Pak army new airborne division

[Aamir Hussain]

It is not an airborne division but closer to couple of Air-mobile Brigades. Air-mobile Brigades would require enhancement in our heli-borne assets.

In one of the post some one mentioned Siachin as a place of possible deployment or I think words to that effect. Well it won't happen as the thin air at 23K feet does not support airborne ops.

 

[SQ8]

It is not an airborne division but closer to couple of Air-mobile Brigades. Air-mobile Brigades would require enhancement in our heli-borne assets.

In one of the post some one mentioned Siachin as a place of possible deployment or I think words to that effect. Well it won't happen as the thin air at 23K feet does not support airborne ops.

The llama is cleared till 22000ft for regular operations..
the Indians used their local Chetak for regular resupply flights to 20k ft at the peak(pun intended) of the Siachen crises.

 

[pakistantiger]

pakistan have 620000 standing army and yes we do need helicopters for transport and attack hellicopters to support the rapid responce or emergency responce force but not three brigades at lesat six brigades two in sindh two in punjab one in giligit and one in peshawar and thuse fully enabled to deploy them quickly either heliborne or IFV methode but does need more transport hellis and planes

 

[Aamir Hussain]

My friend to lift just an airmobile company to 20K Ft. would require a lot more than light utility helos (It is just not done at that height and scale)--trust me I have done the Air Assault Course and I know what I am talking about

 

[fatman17]

My friend to lift just an airmobile company to 20K Ft. would require a lot more than light utility helos (It is just not done at that height and scale)--trust me I have done the Air Assault Course and I know what I am talking about

i was watching a very interesting show on D-Day when 24,000 airborne troops of the 82nd and 6th div were dropped behind enemy lines - it required nearly 500 C-47 transports along with nearly 800 transport 'gliders'which were towed to the C-47s.

just trying to 'demonstrate' the scale of air-assets required to move div-level or even bde-level troops!!!

 

[Safriz]

^^ I think such large scale airborne troop transportation is out of date now....After D-Day is there any other example of such a mass air drop?

Perhaps it has been replaced by carpet bombing behind an on enemy lines?

 

[fatman17]

^^ I think such large scale airborne troop transportation is out of date now....After D-Day is there any other example of such a mass air drop?

Perhaps it has been replaced by carpet bombing behind an on enemy lines?

you're missing the point!

 

[Safriz]

you're missing the point!

since i didn't read the thread,i might be missing the point.

 

[Aamir Hussain]

It would require atleast 16 Black Hawk type of aircraft to airland a light company with its HQ element. A further four to six attack helos to provide escort and a scout helo to provide landing zone intel.

If the company is going in with setting up an air landing zone it would require anti tank, MANPADS, & Mortar support besides the pathfinder group and air control assets.

The logistics train to support a company in the field and in harms way would require atleast four sorties per twenty four hours depending upon the mission of the company.

My 2C worth to support Fatman17 observations. THX

 

[fatman17]

since i didn't read the thread,i might be missing the point.

good answer

 

[Super Falcon]

we despretlly need more different helis for army and also for navy specially heavy lifters hope we get them it is our weak spot

 

[Aamir Hussain]

For WoT we need more Medium Lift Helos in the BlackHawk, MI-17 range. Fast ingress and exit is the name of the game during COIN ops. MI-17 is a good and robust platform -- we just need more of them.

We can use light utility helos armed with rockets, chain guns, side firing gatling guns to tackle the terrorists. Readily avialable UH1H or later models (In large quantities) which can be bought cheaply and retired after we are finished with the Terrs.

AH-64 or T-129 type of Helos are another ball game altogether. For these types of helo we can wait. Let us wait for the T-129 to come into production in and around 2013. AH-64 is an expensive platform to service and maintain. PAA has a poor record of servicing it helos -- it will take time for it come to the standards of PAF.

One of the reason that PA or PAF wants to go the American route is the depth of transfer of expertise, training, and maintenance regimes that comes with a typical US weapons platform transfer. This helps build soft skills of the user of that platform.

The same skill set has helped us teach the Chinese on their weapons transfer programs and the maintenance regimes. This is where the Chinese seek out from Pakistanis the best practices for going global on their weapons platforms.

I believe that Turkey has the same advantage and T129 program will reflect it as well.

My 2C worth.

 

[Muhammad-Bin-Qasim]

It would require atleast 16 Black Hawk type of aircraft to airland a light company with its HQ element. A further four to six attack helos to provide escort and a scout helo to provide landing zone intel.

If the company is going in with setting up an air landing zone it would require anti tank, MANPADS, & Mortar support besides the pathfinder group and air control assets.

The logistics train to support a company in the field and in harms way would require atleast four sorties per twenty four hours depending upon the mission of the company.

My 2C worth to support Fatman17 observations. THX

You are in the military... Now I m certain of this... Sir!!!

Ok... could nt C130 Hercules provide for what we need?

 

[Aamir Hussain]

You are in the military... Now I m certain of this... Sir!!!

Ok... could nt C130 Hercules provide for what we need?

Dear MBQ

Sorry to disappoint you - no I am not.

as far as C-130 or medium lift planes are considered, yes they are good for Airborne Ops. but not for Air-mobile operations.

What we require in the GWoT is heavy investment in Air-Mobile assets to air land Fast Reaction Teams to take on mountain tops and hold them (There have been reports of upto 500 terrs attacking staging/jump-off points).

once again sorry to disappoint you.

 

[Aamir Hussain]

i was watching a very interesting show on D-Day when 24,000 airborne troops of the 82nd and 6th div were dropped behind enemy lines - it required nearly 500 C-47 transports along with nearly 800 transport 'gliders'which were towed to the C-47s.

just trying to 'demonstrate' the scale of air-assets required to move div-level or even bde-level troops!!!

Operation Market Garden was the last big Airborne Operation -- the classic movie was "A Bridge too Far." The Arnhem operation was based upon faulty intelligence and overambitious ground link up plan. The Airborne and glider borne troops suffered very high casualties.

I regularly watch the History channel and enjoy some of the stuff on second world war.;-)