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Operation Zarb-e-Azb

The operation has it's right.

However the governmet is failing.

I would have loved to see a media campaign to go along this operation... such as

1. Educate people to keep local watch
2. Educate people how to report mischievous activities / suspicious people.
3. Educate people how to respond in case of a terrorist attack etc.

People need security, and people will buy this.

This is what will make this war, Pakistan's war.

@tamimy you see that ?
 
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The operation has it's right.

However the governmet is failing.

I would have loved to see a media campaign to go along this operation... such as

1. Educate people to keep local watch
2. Educate people how to report mischievous activities / suspicious people.
3. Educate people how to respond in case of a terrorist attack etc.

People need security, and people will buy this.

This is what will make this war, Pakistan's war.

@tamimy you see that ?
Very well said.This campaign must be initiated.
 
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I fully endorse this operation; however I have a major worry. There is a significant section of Pakistan society (probably 10%) which supports Taliban and extremism. After each dastardly act these people condemn the atrocities committed in the name of Islam but mix it with ifs & buts and go on providing direct or indirect support to the terrorist groups.

There is a solution to that problem. The Islamic leaders and scholars should be taken into confidence and in return they should raise their voice to support the operation. I was greatly relieved by Hafiz Saeed's support for the operation.
 
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We support Pakistan Army against TTP terrorists/any organizations/third party. :pakistan:

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I fully endorse this operation; however I have a major worry. There is a significant section of Pakistan society (probably 10%) which supports Taliban and extremism.

An even bigger worry is that this percentage, whatever initial estimate one goes by, is growing significantly, day by day. Many organizations are preparing this groundwork under the garb of charities and religious activities, all perfectly legal, and all designed to ensure the rule of religiosity in all walks of life. Extremism is the next step which will not be too far behind.
 
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An even bigger worry is that this percentage, whatever initial estimate one goes by, is growing significantly, day by day. Many organizations are preparing this groundwork under the garb of charities and religious activities, all perfectly legal, and all designed to ensure the rule of religiosity in all walks of life. Extremism is the next step which will not be too far behind.
even if its not growing, its very active, very extremist and very resourceful and knows how to make maximum impact. its present on social media
it has sympathizers in almost all sections f society and it has Pakistan military, liberals and minorities under its cross hairs and serves as the mouthpiece of taliban and their watch out as well.

while you blame Pakistan army for links with extremists and still suspect it of sympathizing with the extremists, this group sees Pakistan army as betrayer of Islam and a sell out lackey of America.

as far as I am concerned , I think both of you are correct. if it helps both army bashers sleep at night,. army's present operations/ actions will decide who is More right than the other.,
 
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even if its not growing, its very active, very extremist and very resourceful and knows how to make maximum impact. its present on social media
it has sympathizers in almost all sections f society and it has Pakistan military, liberals and minorities under its cross hairs and serves as the mouthpiece of taliban and their watch out as well.

while you blame Pakistan army for links with extremists and still suspect it of sympathizing with the extremists, this group sees Pakistan army as betrayer of Islam and a sell out lackey of America.

as far as I am concerned , I think both of you are correct. if it helps both army bashers sleep at night,. army's present operations/ actions will decide who is More right than the other.,

The Army nurtured them, and used them for its purposes. It then lost control and we have the situation today. The Army will now either divest itself completely and kill its creation, or succumb to it. There is no third option.
 
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The Army nurtured them, and used them for its purposes. It then lost control and we have the situation today. The Army will now either divest itself completely and kill its creation, or succumb to it. There is no third option.
of course there is the third option. seek help from its partner in crime of the distant and near past i.e CIA that coined the name of the organisations and funded them and even printed the Quran for them to fight the commies.
 
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of course there is the third option. seek help from its partner in crime of the distant and near past i.e CIA that coined the name of the organisations and funded them and even printed the Quran for them to fight the commies.

That help is already part and parcel of the present option. It never went away.
 
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I don't know where to start from....a great initiative by PA but whose gonna benefit from this operation, is it the nation or the two goons who are running this country, for me it's a win win situation for the ganja...look how brutally they killed the people in Lahore .

Ganja was never been interested in this operation but he needed a reason to keep PA busy so that he could achieve his sinister objectives, there are so many reasons but look at the latest example of ARY and appointing arse-alan iftikhars appointment.

There are so many things but PA needs to finish the operation at rapid speed unfortunately, inshallah this time ganja and his family won't get a flight for Jeddah.
 
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I don't know where to start from....a great initiative by PA but whose gonna benefit from this operation, is it the nation or the two goons who are running this country, for me it's a win win situation for the ganja...look how brutally they killed the people in Lahore .

Ganja was never been interested in this operation but he needed a reason to keep PA busy so that he could achieve his sinister objectives, there are so many reasons but look at the latest example of ARY and appointing arse-alan iftikhars appointment.

There are so many things but PA needs to finish the operation at rapid speed unfortunately, inshallah this time ganja and his family won't get a flight for Jeddah.
Decisions about waging war or launching operation against any sinister terrorist organization are not made out of blue. It takes months to plant strategy and implementation of that plan.
The decision for launching decisive operation and the political kitty fights are two parallel,independent event/scenarios.
As far as what I have understand till now that this whole TUQ fiasco was made to avoid Tahir ul padri's summer vaccation trip in Pakistan, but attempt to suppress his drama was so pathetic and horrible that it has polluted political environment.Right now Operation zarb e azb is more important then Tahir's siyasi drama.Like last time..he will be sitting inside his air conditioned, bullet proof container while public will be dying on hot streets,being chased by mosquitoes and will be exposing as easiest most target to terrorists...then few noora ministers will approach him,shake hands with him...deal will be made and then..he will be flying back by expressing his satisfaction,once again.
ARY will be soon opened again,don't worry.
Regards
 
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An offshoot of this discourse would be the lessons learnt from this operation. Was pakistani army planning this for years to ensure minimal collateral casualty which pakistan itself has been extremely critical of vis-a-vis Americans. If yes how was this done as holds a crucial key to all future conflicts in the world. Establishing Intel network to miniseries collateral casualty......
 
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An offshoot of this discourse would be the lessons learnt from this operation. Was pakistani army planning this for years to ensure minimal collateral casualty which pakistan itself has been extremely critical of vis-a-vis Americans. If yes how was this done as holds a crucial key to all future conflicts in the world. Establishing Intel network to miniseries collateral casualty......


1. Lessons
Public support is paramount in any war specially an insurgency.
effective planning of countering propaganda & presenting own PoV
having political support of parties who build up support for military instead of mocking & criticizing it
Adapt , reorganize restructure the military for effective COIN operations. General Tariq Khans work on FC is an example who turned an ill equipped, demoralized and ill trained organisation into an effective fighting force.

2. Military Planning
A meticulous planning was taking place for some time, and there were some surgical operations already taking place SAWAT, South Waziristan and rest of tribal areas like Khyber agency etc were live examples
the sheer size, the topography and its location favors small gorilla forces that have many way points to sneak attack and ex-filtrate into Afghanistan hence part of the force was deployed on important choke points and mountain tops to foil known and obvious escape routes while the rest of the force went in supported by PAF, Army aviation and artillery.

3. Avoiding Collateral damage
it is impossible to have zero collateral damage in any military conflict be it a conventional or insurgency. the loss and damage to the infrastructure to public and private property is a given and there are always civilian or unintended casualties although any state who wants domestic and international opinion on its side would try to avoid it or minimize it. we repeated our Sawat and South Waziristan experience and gave people the chance to leave and clear although the risk of loosing the terrorists is always there but the loss of civilian lives is far worse than the risk of some terrorists escaping among people and they do get caught in burkas and many were taken out while trying to escape. Americans were not bound by such compulsion, they were not attacking their own people and they have the power to shape the world opinion so their drone strikes did result in civilian casualties as well.

4. How we did it
now that will be telling but few things that we did were
use of our own drones that provided us with real time and pin point intelligence against the terrorists. only 2 such strikes back in February brought the terrorists to their knees.
support of local population and better intelligence was also helpful. Sawat was a good success story in that case.
what a successful military operation needs is a quick follow up of political process and the civilian administration taking over to bring the life back to normalcy otherwise all such gains are lost and military is needed to come back.
unfortunately apart from 2 or 3 parties (ANP, MQM and PPP) all other parties have been hesitant , apologetic or all out supporters of TTP and taliban which doesnt help in building a consensus and public support

but looking at Afghanistan, Syria and Iraq.. we are much better off (touch wood) and not only Taliban have lost considerable support but their mouthpiece parties have started to get a lot of scorn from the public and military has recently gained public approval.

look up General Tariq Khan's interview to Ragi Omar of AL Jazera its very old and relates to South Waziristan but Tariq Khan being a Pashton himself explains how Taliban eliminated the entire tribal structure to systematically take over.. that system of Maliks or elders needs to be re-installed and supported.

Bottom line.. suprior firepower and effective use of modern technology backed up with full-hearted political reconciliation and rehabilitation of the affected people
 
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finally the army high command has heeded to the demand and concerns of the middle ranking officers to cleanse the country of this disease. they cannot afford to watch their comrades and countrymen die at the hands of these animals and not do anything - it may be too early but i feel it is a paradigm shift in the overall thinking of the high command - the army wants the world to know that if it says its going to do something - then it will.....

Raheel Shareef carries no previous baggage....he is absolutely clear what is required.
 
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