terrorism backlash and no economic growth. India knows it's position with respect to Pakistan will only get stronger.

Well the time frame is quite short my friend, you have till 2014. The only reason India has a strong hand is because Pakistan is occupied with problems on its Western borders and India has been lucky enough to piggyback on the efforts of NATO to acquire a foothold in Afghanistan to start a proxy war against Pakistan. She has done quite well in that regard, but as the US winds up and leaves, who is going to provide India with the protection she needs in Afghanistan? Or better yet, the US has started to implement stabilization measures in Afghanistan and Indian support for terrorism inside Pakistan is contrary to those measures. Sooner or later, the US will put its foot down against Indian activities.

An example to prove my point is siachen. India wanted agpl marked. Pakistan did not. Because signing an agpl would mean defacto agreeing or accepting Indian occupancy. Almost legitimizing it if there is a future confrontation. Pakistan is now agreeing to signing the agpl to get India to vacate as that is the only way.

There will be other such instances. India simply has no incentive to leave and/or to act according to Pakistan's wishes. For there to be a deal there has to be an incentive for India as well. An incentive worth the price asked.

A big incentive would be long lasting peace. It does appear that Indians have gotten cocky because they have been able to attack and bleed Pakistan through a proxy war while Pakistan has not been able to fight back due to divided attentions. As this WOT winds down, this will free up resources and would allow PA and the ISI to focus on India. Than the real game would start as it would be upto India whether she wants to up the ante or not. Any terrorist support by Indian Intelligence Agencies will be replied in kind by Pakistan.
 
This lion said, Americans told me they would bomb Pakistan to stone age, hence we supported American's war on terror.

However, from India's point of view, he was the best Pakistani President. He was willing to walk maximum distance on Kashmir.



Was it RAW that denied Awami League the right to form the government in Pakistan?
That was the move that the main reason behind the disintegration of Pakistan.
Your army just quickened the secession by causing widespread atrocities on Bengalils during operatin search light.

Awami leage saga was at its best an internal matter of Pakistan, who r u to get into the internal matters of another country.
I mean what right u have to do that!!!!!!
 
There is no cure for Indian Boogeyman syndrome, Pakistani Army has fed of it for years and will do so for till the end.

as far as the title is concerned, Musharraf is absolutely right, pakistan army does want peace, any conflict with India comes with a chance of reducing its power over the nation.... 71's loss saw bhutto taking over... Pakistani army will not risk relinquishing power to another civilian leader.

it seems the guy sandy who is a very anti pakistan.LOL he forgets that even today Pak army is not in charge in Gov but is a Cult gov whom they support regardless of what Pakistanis support ie Army n will do it forever even if they "so called" lose to india, that they actually they cant!
 
These declassified files are proof enough Pakistan was supporting Naga and Mizo Insurgents as early as 1960s

farland7apr1970b.jpg


farland7apr1970c.jpg


farland7apr1970d.jpg


India merely returned the favor

LOL where were they before??? why now today when Pak has busted yr Bubble of Refugee excuse:rofl:

This is enought reason to belive that these files r just a lie.
Another stunt by yr establishment and RAW to malign the truth n reality.
 
it seems the guy sandy who is a very anti pakistan.LOL he forgets that even today Pak army is not in charge in Gov but is a Cult gov whom they support regardless of what Pakistanis support ie Army n will do it forever even if they "so called" lose to india, that they actually they cant!

anD iT alSo seEms the gUy saNdy also believE Pak Fauj still run country ... Foriegn poLicy still dominated by jarnail... and I dont understand the rest of post.

Now that was fun.... As far as my personal opinion is concerned I am not anti pakistan, I am against Anti- India Rhetoric of few pakistanis. I am big proponent of the belief that, India and pakistan are destined to share good harmonious relations in future and is will be the future power house when it comes to technology, arts and culture.
 
Ask them how they feel? Better yet, ask the Bengalis how they feel?
Hardly. The GoI enjoys good relations with Bangladesh. Razakars notwithstanding. India and BD are enjoying the warmest relations in decades!
Actually PA's capabilities are increasing vis a vis India. She is slowly closing some of the major advances IA had made and is buying exactly the weapons she needs to pin down any advancing IA Armour Formations. There was never a time when PA was equivalent of IA. Putting all the propaganda theories aside, IA always had superior resources at her disposal. IA could always afford to throw more men, money and weapons against PA.
Its no longer about the IA or PA. Its about the IAF and PAF now.

There is no propaganda theory. IA did have superior resources in terms of quantity. However that quantity was not/could not be deployed against Pakistan. The reason was a combination of logistics and other borders. In all situations India could never field/exploit those numbers in a timely manner. It was a lumbering giant. That is changing now.

Than you need to update yourself on Pakistan's missile capabilities. Pakistan does not has just a few missiles, it has many missiles and mind you very sophisticated missiles that can strike deep in the heart of India. Why would PAF need to to fly deep to drop bombs deep inside India when she can launch of stand off weapons near the borders and let them strike the targets with pinpoint accuracy. Your Generals are aware of Pakistan's capability to strike deep inside India, that is why they have avoided putting a show down :).
Not really. Pakistan's missile capabilities are nothing to boast of.
This starts straight from CM's to BM's. As far as CM's are concerned, we are putting up a rather decent SAM network, something that Pakistan is not even close to doing. We are a LOT less vulnerable to Pakistani missiles than Pakistan is to ours.

Again you need to update yourself on Pakistan's budget, the military last year consumed around 17% of the total budget. Pakistan's economy might be going through a rough patch right now, but this trend is not going to stay for the long term. There is wide consensus in Pakistan that the economy needs to grow. Even this corrupt and inefficient Government like PPP has taken notice of this and has initiated several steps to get the economy back on track. The entire premise behind your argument is flawed because you are assuming that Pakistan's economy will continue to grow at 2-3%. Anyone who has studied Pakistan's economy closely would know that for Pakistan to grow at 6-7% is not much of a big deal, we only need some reforms to initiate this growth on which we are working on.
You can work on it all you want. I dont see action happening. Pakistan is in the midst of a quasi civil war. You dont just jump back to 7% growth in a couple of years.

Most economic predictions about Pakistan are clear that Pakistan will till 2020 stay under 5% growth rate. Frankly thats not enough for your own domestic needs considering your young population that needs to get employed and especially when your biggest rival in addition to having a bigger base is growing faster.

It was at best a tactical move, never a strategic move.
Doubtful of this statement. Pakistan invested way too much in it to be a mere tactical move. It was meant to be a strategic initiative to bog India down much like how it did to USSR in Afghanistan.

It was meant to put India in such rough conditions that India came running to Pakistan asking for a peace deal/compromise. That never happened.

I have no idea of what gap you are talking about, i would actually argue that PA today is a lot less vulnerable than it was in the 1980's. PA today is a much more mobile and fast force than it was in the past. She can mobilize much faster than IA and has the right weapons to pin down any advancing formations or IAF sorties.
IA can mobilize much faster today as well. Its not about the PA mobilizing faster than IA. Its about IA being able to mobilize in a certain amount of time that allows GoI to respond before international pressure sets in.


The mindset has changed on the Indian side where they have accepted that they cannot win a large scale static conventional war against Pakistan and are changing their doctrine to fight fast and mobile battles against Pakistan. I would have thought that Operation Parakram and 26/11 was proof enough of this that IA cannot defeat PA in a show down. Words alone won't make your argument any stronger, actions would and Indian actions have been contrary to your words.
Well IA is still in the process of a major modernization that appears will get completed around 2020.

Secondly, IAF today is much better and capable vis-a-vis PAF. This applies to both technological aspects and numerical aspects. Yes PAF acquiring BVR capable platforms and AEW&C does mean it has the capability. How many planes does the PAF have to exploit that capability.
This coupled with changes in IAF infrastructure-which again as i said is being developed to be able to field massed numbers against Pakistan-for the first time.

This coupled with lack of LRSAM coverage in Pakistan. And frankly in the timeframe of 2020, PAF's position will only get worse.

Well the time frame is quite short my friend, you have till 2014. The only reason India has a strong hand is because Pakistan is occupied with problems on its Western borders and India has been lucky enough to piggyback on the efforts of NATO to acquire a foothold in Afghanistan to start a proxy war against Pakistan. She has done quite well in that regard, but as the US winds up and leaves, who is going to provide India with the protection she needs in Afghanistan? Or better yet, the US has started to implement stabilization measures in Afghanistan and Indian support for terrorism inside Pakistan is contrary to those measures. Sooner or later, the US will put its foot down against Indian activities.
You are assuming that the insurgency in Pakistan is because of Indian activities in Afghanistan. Pakistan NOT been able to provide any kind of proof to any authority either Indian or NATO or American. Yes heresay of uncircumcized bodies of terrorists donot count for proof unless you are a Pakistani waiting for a conspiracy theory.

These are Pakistani's who are killing in Pakistan. They want Taliban rule. Your army has ruled out an operation against them because of the massive backlash it would yield.

Im sorry, your argument that everything will be nice and dandy as soon as US leaves Afghanistan is highly mistaken.

Pakistan is suffering from insurgency by the very mouths that it once fed. It will take a jolly good time period to clean them off. India is in a strong position not because Pakistan is bogged down by Afghanistan. Its because India has increased its economy to the point that major powers in the world are willing to oblige India because of it. India has increased its diplomatic ability coupled with military abilities.

And it seems its only going to get better.
Pakistan being caught in the doldrums in an added advantage to India, not the core of the changing world order.

As long as we continue to outpace Pakistan economically and consequentially militarily and diplomatically, we will continue to be in a better position vis-a-vis Pakistan than ever before.
Why would an India in such a strong position give in to Pakistan's demand? Or give equality to Pakistan. Today India and Pakistan are not equal by any measure of stick and are not likely to be so in the future as well.

A big incentive would be long lasting peace. It does appear that Indians have gotten cocky because they have been able to attack and bleed Pakistan through a proxy war while Pakistan has not been able to fight back due to divided attentions. As this WOT winds down, this will free up resources and would allow PA and the ISI to focus on India. Than the real game would start as it would be upto India whether she wants to up the ante or not. Any terrorist support by Indian Intelligence Agencies will be replied in kind by Pakistan.
Lasting peace? India already has peace. Even at the worst of times in the 90's when Pakistan's ISI directed the entire Afghan jihad infrastructure against India, India grew faster than Pakistan.

ISI can focus all it wants on India now. India has used this intervening period to be build up its own set of defences. The LoC is not half as easy as it used to be earlier for militants to cross over. Our military is not half as unprepared as it was when Kargil occurred.
As far as offensive options are concerned, today we are financially and diplomatically capable of stoking terrorism in Pakistan a lot more easily and efficiently than Pakistan can reply in turn.

We have and are building global alliances and favourable positions to be used when the need arises. Pakistan as i said before, is no longer in the position it always was against India - India's perfect counterweight.

Let me put things in a better perspective here - what does India gain by compromising with Pakistan. Pakistan has nothing to offer India. We have peace. And Pakistan seems unlikely to get the required heft to be able to stoke terrorism in India, India has prepared quite well for that. Besides, the global environment and apetite foe 'freedom movements' has diminished quite a bit.

So what do we get? Consider this fact as well. Kashmir is a small part of a big country for India, so most Indians dont want to/dont care enough to compromise with Pakistan over non tangible gains. Its just not that big a deal for India. Whereas for Pakistan, Kashmir is a large part of a small country. So it means a lot to you.

And any deal for Kashmir can only go through the Parliament by Special majority, as any cessation of territory mandatorily requires it. And no govt in the recent past has ever acquired that kind of a majority. Even if GoI wants to compromise on Kashmir, the rest of the Parties will not allow it. They will ask - what do we gain. Abstract notions of peace dont cut it.
We already have what we want. What we really want is trade. We are getting it already without even talking on Kashmir.
 
anD iT alSo seEms the gUy saNdy also believE Pak Fauj still run country ... Foriegn poLicy still dominated by jarnail... and I dont understand the rest of post.

Now that was fun.... As far as my personal opinion is concerned I am not anti pakistan, I am against Anti- India Rhetoric of few pakistanis. I am big proponent of the belief that, India and pakistan are destined to share good harmonious relations in future and is will be the future power house when it comes to technology, arts and culture.

LOL ur an anti pakistan but u still believe that we should not call u the same way as u should be called ie anti pakistan:bad:
just because of two lines u have posted in the previous post!!!:lol:
Hamain bacha samja hua ha kia???

The posts of yr fellow indian brothers spoke louder that u want to make Pakistan a slave of yr 'mighty' india!!!!
Those at its best r just wet dreams n too ambitious by just judging us by our this time only!

If u remember i told u that its just since 1992 u have been able to do well in economy but that doesnt mean that u were same always n in future u will remain same.
I like i had said before its just because u had just more then a single leader ie Gandhi. Nehru. Azad.Patel etc who had also lived long enough to make yr basics right atleast economically by setting up the building blocks of yr domestic industry n gave it enough time upto 1992 to expand their business and make them strong that tommorrow they could compete both domestically n internationally with foreign MNCs.

Now thats exactly we need to do as to setup our domestic industry n give it time to grow!!!
Thats all its no rocket science its just economic staps that needed to be taken in the right direction.

Generally yr posts n given the fact that u got banned too, are anti pakistani.
Like in the same thread where u n me were having debate about is issue.
I had noticed yr attitude n how u were saying to me that we dont n need lectures from u n all, also at some point u had said that if the friendly relations does happen its win-win situation for both but i will like to c end of just nostilities but not friendly relations as its not in the best of interests of India as well.
The after that in my reply i had called u arrogent because of yr tone n attitude.
Since then im observing u n have concluded that even u say that ur not anti pakistani but u do things which dont give such impression so its safe to conclude that yr a Anti Pakistani Indian!.
 
LOL ur an anti pakistan but u still believe that we should not call u the same way as u should be called ie anti pakistan:bad:
just because of two lines u have posted in the previous post!!!:lol:
Hamain bacha samja hua ha kia???

The posts of yr fellow indian brothers spoke louder that u want to make Pakistan a slave of yr 'mighty' india!!!!
Those at its best r just wet dreams n too ambitious by just judging us by our this time only!

If u remember i told u that its just since 1992 u have been able to do well in economy but that doesnt mean that u were same always n in future u will remain same.
I like i had said before its just because u had just more then a single leader ie Gandhi. Nehru. Azad.Patel etc who had also lived long enough to make yr basics right atleast economically by setting up the building blocks of yr domestic industry n gave it enough time upto 1992 to expand their business and make them strong that tommorrow they could compete both domestically n internationally with foreign MNCs.

Now thats exactly we need to do as to setup our domestic industry n give it time to grow!!!
Thats all its no rocket science its just economic staps that needed to be taken in the right direction.

Generally yr posts n given the fact that u got banned too, are anti pakistani.
Like in the same thread where u n me were having debate about is issue.
I had noticed yr attitude n how u were saying to me that we dont n need lectures from u n all, also at some point u had said that if the friendly relations does happen its win-win situation for both but i will like to c end of just nostilities but not friendly relations as its not in the best of interests of India as well.
The after that in my reply i had called u arrogent because of yr tone n attitude.
Since then im observing u n have concluded that even u say that ur not anti pakistani but u do things which dont give such impression so its safe to conclude that yr a Anti Pakistani Indian!.

ok...:wave:
 
There will be no peace with india, development and advancement comes in stages the pakistani military needs to keep developing

what pakistan has achived with a fraction of the military budget others have is frankly a miracle

If you subtract the pakistani population from the indian population you still have over a billion indians left, they are 5 times our land mass

after partition we were left with a smallet land mass and a muslim population divided by three entities

what we have achived against a much bigger enemy is superb

Indias economic development has increased its defence budget and allowed it to purchase weapons

pakistan must keep pace to the best of our abilities and target indias economy and internal divisions

timed will change as a nation pakistan is a countty waiting befor an economic revolution

We must kerp building alliances, keep developing our weapons, our nuclear missiles and stop talking peace and take action
 
For peace Pakistan army has to accept that they can no longer compete with India.
They could earlier. Today they cannot. The minimum deterrence level is also reducing over the last decade.

They will have to accept by virtue of might diplomatic and military that any solution will only be in Indias favor.

And there is evidence to this tune that PA has a change in thought process.

And what do you think about our larger, stronger and more deadly nuclear arsenal.
 
Hardly. The GoI enjoys good relations with Bangladesh. Razakars notwithstanding. India and BD are enjoying the warmest relations in decades!

Visit the Bangladesh Subsection, you will get the gist of what i am saying.

Its no longer about the IA or PA. Its about the IAF and PAF now.

No doubt about that, but in order for India to accomplish its task it needs to bring in Ground Forces. Air Force can at best launch punitive strikes, its main purpose is to support the Ground Forces. Thus, your analogy is wrong in discounting the IA from the picture.

There is no propaganda theory. IA did have superior resources in terms of quantity. However that quantity was not/could not be deployed against Pakistan. The reason was a combination of logistics and other borders. In all situations India could never field/exploit those numbers in a timely manner. It was a lumbering giant. That is changing now.

So was it Pakistan's fault that India was not able to mobilize in time? The facts are that the Indians outgunned and outmanned Pakistan in every sphere. Coming out alive was a miracle for Pakistan considering the immense asymmetry in terms of resources fielded by India.

Not really. Pakistan's missile capabilities are nothing to boast of.
This starts straight from CM's to BM's. As far as CM's are concerned, we are putting up a rather decent SAM network, something that Pakistan is not even close to doing. We are a LOT less vulnerable to Pakistani missiles than Pakistan is to ours.

I only wish your Generals felt as secure as you do. You still have not been able to disprove my point that Pakistan can strike hard and deep inside India. Pakistan is more vulnerable because we always focused on offensive oriented weapons due to lack of resources. This is why we have ensured that we will make the cost of victory very high for India, and if need comes assure mutual destruction of both the countries.

You can work on it all you want. I dont see action happening. Pakistan is in the midst of a quasi civil war. You dont just jump back to 7% growth in a couple of years.

Pakistan's economic growth was almost 3.67% that too fighting a civil war and a severe energy crisis, once these problems are resolved do you really think its hard for Pakistan to reach an economic growth rate of 7%. Other reforms can also take place which will boost the economic growth by wide margins. You don't see it happening because you don't live in Pakistan and don't know how Pakistan operates, i do live in Pakistan and sit in the market all day. KSE crossed 16 000 points recently, companies are producing record profits even in the midst of all these political problems. It does not take a genius to figure out that Pakistan's economy will not stay depressed in the long term.

Doubtful of this statement. Pakistan invested way too much in it to be a mere tactical move. It was meant to be a strategic initiative to bog India down much like how it did to USSR in Afghanistan.

I find this amusing. The fighters in Kashmir were lightly armed, lowly paid, poorly led with an extremely low morale. Compare that to the fighters that fought the USSR armed with heavy weapons with a very high morale. India by no means experienced the same ferocity of fighting that USSR did.

IA can mobilize much faster today as well. Its not about the PA mobilizing faster than IA. Its about IA being able to mobilize in a certain amount of time that allows GoI to respond before international pressure sets in.

Mobilize and than do what? IA can mobilize all it wants but its not strong enough to smash the defences of PA.

Secondly, IAF today is much better and capable vis-a-vis PAF. This applies to both technological aspects and numerical aspects. Yes PAF acquiring BVR capable platforms and AEW&C does mean it has the capability. How many planes does the PAF have to exploit that capability.
This coupled with changes in IAF infrastructure-which again as i said is being developed to be able to field massed numbers against Pakistan-for the first time.

This coupled with lack of LRSAM coverage in Pakistan. And frankly in the timeframe of 2020, PAF's position will only get worse.

Don't see that happening, as long as PAF sticks to its modernization plan it will effectively tame IAF. As long as PAF fights in a defensive war near the border, she has a very good chance of holding out against the IAF. I thought this was already proven a fact Post 26/11 when IAF tried to act naughty.

You are assuming that the insurgency in Pakistan is because of Indian activities in Afghanistan. Pakistan NOT been able to provide any kind of proof to any authority either Indian or NATO or American. Yes heresay of uncircumcized bodies of terrorists donot count for proof unless you are a Pakistani waiting for a conspiracy theory.

Not at all, but the Indian money and funds has definitely made the insurgency in Pakistan much more fierce. Lets not fool ourselves, we all know how the espionage world works where tracks are hid very well. If you are using this position, than i would be well within my rights to state that can you please post any proof that Pakistan or the ISI is behind any major terrorists attacks inside India? Despite India's best efforts, she has failed to provide a single shred of evidence against the ISI. Heck, they have even failed to provide any proof against Hafiz Saeed, that is why he runs around scott free.

Pakistan is suffering from insurgency by the very mouths that it once fed. It will take a jolly good time period to clean them off. India is in a strong position not because Pakistan is bogged down by Afghanistan. Its because India has increased its economy to the point that major powers in the world are willing to oblige India because of it. India has increased its diplomatic ability coupled with military abilities.

Please don't flatter yourself. The only reason why the US let you piggyback on their efforts because they hoped that India would be stabilizing factor in Afghanistan. India's investment has been negligent, almost nil compared to that of other Western nations.

As long as we continue to outpace Pakistan economically and consequentially militarily and diplomatically, we will continue to be in a better position vis-a-vis Pakistan than ever before.
Why would an India in such a strong position give in to Pakistan's demand? Or give equality to Pakistan. Today India and Pakistan are not equal by any measure of stick and are not likely to be so in the future as well.

Lets get some thing straight here, Pakistan was never equal of India and is never going to be. Similarly, Canada was never an equal of the US and never will be. India is 10 times bigger than Pakistan, Pakistan can never compete with India. If India is not willing to give equality to Pakistan, than i am afraid this Cold War between Pakistan and India will continue and countless innocent lives will be lost on both sides of the border.

What we really want is trade.

Anyways Sir, its fruitless arguing since you and i both have different opinions on this matter. I will end it by saying that i 100% agree with this notion that there should be free trade between both India and Pakistan. Trade will be an essential instrument for normalizing of relations between both India and Pakistan.
 
Visit the Bangladesh Subsection, you will get the gist of what i am saying.



No doubt about that, but in order for India to accomplish its task it needs to bring in Ground Forces. Air Force can at best launch punitive strikes, its main purpose is to support the Ground Forces. Thus, your analogy is wrong in discounting the IA from the picture.



So was it Pakistan's fault that India was not able to mobilize in time? The facts are that the Indians outgunned and outmanned Pakistan in every sphere. Coming out alive was a miracle for Pakistan considering the immense asymmetry in terms of resources fielded by India.



I only wish your Generals felt as secure as you do. You still have not been able to disprove my point that Pakistan can strike hard and deep inside India. Pakistan is more vulnerable because we always focused on offensive oriented weapons due to lack of resources. This is why we have ensured that we will make the cost of victory very high for India, and if need comes assure mutual destruction of both the countries.



Pakistan's economic growth was almost 3.67% that too fighting a civil war and a severe energy crisis, once these problems are resolved do you really think its hard for Pakistan to reach an economic growth rate of 7%. Other reforms can also take place which will boost the economic growth by wide margins. You don't see it happening because you don't live in Pakistan and don't know how Pakistan operates, i do live in Pakistan and sit in the market all day. KSE crossed 16 000 points recently, companies are producing record profits even in the midst of all these political problems. It does not take a genius to figure out that Pakistan's economy will not stay depressed in the long term.



I find this amusing. The fighters in Kashmir were lightly armed, lowly paid, poorly led with an extremely low morale. Compare that to the fighters that fought the USSR armed with heavy weapons with a very high morale. India by no means experienced the same ferocity of fighting that USSR did.



Mobilize and than do what? IA can mobilize all it wants but its not strong enough to smash the defences of PA.



Don't see that happening, as long as PAF sticks to its modernization plan it will effectively tame IAF. As long as PAF fights in a defensive war near the border, she has a very good chance of holding out against the IAF. I thought this was already proven a fact Post 26/11 when IAF tried to act naughty.



Not at all, but the Indian money and funds has definitely made the insurgency in Pakistan much more fierce. Lets not fool ourselves, we all know how the espionage world works where tracks are hid very well. If you are using this position, than i would be well within my rights to state that can you please post any proof that Pakistan or the ISI is behind any major terrorists attacks inside India? Despite India's best efforts, she has failed to provide a single shred of evidence against the ISI. Heck, they have even failed to provide any proof against Hafiz Saeed, that is why he runs around scott free.



Please don't flatter yourself. The only reason why the US let you piggyback on their efforts because they hoped that India would be stabilizing factor in Afghanistan. India's investment has been negligent, almost nil compared to that of other Western nations.



Lets get some thing straight here, Pakistan was never equal of India and is never going to be. Similarly, Canada was never an equal of the US and never will be. India is 10 times bigger than Pakistan, Pakistan can never compete with India. If India is not willing to give equality to Pakistan, than i am afraid this Cold War between Pakistan and India will continue and countless innocent lives will be lost on both sides of the border.



Anyways Sir, its fruitless arguing since you and i both have different opinions on this matter. I will end it by saying that i 100% agree with this notion that there should be free trade between both India and Pakistan. Trade will be an essential instrument for normalizing of relations between both India and Pakistan.

one thing is for sure that we will not let Pakistan to become an Indian Slave even if its for our very existence!!!
 
Pakistani military has been worried for over a decade by the rise of indian economic power.

TODAY INDIA GDP stands at $2 trillion versis pakistans at $200 billion.

THIS PAKISTAN ARMY and mushraff worst nitemare..HAS COME TRUE

IE . an enemy whose resources mean it dominates this region by its 10-1 supremacy political and econmically.

PAKISTAN has little voice now IN THE global AUDIENCE other than CHINA

THE WORLD TALKS UP INDIA BIG TIME.

THIS CONFLICT HAS LREADY BEEN WON BY INDIA they have saichen they have 65% of kashmir and USA are now their key strategic ally long term.

INDIA WILL NOT BUDGE now matter how many times MUSHRAFF SPEAKS
 
There will be no peace with india, development and advancement comes in stages the pakistani military needs to keep developing

what pakistan has achived with a fraction of the military budget others have is frankly a miracle

If you subtract the pakistani population from the indian population you still have over a billion indians left, they are 5 times our land mass

after partition we were left with a smallet land mass and a muslim population divided by three entities

what we have achived against a much bigger enemy is superb

Indias economic development has increased its defence budget and allowed it to purchase weapons

pakistan must keep pace to the best of our abilities and target indias economy and internal divisions

timed will change as a nation pakistan is a countty waiting befor an economic revolution

We must kerp building alliances, keep developing our weapons, our nuclear missiles and stop talking peace and take action

Mungerilaal ke haseen sapnay.........
 
Pakistan is not the same as india We are much much smaller

hindu bravery is a joke to muslims/pakistanis not becausr of centuries of indian enslavement its becausr of your nature failing to understand the dynamic between india and pakistan

india is 6 times our size

let me give you a anology of pakistan india wars

6 indians get into a fight with 1 pakistani

the fight lasts for one hour and afterwards both sides limp home

out of the 6 indians one is limping
one hss a black eye
one has a broken jaw
one is missing teeth
one is coughing blood
one has a broken rib

the indians turn to each other and say that pakistani hit us 24 times but luckily we won becausr we hit him 25 times
 
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