No One Can Seperate Islam and Pakistan: Gen. Kayani

[Abu Zolfiqar]

I am surprised that no one is going deeper into this issue. If Kiyani is saying that no one can separate Islam from Pakistan, then it simply means that there is an active attempt to separate islam from Pakistan to the extent that Gen. himself had to reassure the people.

The war we are fighting we like to equate it as "good" vs "evil"

We are a predominantly Muslim country whose Constitution encompasses Islamic values, while we also keep in mind our patriotic Minority Groups whom are subject to equal laws and regulations as per Constitution - Pakistan.

There is no attempt to seperate the two; but there is an attempt to clarify that we are at war with foreign-assisted miscreant elements who are clearly trying to divide public and assault our Islamic and general human values.

There really isn't much "digging" needed for this subject. He was giving an address in Peshawar and happened to broach the subject.

 

[Bhaarat]

Abu,

You maybe correct, but it seems that this declaration of Kiyani was a response to this ‘Islamic Republic of Pakistan’ to ‘People’s Republic of Pakistan’

So, some parties want to change the name of Pakistan such that its islamic identity is not stressed, but why? what could be the reason?

 

[Abu Zolfiqar]

Abu,

You maybe correct, but it seems that this declaration of Kiyani was a response to this ‘Islamic Republic of Pakistan’ to ‘People’s Republic of Pakistan’

So, some parties want to change the name of Pakistan such that its islamic identity is not stressed, but why? what could be the reason?

This was the request made by some individuals and political parties, such as the ultra-secular MQM.

We have more important issues to deal with and shouldn't be worrying about the name of the country right now.


I kind of like People's Republic --even though the socialist over-tones I find kind of ... ... disconcerting

In my very humble opinion, Republic of Pakistan would suffice

 

[Bhaarat]

This was the request made by some individuals and political parties, such as the ultra-secular MQM.

We have more important issues to deal with and shouldn't be worrying about the name of the country right now.


I kind of like People's Republic --even though the socialist over-tones I find kind of ... ... disconcerting

In my very humble opinion, Republic of Pakistan would suffice

Well, the name changing seems like a precursor to slowly removing Islamic fervour from Pakistan...MQM and ANP both have supported this move. and Kiyaniji reassured the nation. If we connect the dots, this seems like something bigger is cooking.

Otherwise, a person of stature of Kiyani need not have to issue any reassurance.

 

[Al-zakir]

No One Can Seperate Islam and Pakistan: Gen. Kayani

General is absolutely right.

 

[StingRoy]

even IF what you said is true, head over to bharat rhakshat (spelling?) and see what your fellow indian are obsessed with.

It is Bharat Rakshak (Rakshak meaning protector). I haven't checked that forum... Maybe if time permits I might.

This is a professional political/defence forum with 21,683 active, semi-active and inactive users. Are you REALLY going to generalize? Incidentally, Armed Forces and our Deen are very important to us, but I don't see any "obsessiveness" being exhibited. Can you corroborate your statement?

I did not want to generalize, but the past couple of months (since I have been on this forum) have changed my opinion. Just have a look at the number of talk shows (especially Zaid Hamid) that are based on hatred towards Indians... Even the Indian muslims would reject his rants against Indians.

nobody should under-estimate his/her enemy
as did/do we.
most ridiculous statement ever. Pakistani nation-hood does not encompass hatred for anybody. We do hate enemies and ill-wishers of our nation.
You are either with us, or against us.

Again this opinion of mine (Pakistani hatred against Indians) has changed in the past months. I have some good Pakistani friends in the US and we get along quite well and I believed it was just the govts who were at war, not the people.
Why do you think there were so many bombings killing hundreds of innocent children and women?... Do you still think it was based on love?... Does Islam preach killing innocents doing leading a modest and peaceful life? These are your own people up in arms against their own brothers and sisters. I understand that Islam is based on love, but why are we seeing so many Jihadists and Terrorists who are Muslims? Why do you think that there is a general fear of Muslims around the world? Either they fail to understand Islam and its principles or the "other world" is just crazy forming these opinions.

india has seen its fair share of communal strife and caste-based politics and violence. you yourself said "we all know history" --- so don't neglect your own short-comings before critisizing us.

Agree, that India is not perfect and as someone pointed out in another post, no country is perfect... I did my schooling in India and we were taught to respect people of all religions and castes and live in harmony. I am not sure about the educational system in Pakistan in terms of religious tolerance, but my guess - there is none.

show me one Pakistani equivalent of Bal Thackeray -- in Pakistan. Can you find some who are active in politics?
I can name you dozens of indian politicians who are not so "lov[ing] for all religions and cultures"

They are playing regional politics and those who are in the national fora are deeply criticized for their extremist views. Ask any educated and rational Indian and he will tell you. Did you read about Varun Gandhi who was jailed for making inflammatory speeches against Muslims in a political rally?

and no - i do not intend this to become Pakistan - hindoostany debate. We have better things to worry about than what happens in the neighbour country; save for our clearly stated stance on occupied Kashmir.

Me neither, we definitely have a lot of things to worry about other than religion.... we have a growing economy, an emerging young workforce and I feel one of our biggest challenges is to make sure this economic growth reaches the grassroots. I am sure these issues are the same at your end as well... along with religious extremism and terrorism. So save the religion debate aside and first deal with the immediate danger to your nation. Kashmir can be discussed once Pakistan has been able to fight off these religious extremists and guarantee that it will will not give shelter to terrorists and jehadists.

 

[StingRoy]

oh man that was too funny...good joke dude..send that one to russell peters

Maybe you can do the honors since you are near his home.
If it were not for tolerance and respect for people of different cultures and religions there would never have been a country called India.

 

[third eye]

The war we are fighting we like to equate it as "good" vs "evil"

We are a predominantly Muslim country whose Constitution encompasses Islamic values, while we also keep in mind our patriotic Minority Groups whom are subject to equal laws and regulations as per Constitution - Pakistan.

There is no attempt to seperate the two; but there is an attempt to clarify that we are at war with foreign-assisted miscreant elements who are clearly trying to divide public and assault our Islamic and general human values.

There really isn't much "digging" needed for this subject. He was giving an address in Peshawar and happened to broach the subject.

I think this pretty much sums it all up.

We S Asians love to look for ulterior motives & refer things out of context.

 

[Balance]

what a childish argument. So according to you religion is a civil political issue?????

BTW the ideology of creation of Pakistan is not some civil army issue.

He was speaking to soldiers

Civil political issue? Religion? No.

Changing Pakistan's name from "Islamic Republic" to "Peoples Republic"? Surely, yes.

 

[Balance]

Yaar your generals convey their personal feelings on a regular basis and most of the times they are not in line with the govt. policy. A few days ago, IAF ACM or a VC said that IAF can't match PAF at the present time, on the other hand GoI claims that India is prepared to meet any threat.

For the last time now - IAF ACM just said PAF is ahead in exports. We already have enough BS on this matter. Also, it was purely a military issue.

Gen. Kiyani represents the armed forces of Pakistan and this issue of name changing was causing anxiety in all sections of the society, so, as the head of his org. he simply clarified his position so that people in Pakistan understand the POV of teh armed forces.

If he had not given this statement then members of our armed forces would think that their Chief is also okay with this issue of name changing. Lets not read too much into to this.

I am not against him having his views. My point is 'why publicly?'

Surely, they have mass communication systems within defense forces which can spread a word without letting it slip into civilian world.

It was totally unnecessary thing to do. World (including Pakistani experts) tends to seek meaning in such actions. And then you cry blaming others for controversies about Pakistan.

 

[Balance]

A warning to those who are trying to separate it by giving us some suger-coated poison

You didn't answer the question.

To remind you, the question was "who is trying to separate Islam from Pakistan?"

 

[Balance]

No no not those.

There was another thread where your official said we are no match

let me check in which section it is


And BTw we did not misquote your chief , he was quoted by your media as it is

Indian and Pakistani media often acts like an ignorant child at times.

I wrote letters to two leading Marathi newspapers and they printed their apologies in two days. Bottom line - by you or by Indian media, a misquote is a misquote!

 

[Foster]

You didn't answer the question.

To remind you, the question was "who is trying to separate Islam from Pakistan?"

pakistan itself...by supporting america killing there own islamic brother(taliban).....it means they are separated...you know why? because they want money from america...thats why they are killing there own brother
paisa bhaiyo ko allag kar deta hai...

 

[vsdoc]

Sane minds in Pakistan have realised the folly of Islam over Country and are trying to rectify it before Pakistan goes irrevocably over the brink.

Time will tell whether they succeeded or failed.

We have more important things to do as a country than to nod sagely and smugly say "I told you so" to our neighbours.

They chose a route for themselves ..... as did we.

Let us simply leave it at that.

Cheers, Doc

 

[MZUBAIR]

Salut to kayani.
The right man for right position.