On Insulting Muslims

[Zarvan]

Sir, You are dreaming too much and over estimating muslims. Now a days countries don't fight with hand and swords. Have you heard about hellfire missile and remote controlled drons. Terrorist in muslim country are chased and killed with joy stick for away.

Sir I know that is why I said Muslims need to start covert operations so those who think of doing these acts would know they can be killed in their own countries and word sword is used as symbolic purposes so you first understand something than talk Sir

 

[Agni5000]

Sir I know that is why I said Muslims need to start covert operations so those who think of doing these acts would know they can be killed in their own countries and word sword is used as symbolic purposes so you first understand something than talk Sir

As if muslims are not doing it. that is the reason, muslims are pulled from the regular line in airport immigrations.

 

[Zarvan]

As if muslims are not doing it. that is the reason, muslims are pulled from the regular line in airport immigrations.

Mr I am talking about government level we have to make combined agencies of Muslims and do this operations

 

[Bang Galore]

Keep their hate out of our country


Andrew Bolt From: Herald Sun September 17, 2012

THE problem isn't us. It isn't even some YouTube clip posted by a filmmaker no one has heard of.

No, the problem is them.

Islamists. Extremists desperate to take offence. Bigots who use violence to frighten us into giving up our free speech.

I mean not just the people setting the Middle East ablaze, but the hundreds of Muslims who in Sydney on Saturday staged a violent riot, allegedly over a video that insults Islam. Enough.

May I ask: who let in these people who now demand the right to say who may speak and who must tremble?

Who let in those who bashed police, flew the black flag of jihad and Hamas, and had even children hold up signs exhorting, "Behead all those who insult the Prophet"?

Who welcomed these people who chanted praise of Osama bin Laden, whose terrorists killed Australians in Bali, New York and Washington?

Reality check. This protest was not caused by a YouTube clip

If this comes from opening our doors, then shut them. If this comes from multiculturalism, then scrap it.

If this is the fruit of our tolerance, let's try intolerance.

Let's debate whether we must restrict Muslim immigration until we better integrate those here already.

But already we hear the same old voices telling us the fault for the riot lies with the rest of us for being racist.

Hear them tell us to understand the anger, and do more to appease it.

They warn us, just for starters, to remove from the internet not the scores of propaganda videos of jihadists beheading Jews, Christians and journalists but one that merely makes Mohammed seem silly.

Reality check. This protest was not caused by a YouTube clip.

If Christians, Jews, Hindus, Buddhists and atheists were to attack police and demand beheadings every time we found something horrible on the internet, this country would be a war zone.

No, it's the wanting to take offence - and to threaten, attack and censor - that is the feature of these latest riots from Tunis to Sydney.

Take the most violent of those alleged "protests" - the attack on September 11 on the US consulate in Benghazi that killed US ambassador Chris Stevens and three staff.

That, too, was sold in the media as rioting over an anti-Islamic film made in the US by an Israeli Jew.

In fact, that "film" was made by a Coptic Christian originally from Egypt, and so far exists only as a YouTube clip of cartoonish quality.

Moreover, the Libyan "protest" has been claimed by al-Qaida as revenge for the killing of the group's deputy leader, with an al-Qaida-linked militia attacking the consulate with machineguns, rocket-propelled grenades and mortars. The video was just an excuse.

The violent demonstrations at the US embassy in Cairo that same day may seem more easily portrayed as a "protest".

Yet the US Government had no involvement with the video, and even disowned it.

Moreover, the radical Muslim Brotherhood that now forms Egypt's Government issued tweets and statements whipping up anger against the video and the US, and praising in Arabic the protests.

Since then, other extremists have murdered US soldiers in Afghanistan, burned a German embassy in Khartoum, stormed a US embassy compound in Yemen and torched a KFC outlet in Lebanon.

The targets seem irrelevant, and the YouTube video a pretext.

Some Sydney protesters confessed they hadn't seen it. So, no. These protests aren't understandable reaction to Americans or Jews giving offence.

They are the work of Muslim extremists determined to take it, and to jump at any chance to make us submit to their dictates.

The video is irrelevant. This violence is all.

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[Vinod2070]

Keep their hate out of our country

This kind of censorship becomes the norm in any country once it has anything more than ~1-1.5% Muslims.

Then they want to decide what is acceptable or not.

Even when they are not violent yet, they will create so much noise that what used to be normal in the liberal atmosphere of the country, suddenly doesn't remain so.

Obviously people are getting fed up of this.

They are still tolerating it and not taking the extreme step needed to maintain their way of life.

So far.

 

[Developereo]

Yours post is full of sophistry that deliberately avoids the central question, so let's go through it point by point.

No. I'm being clear here: the values one believes in ARE what one is willing to fight for. If you insult the Prophet and I kill you for it, then I'm holding the Prophet to a higher value than human life.

The 'values' in question are those of equal rights for all. Your example is not one of 'values', but of 'value judgements'. I am sure you are educated enough to know the difference, and I am disappointed that you would resort to such cheap sophistry to avoid the truth of 'equal rights', which most reasonable people hold as self-evident.

No. Just as not everyone in class gets an "A" on their report card, or that convicted felons are entitled to live in a nice house with their wife and children along with everyone else.

We are not talking about convicted felons here, but ordinary masses. The fact that you had to seek refuge in such ridiculous irrelevancies shows you are unable to address the central issue of equal rights.

Peacefully means not just without violence but without unduly disturbing other people going about their business.

Again, an irrelevant and unnecessary diversion from the main issue. Peaceful means however it is defined by the legal authorities. An authorized protest march that blocks roads during the prescribed period will inconvenience others but, as long as the protesters abide by the law, it is a 'peaceful' protest for the purposes of this discussion.

I kind of doubt that. Instead, you want to impose your own value of "truth" on others upon the point of violence, crying that your opinion is just as good as others.

Once again, the fact that you need to keep bringing in violence and felons, when it was declared up front that this is a discussion about peaceful debate, shows that you can't hold your argument without seeking refuge outside the parameters laid out.

That's a fallacy, easily seen: if you said one plus one equals three and you got a crowd together to assert that, that doesn't mean all of you are correct. One plus one still equals two.

But there are no laws stopping anyone from trying to demonstrate that one plus one need not always be two. The truth does not need to be protected by laws -- it stands on its own merit. Your example is doubly ironic since it was not until the eighteenth century that it was mathematically proven that one plus one equals two -- until that time it was taken on faith.

In any case, if you are saying that Islamic beliefs are a matter of opinion, then that same criticism applies to all faiths and it should be permissible to criticize all faiths and their adherents. Why the double standards?

At some point, if you yell loud enough that nobody can speak about anything else, then you are violating others right to free speech and you're going to be arrested - or suppressed - for disturbing the peace.

You are begging the question. With broad societal censure, there is no need for anyone to shout anything. The original premise is that some sensibilities enjoy more protection that others due to widespread censure. It is this fundamental inequality that is the topic of discussion, so let me ask you the basic question which you have avoided entirely in your replies:

Why is it that, when Muslim extremists write hate speech about others, it is condemned, but when others do the same to Muslims, it is rewarded and protected as free speech?

 

[Jango]

I still don't get it that what did a average joe do to get killed yesterday in a anti-film protest?

What did that bus driver do to get his bus burnt to bare metal? (his livelihood)

Why burn police stations and 3 police vans? (don't complain afterwards of having shortages in this department).

What is violence in Pakistan, going to do regarding this issue? It's time we take a short break to look into our own selves and do some self-introspection.

Although the examples above are from Pakistan, but the issue is for the whole Muslim world.

 

[Developereo]

Andrew Bolt

Bolt caters to the far right extremists in Australian society. You should have seen what he wrote about Indians during the heydey of the "attacks on Indian students".

I won't bother responding to the contents since there is nothing new here which hasn't already been debated elsewhere ad nauseum. It's just a mish-mash of what he has written about various immigrant groups in the past, including Indians.

 

[VCheng]

I still don't get it that what did a average joe do to get killed yesterday in a anti-film protest?

What did that bus driver do to get his bus burnt to bare metal? (his livelihood)

Why burn police stations and 3 police vans? (don't complain afterwards of having shortages in this department).

What is violence in Pakistan, going to do regarding this issue? It's time we take a short break to look into our own selves and do some self-introspection.

Although the examples above are from Pakistan, but the issue is for the whole Muslim world.

You may find this article interesting:

http://www.defence.pk/forums/world-affairs/208158-muslim-rage.html

 

[Audio]

Why is it that, when Muslim extremists write hate speech about others, it is condemned, but when others do the same to Muslims, it is rewarded and protected as free speech?

im sure the word "Jews" resonates somewhere in your cranium as you try to ponder this mystery!

...........

 

[Developereo]

im sure the word "Jews" resonates somewhere in your cranium as you try to ponder this mystery!

...........

If a proper discussion is above your intellectual capabilities, then feel free to sit this one out.

Randomly flinging "anti-Semite" in a debate is the last refuge of the desperate, and the first impulse of the incompetent.

Do you actually have an answer to the question, or can we expect your usual level of "debating" from you.

 

[Agni5000]

Mr I am talking about government level we have to make combined agencies of Muslims and do this operations

Sir, as I said, you are dreaming too much. First stop the internal war among your religion of peace. ex: siriya, libya etc..

 

[Hulk]

Keep their hate out of our country


Andrew Bolt From: Herald Sun September 17, 2012

THE problem isn't us. It isn't even some YouTube clip posted by a filmmaker no one has heard of.

No, the problem is them.

Islamists. Extremists desperate to take offence. Bigots who use violence to frighten us into giving up our free speech.

I mean not just the people setting the Middle East ablaze, but the hundreds of Muslims who in Sydney on Saturday staged a violent riot, allegedly over a video that insults Islam. Enough.

May I ask: who let in these people who now demand the right to say who may speak and who must tremble?

Who let in those who bashed police, flew the black flag of jihad and Hamas, and had even children hold up signs exhorting, "Behead all those who insult the Prophet"?

Who welcomed these people who chanted praise of Osama bin Laden, whose terrorists killed Australians in Bali, New York and Washington?

Reality check. This protest was not caused by a YouTube clip

If this comes from opening our doors, then shut them. If this comes from multiculturalism, then scrap it.

If this is the fruit of our tolerance, let's try intolerance.

Let's debate whether we must restrict Muslim immigration until we better integrate those here already.

But already we hear the same old voices telling us the fault for the riot lies with the rest of us for being racist.

Hear them tell us to understand the anger, and do more to appease it.

They warn us, just for starters, to remove from the internet not the scores of propaganda videos of jihadists beheading Jews, Christians and journalists but one that merely makes Mohammed seem silly.

Reality check. This protest was not caused by a YouTube clip.

If Christians, Jews, Hindus, Buddhists and atheists were to attack police and demand beheadings every time we found something horrible on the internet, this country would be a war zone.

No, it's the wanting to take offence - and to threaten, attack and censor - that is the feature of these latest riots from Tunis to Sydney.

Take the most violent of those alleged "protests" - the attack on September 11 on the US consulate in Benghazi that killed US ambassador Chris Stevens and three staff.

That, too, was sold in the media as rioting over an anti-Islamic film made in the US by an Israeli Jew.

In fact, that "film" was made by a Coptic Christian originally from Egypt, and so far exists only as a YouTube clip of cartoonish quality.

Moreover, the Libyan "protest" has been claimed by al-Qaida as revenge for the killing of the group's deputy leader, with an al-Qaida-linked militia attacking the consulate with machineguns, rocket-propelled grenades and mortars. The video was just an excuse.

The violent demonstrations at the US embassy in Cairo that same day may seem more easily portrayed as a "protest".

Yet the US Government had no involvement with the video, and even disowned it.

Moreover, the radical Muslim Brotherhood that now forms Egypt's Government issued tweets and statements whipping up anger against the video and the US, and praising in Arabic the protests.

Since then, other extremists have murdered US soldiers in Afghanistan, burned a German embassy in Khartoum, stormed a US embassy compound in Yemen and torched a KFC outlet in Lebanon.

The targets seem irrelevant, and the YouTube video a pretext.

Some Sydney protesters confessed they hadn't seen it. So, no. These protests aren't understandable reaction to Americans or Jews giving offence.

They are the work of Muslim extremists determined to take it, and to jump at any chance to make us submit to their dictates.

The video is irrelevant. This violence is all.

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I agree that you should not migrate to a foreign country if want to change their laws and way of thinking. You know that every Muslim who apply for Visa has to go through full background check. These people are the reason why this happens. Then these guys complain of discrimination, when you behave as a group other side will also identify as group. The same people who are crying foul is someone abuses their religion, on the other hand they are the first to categorize and pass racist comments on other religion.

How many times they have said Israeli Zionist aur Hindu xyz on this same forum.

These people if become powerful in world will not let any other religion live peacefully. We will see the convert or die again.

 

[Developereo]

How many times they have said Israeli Zionist aur Hindu xyz on this same forum.

Yet another clueless comment. Zionism is not a religion. There are more non-Jewish Zionists in the US than there are Jewish ones.

Modern Zionism is to Judaism what radical Islamism is to Islam, or radical Hindutva is to Hinduism.

 

[Hulk]

Yet another clueless comment. Zionism is not a religion. There are more non-Jewish Zionists in the US than there are Jewish ones.

I might not be understanding Zionists but you miss the point completely.

In this forum people have abused Jews and Hindus and were tolerated. Same thing cannot be said for Muslims.

You guys abuse people in the name of religion at the drop of hat.