no .. not at all..so this thread should be closed immediately... asking for mods opinion and final words on the same..
New pics of IAF SU30MKIs heading towards Red Flags 2008 Exercise
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no .. not at all..so this thread should be closed immediately... asking for mods opinion and final words on the same..
Goodperson
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Thanks for posting this video the interview of pilots speaks volumes.
Skywalker
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Was it a cricket match or some propaganda?.....we did this and we did that..nobody is undermining the skills of IAF pilots but propagating the outcome in this matter can raise loads of eyebrows ( apnay moon mian mitthoo).
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Goodperson
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And why not
"Impressed by the prowess of the IAF, the US Air Force has expressed its keenness to exercise with it on a regular basis in Red Flag, considered to be one of the toughest military exercises in the world."
"Impressed by the prowess of the IAF, the US Air Force has expressed its keenness to exercise with it on a regular basis in Red Flag, considered to be one of the toughest military exercises in the world."
I personally think that it is a big excercise but surely not the thoughest. You have always some excercises that you need to fly fast and low doing a2a... And there are some excersises with a lot more uptodate sams. It was one of the best a decade ago...
It suits the US with its netcentric AWACS approach.
It suits the US with its netcentric AWACS approach.
I would say its probably one of the more comprehensive exercises with a wide array of threats and scenarios thrown into it. I know that individually the Air Forces train harder on different aspects, but to be able to exercise in LFE type cases with AEW support, I think its a good one to be in.
Do want to add that Anatolian Eagle is very similar to RF.
Do want to add that Anatolian Eagle is very similar to RF.
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Myth_buster_1
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cope-india + red flag= Indian ego satisfaction..
and hopefully US will win couple of multi billion defence orders..
remember... nether any of mature defence analyst have admit any of indian bakwasi claims..
"As an air defence analyst, I am fully aware that the Pakistan Air
Force ranks today as one of the best air forces in the world and that
the PAF Combat Commanders' School (CCS) in Sargodha has been ranked
as the best GCI/pilot and fighter tactics and weapons school in the
world". As one senior US defence analyst commented to me in 1991, "it
leaves Topgun (the US Naval Air Station in Miramar, California) far
behind".
-Sergey Vekhov
May 1993 issue (pages 46-47) of Airforces Monthly, a reputable
UK-based air defence magazine.
The PAF, although outnumbered by IAF(Indian Air Force), has at least
one qualitative edge over its rival: Pilot Training. The caliber of
Pakistani instructors is acknowledged by numerous air forces, and US
Navy pilots considered them to be highly 'professional' during
exercises flying off the USS Constellation (as co-pilots).
-Jane's International Defense (June 24, 1998)
23rd,
The only issue with the above is that PAF cannot afford to rest on its laurels. We need to constantly improve (and we are) as the other side increases its training tempo.
I think the focus on the Pakistani side needs to move away from the historical perspective into a more forward looking analysis. PAF history is definitely very motivational especially when looked at in the context of our performance against all odds.
Between 1998 and 2008, IAF has made a lot of changes, PAF on the training and planning side has done the same, unfortunately on the equipment side, we have been lacking. But if the current plans go ahead then I think PAF will have very current gear. I also think that aside from AE in the future, PAF will be at RF as well.
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nitesh
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ok so how it is satisfying the ego? pls explain. US will win or not win any order depending on there product capability. I don't know how exercise is going to help in that. India is conducting exercises with different countries.
x_man
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Well in such exercises, tens of Airforces participate, everyone flies as per their assigned role, and everyone is assessed and de-briefed as a group (not individual performances...), everyones ego is satisfied. Everyone is admired for their efforts and after that everyone heads back home happily: There are no winners or loosers in it...Rather everyone is a winner .http://www.mysmiley.net/free-animal-smileys.php
While SU-30s were assigned surface-attack role in RF, so I can assume that their task was to bomb the ground targets instead of knocking the planes out of sky. That job would have been done by the Escorts accompanying the strike package...I am sure that a fifth generation fighter must have hit all the surface targets that were tasked
If one has a chance to hear the other pilots/airforces , I am sure they will be saying the exactly same things about their own performance The aim for such multi-nation exercises is to learn from each others experiences and gauge aircraft performances I am certain that everyone must have done equally well
No doubt about the SU-30s performance, it must have delivered what was expected out of it..
While SU-30s were assigned surface-attack role in RF, so I can assume that their task was to bomb the ground targets instead of knocking the planes out of sky. That job would have been done by the Escorts accompanying the strike package...I am sure that a fifth generation fighter must have hit all the surface targets that were tasked
If one has a chance to hear the other pilots/airforces , I am sure they will be saying the exactly same things about their own performance The aim for such multi-nation exercises is to learn from each others experiences and gauge aircraft performances I am certain that everyone must have done equally well
No doubt about the SU-30s performance, it must have delivered what was expected out of it..
Well in such exercises, tens of Airforces participate, everyone flies as per their assigned role, and everyone is assessed and de-briefed as a group (not individual performances...), everyones ego is satisfied. Everyone is admired for their efforts and after that everyone heads back home happily: There are no winners or loosers in it...Rather everyone is a winner .
While SU-30s were assigned surface-attack role in RF, so I can assume that their task was to bomb the ground targets instead of knocking the planes out of sky. That job would have been done by the Escorts accompanying the strike package...I am sure that a fifth generation fighter must have hit all the surface targets that were tasked
If one has a chance to hear the other pilots/airforces , I am sure they will be saying the exactly same things about their own performance The aim for such multi-nation exercises is to learn from each others experiences and gauge aircraft performances I am certain that everyone must have done equally well
No doubt about the SU-30s performance, it must have delivered what was expected out of it..
Kind of agree with Xman... see dont take too much into media sensationalism .. all these reprots are basically for the consumption of ordinary citizen without much knowledge about military aviation anyway..... in way it is good that we are promoting the news among the masses... at-least if not anything else .. youth can be inspired to join the AF... rest of the benefits which we actually gain out of the exercises are well documented already.....
IceCold
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So now i know why we never saw PAF joining the red flag. I guess we would be looking to participate rather free then paying.
Muradk
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I saw Red flag during one of my courses in the 80s, and them I saw it again during another course in 89. A few things changed in it the Col I was flying with earlier saw me laughing and said this looks like piece of cake to you guys because I have seen your CCS but only from the ground and then I saw the Mirage gun kills, you guys really fight it out. he said your secong phase is our last phase 6 vs 2 . In that we just want to see how the 2 fighter coordinate with each other instead of fighting and you guys fight it out. I just told him and he knew more than I did the suroundings of Pakistan and what we are up against.
The only thing which seemed weird was the F-16s could have taken the F-14s out in a sec 2 vs 2, the F-16s were 300 ft behind the F-14s and the F-14 were throwing out 4 flares at a time, The F-16 could have taken him by guns in a matter of seconds but he took the F-14 out by a missile and took atleast 1 min.
The only thing which seemed weird was the F-16s could have taken the F-14s out in a sec 2 vs 2, the F-16s were 300 ft behind the F-14s and the F-14 were throwing out 4 flares at a time, The F-16 could have taken him by guns in a matter of seconds but he took the F-14 out by a missile and took atleast 1 min.
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