PAF could have downed more Indian planes in Pulwama crisis: ex-air chief

[Bossman]

You’re talking to apes who only know mentally slavery.

I went on a twitter space for the PSF some defense think tank and advocated the same burn their cities down policies and called them out for saying that you could’ve shot down 9 of their planes but chose not to after they tried to murder children in a madrasah. The folks running the PSF consortium twitter space couldn’t care less about that than about keeping peace. The fact that an enemy just try to murder innocent children and had they been successful, it would’ve been claimed there were indeed “terrorists” at that school.

Additionally, this coward and sleazy colonial force we call our army, they didn’t response when the Chinese engineers were killed in that bus bombed attack, they didn’t lift a finger when Karachi stock exchange was attacked, they kept quiet when Mian Channa occurred. I have no hope that they will defend Pakistan. Hell these MINOs bastards will likely side with their coward pagan cousins and kill and rape Muslims in Pakistan to defend their interests. Same as occurred in Algeria and Egypt.

I have serious doubts about your credibility. 34 post on this forum and you come with blazing guns undermining the military. There are a lot of fake Indians trying to take advantage of the fissures in our society right now and you seem like one of them.

 

[White privilege]

I remember disagreeing with @MastanKhan but with time i feel he was 100% correct.
This was a mistake by PAF leadership. They should have taken out every aircraft in their sights. India would not have escalated as the next act would have been standoff weapons against runways and India would have taken weeks to mobilise their ground forces. By then international pressure on both side would have been immense and especially on India for initiating the act of war. The sheer shock of having lost almost a squadron of aircraft on day 1 would have been felt for generations

It was a win win but what was lacking was decisive leadership with courage. India could have escalated on the 27th. The didn't because their knew

Of course we could have shot them all down, but those smouldering heaps of wrecks inside Indian occupied Kashmir would also have weakened our case, if we had to make it to the world and our friends, about shooting down all of them in 'self defense'. We would have been hailed as 'gladiators', and I am sure 300 million Pakistanis would not have any problem with that tag. But it also would have ended any real possibility of a gentleman's de-escalation from the enemy. We then could not trust Indians to respect the peace. That means we would have to completely destroy their counter attack capability and this would have escalated beyond our control. Any prolonged campaign would then have brought out the economic condition as a spoiling factor.

 

[TopGun786]

Amen - wars are won by the more committed side. They’re more committed hence all the talk about capturing AK and GB; while the whole spectrum of Pakistan in a true cowardly and sleazy fashion wants to sweep things under the rug and pretend the pagans will okay with the status quo. It’s deeper than that. They have pure unadulterated hatred towards Islam, Muslims, and Pakistan.
The whole concept of “Ghar Wapis” is aimed at Muslims. It serves a very sinister purpose - to hinduinize India and the rest of SA in order to increase the numbers of eligible women. You see, due to female fraticide, the Indians have more men than women. They need to offset the number - hence the above.
Why do you think rape is such a massive problems in their society. Same reason why they got rid of the triple talaq, and pretty soon limited the amount of wives a Muslim man can have. You guys are sleeping on the danger from the east. Because of some of your beghairety in bending over to the goras, you’re opening yourselves to subjugation.

he’s a very intelligent poster.

Yes, burn down their cities. I’m advocating exactly that. No difference than what they’ve been doing to Pakistan for the past 20 years. When all that foreign investment starts fleeing their lands, then we’ll see how much of a war they can sustain.



Let me start of by saying I appreciate your patriotism, but the reality is that Pakistan can not fight India on "equal terms".

Thank you for your condescending and patronizing tone.

The fact that you used the term “befitting” albeit misspelled tells me what I need to know about your strategy.

Fight them there so you won’t have to fight them in Lahore Islamabad Karachi Skardu.

Nothing says we’re afraid to escalate like oh hey, we could’ve done x y z on 2/27/19 but chose to deescalate. I’ve advocated bombing their barracks and parts of their precious fence they built in IOK to stop movement of mujahideens.

I knew American SOF serving with the UN observer force on the LOC during the 90s and they have ample stories on how Indian soldiers used to flee their posts just by hearing that the “Afghans” were operating in their AOR. Veterans of the war against the Soviet found a new battlefield. I don’t expect anything out of the worthless force Pakistan calls its army. They are mafioso organization only good at following orders from their foreign masters. I mean the fact that they carry that f***ken pimp stick around should you about their mindset. They are not build for war, but corruption. I seen their DHAs in ISB firsthand and how morally corrupt these whiskey drinking bastards are. Where’s the past 4-5 COAS residing? That should open many more eyes.

Couldn't agree more.

So did PAF actually down a Su-30MKI.

Any members would like to shed light on this with reliable sources?

@SQ8 @PanzerKiel

Dear there is another thread on this forum about 27 Feb 2019. You will get all the information and facts. And yes, a Su30mki was shait that day.

 

[GuySajerGD1943]

I have serious doubts about your credibility. 34 post on this forum and you come with blazing guns undermining the military. There are a lot of fake Indians trying to take advantage of the fissures in our society right now and you seem like one of them.

I’m Pakistani as they come, who refuses to believe the utter BS fed to us for the past 70 years. I’m a right wing Pakistani who advocates an eye for eye. I want the property dealers to clean their hands and do the job they were meant for, kill the soldiers of the enemy state instead of shriveling their balls and undermining Pakistan. This colonial sepoys is a useless force. You can continue to defend but the facts remain, they are cowards at the highest level. All it took was one phone call and or threat of a war for them to fold. Hate to break it to you but this force won’t good for nothing. Go wipe the dirt out of your eyes to see what the reality is. I’m sure many of us on here agree in private to what I’ve said publicly.

I’ve followed this forum for at least 15 years, and followed the army since the 1990s when i was a preteen. There’s no one else who wants a stronger Pakistan than I. You may not like what I’ve been saying, but idgaf. Take your blind patriotism and shove it up your behind. I’m sure some general stuck his pimp stick up your bum and you feel the need to defend their sheer incompetency.

 

[Reichmarshal]

India isn't single party CCP ruled China.

A single photo,video and any other eveidence in the hands of the opposition in India that negates the narrarive of the govt would have ruined the chances of the ruling party in that election year.

Ur name says it all

 

[White privilege]

Balakot strike was in response to Pulwama attack which happened a month before. It wasn't planned in anyway.

Pulwama false flag attack followed by Balakot strike was a planned election stunt by Modi. Operation Swift Retort soured this dish....

 

[S.Y.A]

would have, could have, should have.

the PAF couldnt put a significant dent in IAF when it had the chance, and gave away almost every operational detail during the chest thumping that followed. there are no 2nd chances.

 

[White privilege]

would have, could have, should have.

the PAF couldnt put a significant dent in IAF when it had the chance, and gave away almost every operational detail during the chest thumping that followed. there are no 2nd chances.

Operation Swift Retort was very basic and simple to begin with. Like page one of the syllabus. Go in with everything you have. Like send strikers escorted by air superiority fighters, AWACS and Jammers. There is no top secret science behind it. About our ability to eavesdrop on their comms, I guess the Indians also knew their comms weren't secure to begin with. Hell I believe someone revealed here on the forum about Indians trying to spoof our comms, and trying to disrupt 23rd March flypast. I guess nothing is totally secure in the EMS nowadays.....

 

[Olympus81]

Operation Swift Retort was very basic and simple to begin with. Like page one of the syllabus. Go in with everything you have. Like send strikers escorted by air superiority fighters, AWACS and Jammers. There is no top secret science behind it. About our ability to eavesdrop on their comms, I guess the Indians also knew their comms weren't secure to begin with. Hell I believe someone revealed here on the forum about Indians trying to spoof our comms, and trying to disrupt 23rd March flypast. I guess nothing is totally secure in the EMS nowadays.....

I would disagree.

Swift Retort was a difficult operation with very detailed level of technical planning. I am sure PAF pulled this out from their playbook. They would be having a few other plans up their sleeves.

The jamming of IAF comms, the launch of standoff weapons on their ammo dump in Poonch and Rajouri, followed by protecting the strike package and during the exact time the adversary AWACs had a change over.

This is not easy.

To reiterate, this was just a skirmish that PAF won. From a strategic point of view Pakistan is losing.

 

[GuySajerGD1943]

I have serious doubts about your credibility. 34 post on this forum and you come with blazing guns undermining the military. There are a lot of fake Indians trying to take advantage of the fissures in our society right now and you seem like one of them.

If you want my WhatsApp so I can prove that I’m not a punk as* Jeet like that Abdul dude posting BS news about F-15s then yeah, shoot me a private message, or we can start a twitter space using Alia’s so no one know our true identities.

the fissures are all caused by the ones sitting in GHQ. I know I’ve said harsh things these things are needed to be said.

Unpopular opinion with many ethnocentrism folks here, but no one asks why the TTP initially began before hijacking by the Afghans and pagans? Go look at what that bastard Misharrraf did in Waziristan from 2001-2006, killing and raping fellow Pakistanis at the behalf of dollars and a foreign masters where his kids happened to be living/studying on 9/11.

You have no idea at the rotten condition Pakistan is in. The elite aping to be Goras celebrating Christmas while looking down on Islamic holidays or paying lip service. The kids of the military controlling class enjoying all the perks while the average man suffers. I don’t mind the army taking lion share of the resources but they've been incompetent since 1965.

Tell me again why I should respect such an institution? Do you know the shame I felt when I saw Bajwa in 2016 with the Sheikh of UAE and the Sheikh cut him a check. It was cringe and embarrassing. Like I said in all my posts, this army isn’t to defend the interests of Pakistan, but to hold us down at the orders of the pagans and their kufr masters.

For some of you slower ones, watch Captain America Winter Soldier to understand what I mean.

I would disagree.

Swift Retort was a difficult operation with very detailed level of technical planning. I am sure PAF pulled this out from their playbook. They would be having a few other plans up their sleeves.

The jamming of IAF comms, the launch of standoff weapons on their ammo dump in Poonch and Rajouri, followed by protecting the strike package and during the exact time the adversary AWACs had a change over.

This is not easy.

To reiterate, this was just a skirmish that PAF won. From a strategic point of view Pakistan is losing.

They’re afraid to escalate because they are born cowards. I remembered @MastanKhan post a few years ago where he said we’ve been the conquering/fighting type. We’re managed to cooperate or stay out of the way.
These guys love to beg for talks, oh please help us talk with India etc, the only language should be pushing their sh*t in. “Begging for talking, befitting response, we didn’t want to escalate” so says the coward

 

[Princeps Senatus]

they were able to evade multiple AMRAAMs

Where are these multiple AMRAAMs? you only showed one

 

[Bossman]

I’m Pakistani as they come, who refuses to believe the utter BS fed to us for the past 70 years. I’m a right wing Pakistani who advocates an eye for eye. I want the property dealers to clean their hands and do the job they were meant for, kill the soldiers of the enemy state instead of shriveling their balls and undermining Pakistan. This colonial sepoys is a useless force. You can continue to defend but the facts remain, they are cowards at the highest level. All it took was one phone call and or threat of a war for them to fold. Hate to break it to you but this force won’t good for nothing. Go wipe the dirt out of your eyes to see what the reality is. I’m sure many of us on here agree in private to what I’ve said publicly.

I’ve followed this forum for at least 15 years, and followed the army since the 1990s when i was a preteen. There’s no one else who wants a stronger Pakistan than I. You may not like what I’ve been saying, but idgaf. Take your blind patriotism and shove it up your behind. I’m sure some general stuck his pimp stick up your bum and you feel the need to defend their sheer incompetency.

Calm down! If you were taken a ride for 70 years it was your problem not ours. You have a passion of a new convert and lack facts

If you want my WhatsApp so I can prove that I’m not a punk as* Jeet like that Abdul dude posting BS news about F-15s then yeah, shoot me a private message, or we can start a twitter space using Alia’s so no one know our true identities.

the fissures are all caused by the ones sitting in GHQ. I know I’ve said harsh things these things are needed to be said.

Unpopular opinion with many ethnocentrism folks here, but no one asks why the TTP initially began before hijacking by the Afghans and pagans? Go look at what that bastard Misharrraf did in Waziristan from 2001-2006, killing and raping fellow Pakistanis at the behalf of dollars and a foreign masters where his kids happened to be living/studying on 9/11.

You have no idea at the rotten condition Pakistan is in. The elite aping to be Goras celebrating Christmas while looking down on Islamic holidays or paying lip service. The kids of the military controlling class enjoying all the perks while the average man suffers. I don’t mind the army taking lion share of the resources but they've been incompetent since 1965.

Tell me again why I should respect such an institution? Do you know the shame I felt when I saw Bajwa in 2016 with the Sheikh of UAE and the Sheikh cut him a check. It was cringe and embarrassing. Like I said in all my posts, this army isn’t to defend the interests of Pakistan, but to hold us down at the orders of the pagans and their kufr masters.

For some of you slower ones, watch Captain America Winter Soldier to understand what I mean.


They’re afraid to escalate because they are born cowards. I remembered @MastanKhan post a few years ago where he said we’ve been the conquering/fighting type. We’re managed to cooperate or stay out of the way.
These guys love to beg for talks, oh please help us talk with India etc, the only language should be pushing their sh*t in. “Begging for talking, befitting response, we didn’t want to escalate” so says the coward

Calm down again, use your energy in a more useful manner than on the key board. If the likes of you can be made a fool for 70 years, how do you know you are not being made a fool now? I am not defending the Army or the Politicians who have created the mess we are in. Your idealism sounds great but you seem like very naive with more passion than brains.

 

[GuySajerGD1943]

Calm down! If you were taken a ride for 70 years it was your problem not ours. You have a passion of a new convert and lack facts


Calm down again, use your energy in a useful manner than on the key board.

Passion of a new convert? why would a new convert care about a country he or she has no connection to? That makes no sense. The fact you’re getting personal tells me that you’re one of the army bootlickers on here, or have benefited in some capacity from this rotten system.

According to you, I’m either Indian, or a new convert, or passionate? Lol okay….
We were all taken for a ride. Why are you deliberately downplaying this fact?

I don’t lack any facts. Go through anything I said and disapprove it. Mushy was selling women and kids to the Americans for $$$$ and then you wonder why a group like TTP come about - from the same ethnicity. Have some shame.

 

[White privilege]

I would disagree.

Swift Retort was a difficult operation with very detailed level of technical planning. I am sure PAF pulled this out from their playbook. They would be having a few other plans up their sleeves.

The jamming of IAF comms, the launch of standoff weapons on their ammo dump in Poonch and Rajouri, followed by protecting the strike package and during the exact time the adversary AWACs had a change over.

This is not easy.

To reiterate, this was just a skirmish that PAF won. From a strategic point of view Pakistan is losing.

The AWACS change over theory sounds bull to me. I do not recall any post from any senior learned member, considered privy to real inside info, alluding to this theory's health. Indians also claimed this but then they showed the famous 'radar pictures', apparently captured by their AWACS, to make their fartshot F-16 claim. But still this is not impossible to achieve. Both sides were monitoring each other's air activity profusely for many days. Those daily reports combined with the intelligence we already had about their assets, could very well have identified patterns in IAFs battle plan, to pick a more opportune time to strike. I suspect Indians also did identify these 'patterns' in our CAPs, and resultantly, were able to make a getaway on 26th Feb. In short, predictability is the demise of military planning. However no matter how much we try, we cannot always be 100% unpredictable....

 

[SQ8]

Passion of a new convert? why would a new convert care about a country he or she has no connection to? That makes no sense. The fact you’re getting personal tells me that you’re one of the army bootlickers on here, or have benefited in some capacity from this rotten system.

According to you, I’m either Indian, or a new convert, or passionate? Lol okay….
We were all taken for a ride. Why are you deliberately downplaying this fact?

I don’t lack any facts. Go through anything I said and disapprove it. Mushy was selling women and kids to the Americans for $$$$ and then you wonder why a group like TTP come about - from the same ethnicity. Have some shame.

Then stop using a VPN - or be permanently banned.