Operation Zarb-e-Azb

[VCheng]

Sir,with due respect what are those elements which army is trying to protect,when it is cleaning up it's own creation?
Instead,our political establishment is desperately trying to protect some elements instead of supporting military directly.
Regards

The present operation is a sham; the Army's creation has merely been pushed over the border for the time being to try to control post-US Afghanistan. Yes, it will continue to be business as "usual", to Pakistan's overall detriment in the long term.

QUOTE: Maj Gen Zafarullah Khan: "It’s not possible to create water-tight or airtight compartment where an individual cannot escape. Given the context of the terrain, the context of who they are, it will be wrong on my part to say that they did not escape, yes they did. They had smelled that the operation is about to be launched. The talks had failed, the build-up for the operation had already begun and they could see that, they could sense and smell and, therefore, the leadership was not here, the leadership abandoned place." /UNQUOTE.

Pakistan army admits what everyone knew: terror leaders have escaped onslaught – Telegraph Blogs

 

[Irfan Baloch]

QUOTE: Maj Gen Zafarullah Khan: "It’s not possible to create water-tight or airtight compartment where an individual cannot escape. Given the context of the terrain, the context of who they are, it will be wrong on my part to say that they did not escape, yes they did. They had smelled that the operation is about to be launched. The talks had failed, the build-up for the operation had already begun and they could see that, they could sense and smell and, therefore, the leadership was not here, the leadership abandoned place." /UNQUOTE.

OMG thats cheating that is. Pakistan army is copying the Tora Bora episode
when Mullah Omar and OBL escaped with their 17 wives , 18 goats, 11 chicken and 3 camels despite the not so air tight American might surrounding the area and turning mountains into dust and smoke.

 

[VCheng]

OMG thats cheating that is. Pakistan army is copying the Tora Bora episode
when Mullah Omar and OBL escaped with their 17 wives , 18 goats, 11 chicken and 3 camels despite the not so air tight American might surrounding the area and turning mountains into dust and smoke.

Sir, the difference is that USA gets to pack up and go home in peace. Pakistan has no choice but to deal with the long term consequences of its Tora Bora. The bet that the Pak Army is making is likely to fail miserably.

 

[Irfan Baloch]

Sir, the difference is that USA gets to pack up and go home in peace. Pakistan has no choice but to deal with the long term consequences of its Tora Bora. The bet that the Pak Army is making is likely to fail miserably.

there is no bet

the guests are using the Afghan government hosts to attack our posts.
I wont go as far as calling this operation a sham though, its a bit rhetorical thing to say. but I would say that a more thorough operation needs to be conducted in Southern Punjab, Karachi and other settled parts of Pakistan where these terrorists are hiding who show keen interest in destroying our airborne strategic assets.

do you know? the Mehran attackers also had the American personnel as their targets as well and our troops laid their lives protecting and moving the Americans out of the harms way? had someone shared your cynicism then he would have left them there to die but that was never going to happen.

by the way, I wont worry much about our operations. our troubles pale in the comparison to what you and your allies have managed to accomplish in Middle East, someone must be really proud by making a monstrosity of ISIS out of FSA (the good guys). did you find any ISI links there..? /.................................yet?

 

[VCheng]

there is no bet

the guests are using the Afghan government hosts to attack our posts.
I wont go as far as calling this operation a sham though, its a bit rhetorical thing to say. but I would say that a more thorough operation needs to be conducted in Southern Punjab, Karachi and other settled parts of Pakistan where these terrorists are hiding who show keen interest in destroying our airborne strategic assets.

do you know? the Mehran attackers also had the American personnel as their targets as well and our troops laid their lives protecting and moving the Americans out of the harms way? had someone shared your cynicism then he would have left them there to die but that was never going to happen.

by the way, I wont worry much about our operations. our troubles pale in the comparison to what you and your allies have managed to accomplish in Middle East, someone must be really proud by making a monstrosity of ISIS out of FSA (the good guys). did you find any ISI links there..? /.................................yet?

Sir, the reason I used the word "sham" for the present operation is with regards to the fact that it will surely fail in its stated objective to rid Pakistan of terrorist sanctuaries. As you pointed out, that problem is far more widespread than just FATA, and for that, there may not be a viable solution this late in the game.

I have nothing but the highest of regards for the Pak Army soldiers in the field, and what you have mentioned is just another example of their dedication to their sworn duties. It is the failures of their chain of command, right up to the highest levels of government, that will fritter away their precious blood for no gain at all.

And frankly Sir, I do not give a damn about the Middle East, compared to Pakistan and USA.

 

[Irfan Baloch]

And frankly Sir, I do not give a damn about the Middle East, compared to Pakistan and USA.

Michael Scheuer says something similar but his criticism of Obama is very shocking.

 

[VCheng]

Michael Scheuer says something similar but his criticism of Obama is very shocking.

Mr. Scheuer makes some good arguments, yes, but the regional complexities make his points of view not very effective in influencing the policies. Besides, it is quite patriotic to be able to criticize the President where justified, is it not?

 

[Irfan Baloch]

Mr. Scheuer makes some good arguments, yes, but the regional complexities make his points of view not very effective in influencing the policies. Besides, it is quite patriotic to be able to criticize the President where justified, is it not?

No

I get it he pulls no punches and his brutally honest but. he doesn't criticize President. he mauls him.

your comments remind me of the review about his book Imperial Hubris where he is criticized for suggesting a contradictory action regarding middle east while supporting non-intervention.

what I want to believe is... you can be patriotic American without being anti- Israeli.. he lashed at both KSA and Israel for most of American troubles in the world. ...but suggesting to use tactical nukes is.. frightening with long lasting effects.

middle east affects America and Pakistan. my worry is when these fiends will return back to the West and Pakistan then they will emulate what they learnt there. even Pakistani violence is not good enough for them and they are heading to grand Jihad.

wish something similar to World War Z.. can be done to them. (talking about the last minute scenes)

 

[VCheng]

No

I get it he pulls no punches and his brutally honest but. he doesn't criticize President. he mauls him.

your comments remind me of the review about his book Imperial Hubris where he is criticized for suggesting a contradictory action regarding middle east while supporting non-intervention.

what I want to believe is... you can be patriotic American without being anti- Israeli.. he lashed at both KSA and Israel for most of American troubles in the world. ...but suggesting to use tactical nukes is.. frightening with long lasting effects.

middle east affects America and Pakistan. my worry is when these fiends will return back to the West and Pakistan then they will emulate what they learnt there. even Pakistani violence is not good enough for them and they are heading to grand Jihad.

wish something similar to World War Z.. can be done to them. (talking about the last minute scenes)

Both KSA and Israel are no more than useful puppets. What happens in ME will stay in ME . This dream of a Grand Jihad is no more than just that - a dream. However, it is useful for the time being, so power-that-be are willing let it happen and play along. However, for Pakistan, it will likely be a huge headache, even more so than what it is dealing with now.

 

[Irfan Baloch]

Both KSA and Israel are no more than useful puppets.

I like the way you say it. it would be also very good if that really is the case.
which can mean that America allows the American Jewish lobby to "influence" it the way America deals with the middle east. its an interesting concept.
re KSA, I would totally agree, its about mutual benefit as well. America looks away while KSA does what it does to its own people and the rest of the Muslim ummah through its funding of madrassahs and in return receives oil at much subsidized rates (and more because there is more than the oil that an idiot like me can comprehend)

What happens in ME will stay in ME . This dream of a Grand Jihad is no more than just that - a dream.

Amen to that. but it carries a lot of destructive power.. if this movement reaches the Harmoz and the sea lanes then it can cause a lot of bother to the civilized world and its economy and what it would have done already to Iraqis before reaching there would be a phenomenal human tragedy.

However, it is useful for the time being, so power-that-be are willing let it happen and play along.

sorry I am lost here
need a very short answer, who are the players (powers) and why would they let this ISIS play along?

However, for Pakistan, it will likely be a huge headache, even more so than what it is dealing with now.

Absolutely agree. Although its Middle East and Arab awakening (take 2).. we would not only suffer the consequences but also receive the particular attention of creative annalists who will bring ISI and Pakistan army in their articles and comments when some western Muslims will return back to their countries with the new skills acquired from their apprenticeship with ISIS.

some Indian journalists were told to shut up by Americans when they suggested that Pakistan supplied the nuclear material that ISIS acquired after raiding a university hospital and looting the nuclear material from its radiology lab.

so yea.. no rest for the wicked and the pious in Pakistan.

 

[haman10]

isnt it "ZARB - e - ghazab (anger) " ?

ضرب غضب

what is wrong with u ppl ? why do have to pronounce everything differently ?

 

[VCheng]

I like the way you say it. it would be also very good if that really is the case.
which can mean that America allows the American Jewish lobby to "influence" it the way America deals with the middle east. its an interesting concept.
re KSA, I would totally agree, its about mutual benefit as well. America looks away while KSA does what it does to its own people and the rest of the Muslim ummah through its funding of madrassahs and in return receives oil at much subsidized rates (and more because there is more than the oil that an idiot like me can comprehend)



Amen to that. but it carries a lot of destructive power.. if this movement reaches the Harmoz and the sea lanes then it can cause a lot of bother to the civilized world and its economy and what it would have done already to Iraqis before reaching there would be a phenomenal human tragedy.


sorry I am lost here
need a very short answer, who are the players (powers) and why would they let this ISIS play along?



Absolutely agree. Although its Middle East and Arab awakening (take 2).. we would not only suffer the consequences but also receive the particular attention of creative annalists who will bring ISI and Pakistan army in their articles and comments when some western Muslims will return back to their countries with the new skills acquired from their apprenticeship with ISIS.

some Indian journalists were told to shut up by Americans when they suggested that Pakistan supplied the nuclear material that ISIS acquired after raiding a university hospital and looting the nuclear material from its radiology lab.

so yea.. no rest for the wicked and the pious in Pakistan.

The discussion would be long and best done over a cup of coffee (or another drink, or two, or several), but, briefly, the overall policy would be directed towards not letting these mushrooming crises go to waste and use it instead to lay the foundations of a reworked Middle East. It is an ambitious goal, no doubt, and perhaps not completely achievable, but certainly worth a try.

But, as I said before, I do not care about this as much as I care about Pakistan and USA, and in this context, whatever Pakistan can do to insulate itself from the inevitable fallout would be important. However, given the situation within Pakistan and the many deficiencies that have been building up for decades, it may not be possible for Pakistan to avoid getting drawn into the same chaos.

An operation or two in FATA and Karachi and elsewhere is like simply putting a small lid over a huge cauldron that is approaching the boiling point and hoping that the fire will go out. It won't help.

 

[Irfan Baloch]

The discussion would be long and best done over a cup of coffee (or another drink, or two, or several), but, briefly, the overall policy would be directed towards not letting these mushrooming crises go to waste and use it instead to lay the foundations of a reworked Middle East. It is an ambitious goal, no doubt, and perhaps not completely achievable, but certainly worth a try..

I am already blown away.

wow

I mean wow
and I agree cant be discussed with so many barriers in communication.

 

[SQ8]

isnt it "ZARB - e - ghazab (anger) " ?

ضرب غضب

what is wrong with u ppl ? why do have to pronounce everything differently ?

Its Azb.. Azb means a sharp strike in Arabic. Not Ghazab.

And our pronunciation is a mix of Persian and Arabic. Go Figure.

 

[VCheng]

I am already blown away.

wow

I mean wow
and I agree cant be discussed with so many barriers in communication.

@Aeronaut and @jaibi have my email address, if you'd like.