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Operation Rah-e-Rast (Swat)

"I think it was part of your past and our past, and the ISI and CIA created them together,"

Nice try but no way. We were looooong gone and this was an utterly indigenous movement down Kandahar way. You liked what you saw and ditched Hekmatyar and threw yourselves behind Omar.

Zardari knows. It was B.B.'s play all the way.
 
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"why dun ur army show somee balls against the drone attacks. But waiit they wont cuz then they will get thier arses kicked."

You read like irhabi scum that would like to provoke war between Pakistan and NATO. Funny that you wallow in the protection of Canadian laws.

Of course you don't care if the defeated taliban army and gov't reside in Pakistan and make war on the afghani people and Canadian soldiers there to help them. Nor do you care if they enslave those now trapped in the Islamic Emirate of Waziristan.

Nor do you care that the taliban had no business in Buner but couldn't leave well enough alone. ON TO ISLAMABAD, eh?

They fcuked up and played their cards fast and loose. The only "arses kicked" that you need worry about are your sleazy murderous friends in SWAT and Buner.:agree:



ohhh baby did i hurt ur feelings, ur looser army getting their ***** kicked by everyone, so lemme get this brave army of urs is afraid of war with NATO, but feel free to do kill with impunity the civilians pakistanis in name of fighting the Talibaan. Thats all it good at conquering civilians as long as they dun hit back then they run like lil bitches to thier daddy usa.
 
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Uh...

Not my army, dimwit, or did you not notice the flags?

"...feel free to do kill with impunity the civilians pakistanis in name of fighting the Talibaan."

Oh, you can assume that if the Pakistani army chooses to kill civilians with impunity they can rack up far higher numbers than to date.

"they run like lil bitches..."

Reads like you hiding out in Canada instead of walking the talk with an AK-47 in dem' dar' hills up yonder.

Nice to make your acquaintance. May you live in interesting times.:agree:
 
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Uh...

Not my army, dimwit, or did you not notice the flags?

"...feel free to do kill with impunity the civilians pakistanis in name of fighting the Talibaan."

Oh, you can assume that if the Pakistani army chooses to kill civilians with impunity they can rack up far higher numbers than to date.

"they run like lil bitches..."

Reads like you hiding out in Canada instead of walking the talk with an AK-47 in dem' dar' hills up yonder.

Nice to make your acquaintance. May you live in interesting times.:agree:

so now living outside pak is a problem funny didn't hear ur govt asking pakistanis living abrod to send money to pak and ask for help in making pak case, that time ur more then willing to embrace us.

Well now the prez has been treated like a begger in usa and has now declared that Ind is not our enemy. Lets go back 2 the mighty pak army, according to Int minister the retard malik there are abt 4000 talibaans fighter in swat and ur mighty army with all the jets and gunship battles needs 6 more brigades to deal with them my oh my how many tanks and jets these talibaan have? and if army not killing indiscrimantly how abt allowing media to get in and show wat aerial bombardment does in highly populated areas, lets show the real face of this army. Wat r u afraid of?
 
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ohhh baby did i hurt ur feelings, ur looser army getting their ***** kicked by everyone, so lemme get this brave army of urs is afraid of war with NATO, but feel free to do kill with impunity the civilians pakistanis in name of fighting the Talibaan. Thats all it good at conquering civilians as long as they dun hit back then they run like lil bitches to thier daddy usa.


First of all at least show some restraint in your comments regarding a force which has many martyrs and great patriots in its ranks to this date!

You have shown you utter disregard to logic and on ground reality so far regarding TTP, Pakistan Army and citizens of Pakistan.
Maybe you are not actually aware of the events and just want to flame here?

Your illusions of grand jirga and Lashkars have actually been tried before and collapsed in the face of assassinations, suicide bombings and overwhelming actions by TTP.

Without Army the tribal leadership is being slowly eliminated until only those remain who shall be bribed or forced into submission by TTP. Already much blood has been spilled by TTP and they did not stop even during the peace agreement.

Pakistan Army has sacrificed itself whenever ordered to do so do not come up with this nonsense about Pakistan Army.
Army is from Pakistanis and it is these Pakistanis in this Army who have always sacrificed themselves whenever asked to.
In 48, 65, 71 and Kargil...Pakistan army always fought to the end when asked to, 71 surrender was more of political nature and army obeyed the orders and surrendered, had the orders not been given you would have seen a bitter last stand.
Same thing was in Kargil where no body including the Indians deny the bravery of Pakistani Troops.

I know of many young officers who led their troops from the front and died in the prime of their youth...some were just recently married but still chose to extend their stay and got martyred, they were fighting to save their motherland which sadly is also occupied by people like you who think they know it all and are willing to save the people by leaving everything in the hands of TTP.

I know of families which have been eliminated by TTP and of families which are currently under threat by TTP and being forced to cooperate with TTP, this is possible since Army is not called in and the family wants to save its members by cooperating. One cannot use Police against TTP battalions of 500-1000 strength.

Lack of PA action has lead to such a situation and no Jirga or Lashkar can stand for long against the TTP without PA support.

Do you have access to the details of the Pakistani deaths of both soldiers and civilians at the hand of TTP?
Had you even an iota of understanding about the exact details of what torture and pain the TTP has inflicted upon its victims only then can you understand why the Army has been mobilized!

Understand one thing...guerrilla actions are carried out by outlaws, rebels or guerrillas who cannot hold major territory in face of superior numbers...TTP is holding territory so an action against it merits a conventional war first and then other doctrines should follow.
PA is not an army of another country that it should fight guerrilla war with vermin like TTP who are infesting Pakistan.
PA is fighting in its own country against the primary enemies of Pakistan and has to hold all territory and fight for every inch!

In order to ensure the sense of security, safety and freedom which has been destroyed by TTP; the Army has to occupy everything whereas the TTP can make just one attack and succeed in creating terror in the hearts of the people...this is why PA needs huge numbers and TTP can manage with hundreds!

This is a very basic military and strategic assessment of the situation in these areas which can only be refuted by the very naive or the very biased!
 
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First of all at least show some restraint in your comments regarding a force which has many martyrs and great patriots in its ranks to this date!
who backs this army ppl of pak, not some outside force. The 71 debacle dun blame it on the politicians, military was incharge and has to take the blame (not a fan of bhutto, khas kam jahan pak as far as am concerned) But 71 is squarely on military as prime responsiblity,

Regarding ur assertion abt jarga and laskhar, which u claim failed cuz of taliban, no they failed cuz gen. mushy keep breaking promises made in these pacts. Everytime pacts were made US drones with full blessings of Gen. Mushy attacked and killed the ppl igniting violence again and again.

700 innocent pakistanis have beeen killed by these drones attacks while targetting 14 suspected al-qaeda operative, why army not stopping these attacks, the excuse b4 was that army not attacking talibaan now with the operation in full gear in swat why we had a drone attack 2 days ago. Lets call spade a spade this army has failed to protect pakistan and pakistanis, from any threat. as far as ur mention of individual bravery goes good 4 them, they are soldiers they are expected to fight with honor and bravery, its thier duty otherwise they should quit.

Care to explain to me the media reports now suppressed in name of national security regarding soldier bodies been rejecteed by thier parents, if these soldires r getting shaheed why their parents are refusing to bury them like shaheed? was reporteed by none other then so calleed enlighted liberal Ayaz Mir not some talibaan spoke person.

Once again the solution is kil them kill them kill them, well lets see how much 6 brigades accomplish anyone who can think this insurgency and militancy can be uprotted by a military does livees in a fool's world.
 
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here's a little message for AfzaalKhan:

EAT MY DUST!
 
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All those happy about US casualities in Afghanistan.You must not forget If America looses then Pakistan too will loose the war.
 
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All those happy about US casualities in Afghanistan.You must not forget If America looses then Pakistan too will loose the war.

finally an honest voice, u admit this is usa war. I can disagree with ur point of view but respect ur honesty. This is USA war and its a threat to existence of Pak, this operation is not for the benefit of Pakistan it is a threat to pakistan's security.
 
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keep drinking army and establishment kool aid. BTW how abt drone attacks why dun ur army show somee balls against the drone attacks. But waiit they wont cuz then they will get thier arses kicked.

hahahaha..... its a waste of time talking to u. i gave u reasoning. now if u have got any solid point against my reasoning then u r welcome or else stop trollin.
 
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Mobilising the nation

Monday, May 11, 2009
Talat Masood

The prime minister’s address to the nation in which he vowed not to bow down before the militants and General Kayani’s reiteration in the Corps Commanders’ conference that the army was capable of handling the national crisis mark a decisive shift from the earlier vacillations and confusion that prevailed in the past. The Swat peace deal in any case was doomed to failure as many of us had predicted. Now that the battle lines have been drawn and there is no ambiguity that militants have to be taken on, success of the current operation will be vital for the country’s future. The deciding factor for launching the major offensive was that there was a genuine threat to integrity and viability of the state that had already started shrinking. Inaction was being perceived as if the government was dysfunctional. The Taliban were taking full advantage of it and strengthening themselves, shattering the confidence of the people.

Clearly, the delay in the operation has strengthened the militants. They have consolidated and expanded their influence and to dislodge them would at least initially require application of large forces and heavier weapons causing collateral damage and human suffering. The offensive in Swat and parts of Malakand division could well turn out to be a long-term effort, requiring sustained commitment over a long period of time. It will not be over until our security forces penetrate their organisational structure and capture or kill their leadership so as to destroy their ability to plan and execute terrorist attacks. The Taliban have been mining the area to prevent the civilian population to leave so that they could use them as a shield.

As it may take time to complete this mission it is important that clarity and consistency is maintained and a higher level of commitment is displayed by our leaders and people are kept informed. Regrettably, none of these principles were being followed in the past.

President Zardari, the defence minister and other political leaders have not visited our troops and the people in Swat or in FATA. If President Bush, President Sarkozi or Prime Minister Brown can visit their troops in Afghanistan and Iraq, why is it that our leaders have bunkered themselves in their own country? Surely, security can be provided for them for the visit. Meeting troops in forward areas raises the morale of troops and motivates them. Similarly, it is crucial that political leaders visit camps of internally displaced people to show sympathy and support in their hour of suffering. President Zardari has also not addressed the nation on the security issues through television or radio. In fact President Zardari’s excessive foreign trips at this time show his lopsided priorities. It goes to the credit of Prime Minister Gilani that at least he is trying to develop a consensus among political parties on fighting insurgency and other issues.

From what is being reported about the operation in Swat there appears to be a greater use of helicopters, tanks and light artillery. Surely, soon there will be more boots on the ground and infantry and special forces will be deployed. In counterinsurgency operations it is generally experienced that militants are spread out and fairly decentralised, can shift from one battlefield to another and can operate independently. Experience from different insurgencies has shown that in fighting militants we have to adapt to the changing dynamic and not remain fixated with traditional centralised command structures. Obviously, our army is primarily trained for conventional warfare. The doctrines, equipment and even the mindset are geared to that framework. But now there is great emphasis on counterinsurgency training.

Despite the best efforts of our military there will be collateral damage and displacement of people. Already a million people have been internally displaced. This is a great human tragedy and the government has to accord highest priority to providing them with shelter and addressing their basic needs. This would be a major step in gaining support of the people.

If we are clear that terrorism and militancy is our problem and we have to combat it then it is much easier to own the war and solicit the support of the people. When we take a decision to launch a massive campaign in Swat at a time when our top leadership is in Washington it acquires a different connotation. This does not imply that Pakistan should not closely cooperate with Afghanistan, the US and NATO but the policy and implementation should be primarily our responsibility and perceived to be so.

The writer is a retired lieutenant-general. Email: talat@comsats.net.pk
Mobilising the nation
 
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"...war on terror is still americas war. we are at war with TTP and not afghan talibans or imaginary al qaeda"

Head chopping is fine just so long as it's in Afghanistan, eh? Supporting a defeated army and it's government is fine too as it makes war from your soil on the afghani people and 40 nations from around the globe trying to help? What about all that "sovereignty" B.S?

Selectively applied.

Can you be so numb? Don't the beheadings revulse you? Why do you think that's fine for Afghanistan? Strategic depth?

Disgusting.

well no one told u to go to afghanistan. now please let us stay out of it. we have got many problems wihtin our own country which we have to deal with
 
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who backs this army ppl of pak, not some outside force. The 71 debacle dun blame it on the politicians, military was incharge and has to take the blame (not a fan of bhutto, khas kam jahan pak as far as am concerned) But 71 is squarely on military as prime responsiblity,

Regarding ur assertion abt jarga and laskhar, which u claim failed cuz of taliban, no they failed cuz gen. mushy keep breaking promises made in these pacts. Everytime pacts were made US drones with full blessings of Gen. Mushy attacked and killed the ppl igniting violence again and again.

700 innocent pakistanis have beeen killed by these drones attacks while targetting 14 suspected al-qaeda operative, why army not stopping these attacks, the excuse b4 was that army not attacking talibaan now with the operation in full gear in swat why we had a drone attack 2 days ago. Lets call spade a spade this army has failed to protect pakistan and pakistanis, from any threat. as far as ur mention of individual bravery goes good 4 them, they are soldiers they are expected to fight with honor and bravery, its thier duty otherwise they should quit.

Care to explain to me the media reports now suppressed in name of national security regarding soldier bodies been rejecteed by thier parents, if these soldires r getting shaheed why their parents are refusing to bury them like shaheed? was reporteed by none other then so calleed enlighted liberal Ayaz Mir not some talibaan spoke person.

Once again the solution is kil them kill them kill them, well lets see how much 6 brigades accomplish anyone who can think this insurgency and militancy can be uprotted by a military does livees in a fool's world.

Regarding the Jirgas, you deliberately ignore the TTP assassinations, mass murders, suicide bombings and fixate only upon the drones. Shows that you are unwilling to reconcile with reality as well and yet you accuse others of doing so!

TTP should be treated with as much respect as the TTP respect their end of the bargain, if you want me to feel sorry for Naik Muhammad and his kind then sorry this is not going to happen.

I know of martyrs in Pakistan Army who have been buried with full Honor, i do not know which parents you are referring to but maybe it is due to the fact that TTP mutilate the bodies of their enemies!

In WANA, a course mate of my friend commanding 30 troops was hopelessly outnumbered by Taliban who were 400 strong.
This was 2-3 years ago and the FC force had already fled the area (common in those days...not anymore).
All day and night the battle continued and when all ammunition was spent and most of the troops martyred the remaining soldiers who were mostly injured and had nothing to fight with, were made to surrender.
The surrendering troops were riddled with hundreds of bullets and then set on fire whereas many Taliban celebrated with aerial firing and dancing on the dead charred bodies.
This was witnessed by the poor lad who was an artillery observer nearby and had lost contact with command himself due to equipment failure.
The great young officer who fought with all his heart is recalled by all his friends and course mates with the greatest of praise and is honored as a noble son of Pakistan in our hearts.
To you he is a paid mercenary of US, to me he is a hero of Pakistan who died for my sake!

You are critical of any army operation and want no harm to the civilians in anyway due to collateral...
TTP have killed thousands of civilians and they will not stop....but still you want Army to hold back because you want to negotiate with scum like TTP and bring about peace agreements with terrorists!

With this kind of logic how you would hope to eliminate TTP and its terrorism is beyond me and shows that you are also living in your own utopia and expect us to be realistic!
 
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