No fighters for pakistan: Russia

[Muhammad Omar]

I feel, the Life Cycle Cost Assessment ( The Indian MKIs are Very Very Costly in Maintenance ) will reveal J10s to be far more logical choice.

Fir twin Engine, Western Fighters are the Best. Why not give a shot for Gripen ?

Cause Block III of JF-17 will be close or equal to Gripen

 

[Basel]

Here's international relationships 101 for you.
India buys 5 billion worth of weapons from Russia to keep them "engaged". India gives Bangladesh 2 Billion USD worth package and Chinese counter it with a multiple of the amoint. Surely they won't have a chapter on power of money in international relations while it should be the primer.

Stay on topic don't troll by going off topic things.

Why you are bringing India in thread?

@waz @Horus @Oscar please clean thread from trolls and off topic posts.

 

[shah1398]

So JF-17 is flying with vedic tech, MI-17s are just a death trap, MI-35s are just for fun sake and most interestingly Russia lifted arms embargo on Pakistan only as foreign policy demonstrator/simulator. Seeing how India got silent after recent exercise between Pakistan and Russia when Russians gave some "lollipop" assurances out there, Russia seems to have mastered the art of how to convince India while carrying on usual business. Business means they are still using Pakistan factor to sell more arms to India while Pakistan is still getting what it is asking for. Interesting times ahead.

 

[Thorough Pro]

"We are not delivering" (as in now) is not equal to "We will not deliver" (as in future)

Here is what a Russian official said:

1- How about the new ties with Pakistan, including delivery of helicopters, and the recent military exercises? Do you plan any military sales to Pakistan, given a Russian delegation attended the Karachi DefExpo for the first time?

Our relationship with Pakistan has existed in the past as well, and while you can see areas where it has broadened, but not significantly. The military exercises in September this year were directly connected with modernising counter terror operations in Pakistan. ISIS is a global danger and doesn’t just involve terrorists in the Middle East but also in India and Pakistan. Therefore joint military exercises are important, but it must be noted that were not in any way targeted at India or at any other conflict in the region.

2- And military sales, given reports Russia may consider selling Su-35s in the future?

We are not delivering any military aircraft to Pakistan. We have made deliveries of transport helicopters and that contract has been completed. No contracts or plans for any other military-related equipment to Pakistan exist for present.

So guys dont play with your emotions and forget SU-35..

@Bratva @Zarvan (Specially bhai ap)
@Khafee @Windjammer @PaklovesTurkiye

 

[Super Falcon]

Bhai, J10s ?

J 11

Yes the credibility of guy is questioned here

If it was a case than why Russia lifted the ban on Pakistan for weapons sale Russia FM said it that we will sell Pakistan weapons or anyone Six months ago

Pakistan will get planes if it pays dollars
Indian cannot stop every country to sell weapons to Pakistan

The CEO of news company wants Indian reputation he got it now

Mi 35E Is not a transport halo it's is best attack halo so the news I doubt written by some Indian journalist

 

[PakEye]

Jf17 is a Chinese plane!

lol so what JF-17 is developed with the help and partner ship between PAC and CAC of China on 50 : 50 % pertnership because Pakistan haven't the relative industrial and technological Industries.
No major fighter aircraft/complex weapon system since the advent of globalization has been completely independent of subsystems procured/ sourced from another country.

Brazil has been very successful with its “Embraer” line of commercial aircraft. All its avionics, all its engines, and several of its systems come from the US.
Even Saab Gripen uses over 50% imported components from US,Italy and other countries. Still it is a Swedish aircraft because it is designed and built by Saab.
and Now look into your super dooper LCA Tejas the engine(G.E F-104), ejection seat (Martin Baker), actuators(Moog) and radar (Elta EL/M 2032) are of USA, British, USA and Israeli origin respectively. These are the major imported systems.
Reinventing the wheel and getting every component and sub component of a combat aircraft indiginously produced is not feasible. The reason is that these are low cost items and to set up a production line for a limited demand is not practical.

 

[Zain Malik]

lol so what JF-17 is developed with the help and partner ship between PAC and CAC of China on 50 : 50 % pertnership because Pakistan haven't the relative industrial and technological Industries.
No major fighter aircraft/complex weapon system since the advent of globalization has been completely independent of subsystems procured/ sourced from another country.

Brazil has been very successful with its “Embraer” line of commercial aircraft. All its avionics, all its engines, and several of its systems come from the US.
Even Saab Gripen uses over 50% imported components from US,Italy and other countries. Still it is a Swedish aircraft because it is designed and built by Saab.
and Now look into your super dooper LCA Tejas the engine(G.E F-104), ejection seat (Martin Baker), actuators(Moog) and radar (Elta EL/M 2032) are of USA, British, USA and Israeli origin respectively. These are the major imported systems.
Reinventing the wheel and getting every component and sub component of a combat aircraft indiginously produced is not feasible. The reason is that these are low cost items and to set up a production line for a limited demand is not practical.

Bhai Samajh jao Workers to un k the na.... Indigenous hua k nahi..??

 

[X-2.]

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PM Modi with Russian President Vladimir Putin during joint press statements ceremony in Goa. (AFP Photo)
PANAJI : The CEO of Russia's ROSTEC Corp, Sergey Chemezov, has said that Moscow has not signed any contracts and has no plans for signing any military-related deals with Pakistan.

"We are not delivering any modern aircraft and any military aircraft to Pakistan. We have made deliveries of helicopters, but those are specialised in transport and that contract has been completed," said Chemezov.

"No contracts or plans for any other military-related equipment to be delivered to Pakistan," he added.

Commenting on Russia- Pakistan joint military exercises, Chemezov said the military exercises held earlier in September this year were directly connected with modernising counter terror operations in Pakistan.

He said that the joint military exercises was important so that the nation could be prepared for fight from organisations like the ISIS, which is a global threat and is involved in spreading terrorism.

"ISIS is a global terrorist organisation, it is something that is the global danger and doesn't just involve terrorists in the Middle East but also in Russia, terrorism in India as well as Pakistan," he said.

"Therefore, joint military exercises are important but it must be noted that (they) were not in any way targeted at India or at any other conflict in the region," he added.

Chemezov said that Russia's relationship with India has always remained very strong and fruitful.

India and Russia on Saturday signed 16 agreements and three announcements in a number of fields including infrastructure, defence, ship building, science and technology and railways.

The agreements were signed in the presence of Prime Minister Narendra Modi and Russian President Vladimir Putin on the sidelines of the BRICS Summit in Goa.

In a joint statement with Putin, Prime Minister Modi said the agreements on manufacturing of Kamov-226T helicopters, construction of frigates, and acquisition and building of other defence platforms are in synergy with India's technology and security priorities.

Russians now how touchy indians areso they are justclming there butthurt
Russians said thrrr is not any deal in present but they didn't said they will not sale in future or they rejected any sale at present

 

[PakEye]

Bhai Samajh jao Workers to un k the na.... Indigenous hua k nahi..??

HAL India working on LCA tejas and its engine since 1980's era and they have kaveri engine i think in 20 years time period PAC Kamra can be achived the target to produce its own jet engine.

 

[Zain Malik]

HAL India working on LCA tejas and its engine since 1980's era and they have kaveri engine i think in 20 years time period PAC Kamra can be achived the target to produce its own jet engine.

Our engineers have the ability... YES WE CAN DO IT..

 

[PakEye]

Trump supports India

confused Trump he support HINDU OF INDIA .

 

[SBD-3]

Cause Block III of JF-17 will be close or equal to Gripen

Griffin have already advanced to NG few years ago. By the time JFT block III comes around (Block II is already behind schedule) who knows what Grippen would be fielding. JFT will always be JFT and Griffin will always be Griffin

 

[PakEye]

Our engineers have the ability... YES WE CAN DO IT..

some where i read about PAC is negotiations for RD-93 overhaul facilities in Pakistan than why only overhauling why not assembling in first phase because we will produced total 250 JFT's means we are major buyer of this engine.

 

[Zain Malik]

some where i read about PAC is negotiations for RD-93 overhaul facilities in Pakistan than why only overhauling why not assembling in first phase because we will produced total 250 JFT's means we are major buyer of this engine.

No need to go Russia and ask for help to assemble RD-93 in Pakistan .. Just wait for China to mature in engine project like WS-13 and WS-15 ... Then sure we will use WS-13 in Thunder and that will be manufactures in Pakistan and thunder's production no way going to stop .. You know... !!!

 

[GDP Adil Khan Niazi]

Nemichandra K P is an indian who wrote this , please read the first line first clearly

The Russians have been trying hard to sell their Su 35 with little success. The offered it to India and we rejected their offer since it is very similar to the Su 30MKI. Very recently Indonesia has agreed to buy 16 Su 35S and negotiations with China are ongoing. Brazil Vietnam and Pakistan are also said to be interested.

Present Scenario:The Economic sanctions imposed on Russia by the West has undoubtedly put them in a tough spot. This will further increase the pressure on them to sell those super Flankers. Vladimir Kozhin an aid of Vladimir Putin is said to have told reporters that Russia may sell Su 35 to Pakistan.
Moscow is also trying to get close to Islamabad utilizing the unstable relationship between Pakistan and US and Pakistan's closeness to China.

Possibilities:Acquiring Su 35 will definitely give Pakistan an edge over current IAF fighters. Compared to the Su 30MKI it has better radar, more powerful engines, super cruise( supersonic speeds without after burners)and longer range.

In a BVR(Beyond Visual Range) combat situation Su 35 definitely has an edge due to its N-035 IRBIS-E AESA radar but the performance of BVR missiles in all major wars have been unsatisfactory to say the least. And most of the times the engagements have been reduced to visual range.

In visual range the higher thrust to weight ratio will give the Su 35 a higher climbing rate and more acceleration. Both Su 30MKI and the Su 35 have similar silhouettes, this makes identification even tougher in visual range and both sides will take collateral damage while making kills.


But all in not lost for the IAF. Firstly PAF has been handling only light and nimble dogfighters like F16 and JF 17. Handling a big, Heavy and powerful Fighter like the Su 35 will be different. You cannot use the same strategies and game plan which you would have in an F 16. Also mastering TVC (Thrust vectoring)will require significant practice and take its own time. The current performance of the IAF in Indradhanush combat exercises where they scored 11 - 0 kills against British typhoons shows that they have really mastered their Sukhois.

Also Pakistan is taking a big risk, In all the previous conflicts Russia has openly supported India. The last thing they want is for Russia to deny them spares and missiles during a war.

Counter Measures:India is extensively modernizing its Su 30 squadrons also the proposed upgradation to Super Sukhoi configuration which is said to be very close to the FGFA will make it even with the Su35 . If India Inducts the FGFA(Indian version of T50), it will give the IAF significant advantages over the Su 35.

So, By the Time PAF has a good number of Su 35 and adequately trained pilots, the IAF will have significant time to field Super Sukhois and if possible the FGFA(Which is running behind schedule)

Political Outcomes :Russians would have definitely shot themselves on the foot, This deal will only give them short term gains and marginal profit but will prove to be bad on the longer term. India may further look towards the French, EADS or US for Aircrafts. The US has already replaced Russia as India's number one arms exporter and this gap will only widen.

India will also look more towards indigenous production of Aircrafts and will speed up development and production of Tejas MK2.

sources : https://www.quora.com/What-do-you-make-out-of-Pakistan-getting-Su-35-from-Russia