Pakistan Air Force has an edge over Indian Air Force: Indian Parliamentary panel

[ito]

Vis-a-vis, Pakistan, the entire coercive diplomacy falls on it's face, because of inadequate Military power, none of the tactical advantages can be used due to lack of Air Power, Arty, ammunition, Tanks, MBRL's, Submarines etc. Every time there is a , parliament attack or a mumbai, India cannot do jack because of lack of it;s required force levels to even threaten an all out conflict, because Pakistan knows that India won't be able to deploy the right amount to cause any grave strategic issues for pakistan.
At the end of the day we are the laughing stock, where pakistan is laughing at our dossiers with the Perps. Either India should stop wasting tax payers money on defence and get rid of all issues with pakistan, or commit to the defense and adopt zero tolerance, this middle ground is good for nothing. Raise at least 50 Sqdns or cap it at 30 sqdns as a defensive force.

I have a different take on this.

Even if India has 100 sqdns it wouldn't make lot of difference.
Given the proximity between India and Pakistan, and that Pakistan is nuclear power, India will always remain powerless to coerce Pakistan. Because in event of a war, it is India that will loose more than Pakistan. And then there is always a danger that war could turn nuclear.

Most of our conventional capability are for power projection. No matter what India will have one of the most powerful military in the world in a decade or two. But I doubt the equation between India and Pakistan is going to change much unless nukes are taken out from this region.

 

[ziaulislam]

I have a different take on this.

Even if India has 100 sqdns it wouldn't make lot of difference.
Given the proximity between India and Pakistan, and that Pakistan is nuclear power, India will always remain powerless to coerce Pakistan. Because in event of a war, it is India that will loose more than Pakistan. And then there is always a danger that war could turn nuclear.

Most of our conventional capability are for power projection. No matter what India will have one of the most powerful military in the world in a decade or two. But I doubt the equation between India and Pakistan is going to change much unless nukes are taken out from this region.

India wanted nuclear weapons long before Pakistan even planned it. what changed was 1971 war, which proved that india can go to end and even change international geographical boundaries. this is what made bhutto and establishment think that we need a deterrence weapon as this could happen again.
whats stopping india to let say invade sindh and break up Pakistan again. it was fully known fact that india conventional superiority will obviously only increase with time. whats stopping that now is nuclear weapon.


i think this was strategic mistake by indra Gandhi govt, had she not initiated 1971 incidence, today Pakistan may have been a nuclear free state with more tolerance towards India purely due to east Pakistan location and trade dependence upon India.
she might have settled grudges with Pakistan but created a long term hostility in the region. unless of course she was thinking of finishing pakistan altogether and created a single union some how??

i guess despite a golden 50s era and 1960s indus basin agreement things didnt improved between us ultimately effecting both of us.

imagine without 1971 we would have had two heterogeneous demographic countries, this could have been next euro zone

 

[Storm Force]

Not sure which basis Pakistan air power has an edge over India. Regardless of whom the claim the facts are simple.

Paf is outnumbered in true fouth gen fighters by at least 3-1,

Big difference in annual and longg term resources and investments which will only grow wider in coming years.

 

[IceCold]

So based on this report should Pakistan attack India, take out their airbases, and maybe nuke them too. Take Kashmir and live in peace happily ever after loll.

 

[Phenomenal]

Because they cannot live without us

Because they are obsessed with Pakistan, they wake up talking abt it , last thing before they fall asleep and probably before they die

 

[coffee_cup]

Because you are our neighbour?

And so are Nepal, Bangladesh, Sri Lanka, Bhutan. China...

Why this obsession always with Pakistan?

 

[A2Z]

I don't understand why indians think in order to counter IAF PAF needs to be having same number of aircrafts if not more.
PAF can counter IAF even if IAF has twice as many squadrons because India can never use all its force against Pakistan because it has to keep an eye on dragon as well.
Moreover we have seen Israelis always has an upper hand despite the fact that their neighbors always out number them, what they lack in numbers they cover up with tactics and training. Same is the case with IAF and PAF.
PAF was never tasked to attack India it is tasked to defend Pakistani air space and it will no matter how many squadrons IAF may have, they have done it in the past and will do it in future as well.
Things will can only change when IAF gets 5th generation aircrafts but that aint happening for at least 15 years.

 

[jarves]

I don't understand why indians think in order to counter IAF PAF needs to be having same number of aircrafts if not more.
PAF can counter IAF even if IAF has twice as many squadrons because India can never use all its force against Pakistan because it has to keep an eye on dragon as well.

Few MKIs took off from very deep eastern air force bases and did offensive missions, both strike and A2A, during Iron fist exercise at western border.They flew non stop and reached for offensive in an hour. More than 400 jets participated in the exercise which see MKIs are flying in from all three directions into the target area.So basically Sukhoi's deployed at eastern border will also be used in case of war with Pakistan and that is the reason IAF prefers twin seater,twing engine long range multirole fighters.

what they lack in numbers they cover up with tactics and training. Same is the case with IAF and PAF.

What makes you think that IAF is inferior to PAF in terms of Tactics and training?

Things will can only change when IAF gets 5th generation aircrafts but that aint happening for at least 15 years.

IAF will start getting PAKFA's from late 2020 onwards most likely.From where you are getting this 15 years figure?

 

[A2Z]

IAF will start getting PAKFA's from late 2020 onwards most likely.From where you are getting this 15 years figure?

Every thing goes according to plan and after 5 years IAF will have its first 5th gen fighter, first of all that would never happen even F-35 program has seen delays and so would PAKFA. Even if there are no delays don't you think IAF would at least need 10 years from to getting first PAKFA and then built them in sufficient numbers and then training is a different thing that too requires time?

What makes you think that IAF is inferior to PAF in terms of Tactics and training?

I never said that IAF training is inferior, what I ment was PAF is always out numbered by IAF and they are trained accordingly and the tactics are made keeping this in mind as well.

 

[$@rJen]

noting to concern..... its a nice tactics for more funds

 

[Hindustani78]

India wanted nuclear weapons long before Pakistan even planned it. what changed was 1971 war, which proved that india can go to end and even change international geographical boundaries. this is what made bhutto and establishment think that we need a deterrence weapon as this could happen again.
whats stopping india to let say invade sindh and break up Pakistan again. it was fully known fact that india conventional superiority will obviously only increase with time. whats stopping that now is nuclear weapon.


i think this was strategic mistake by indra Gandhi govt, had she not initiated 1971 incidence, today Pakistan may have been a nuclear free state with more tolerance towards India purely due to east Pakistan location and trade dependence upon India.
she might have settled grudges with Pakistan but created a long term hostility in the region. unless of course she was thinking of finishing pakistan altogether and created a single union some how??

i guess despite a golden 50s era and 1960s indus basin agreement things didnt improved between us ultimately effecting both of us.

imagine without 1971 we would have had two heterogeneous demographic countries, this could have been next euro zone

India wanted Nuclear weapons not because of Pakistan but because of the Nuclear Weapon testings by all the other countries and India was working to catch up with the all the other powers.

 

[jarves]

Every thing goes according to plan and after 5 years IAF will have its first 5th gen fighter, first of all that would never happen even F-35 program has seen delays and so would PAKFA. Even if there are no delays don't you think IAF would at least need 10 years from to getting first PAKFA and then built them in sufficient numbers and then training is a different thing that too requires time?

You are confusing FGFA with PAKFA,IAF will start getting FGFA's from around 2025,PAKFA will start undergoing induction between 2020-2022 onwards(counting delays).We will get the first prototype around 2018/17.
There is a sticky thread in Indian defence section about FGFA/PAKFA.You can read more about it there.

 

[aliyusuf]

To the Pakistani new comers to the forum, kindly try to understand that in no one's wildest stretch of the imagination is the IAF at a disadvantage to the PAF from any perspective at the moment nor in the foreseeable future. The best we can hope for at the moment is to deny complete air domination to the IAF over Pakistani air space.

The main premise, on which this thread was started, is simply a ploy to have more funds approved sooner rather than later.

 

[nForce]

India wanted nuclear weapons long before Pakistan even planned it. what changed was 1971 war, which proved that india can go to end and even change international geographical boundaries. this is what made bhutto and establishment think that we need a deterrence weapon as this could happen again.
whats stopping india to let say invade sindh and break up Pakistan again. it was fully known fact that india conventional superiority will obviously only increase with time. whats stopping that now is nuclear weapon.


i think this was strategic mistake by indra Gandhi govt, had she not initiated 1971 incidence, today Pakistan may have been a nuclear free state with more tolerance towards India purely due to east Pakistan location and trade dependence upon India.
she might have settled grudges with Pakistan but created a long term hostility in the region. unless of course she was thinking of finishing pakistan altogether and created a single union some how??

i guess despite a golden 50s era and 1960s indus basin agreement things didnt improved between us ultimately effecting both of us.

imagine without 1971 we would have had two heterogeneous demographic countries, this could have been next euro zone

Creation of Bangladesh was a decision taken by the leaders in East Pakistan. India helped in saving the lives of many people there from a genocide.

 

[ziaulislam]

India wanted Nuclear weapons not because of Pakistan but because of the Nuclear Weapon testings by all the other countries and India was working to catch up with the all the other powers.

i think you didnt understand my post.

what i said that India from day one wanted nukes so as to be recognized as international power.

Pakistan only thought of nukes after 1971.

so 1971 made a hostile state for India with nuclear weapons.

had there been no 1971,i doubt Pakistan would have gone for nukes.

field marshal Ayub in 1960s refused to start a nuclear program when told about indian nukes.

Creation of Bangladesh was a decision taken by the leaders in East Pakistan. India helped in saving the lives of many people there from a genocide.

true indeed , history is indeed written by the victors