Military's role in the identity of Pakistan

[Shahmir]

Hindko is not spoken anywhere in AJK. My point was that dogras are genetically and ethnically closer to Potoharis than they are to people from Gujranwala, Sialkot, etc. Rajput tribes like minhas and jarral are found all over AJK, Potohar and Jammu. Also, Dogras have nothing to do with Kashmiris, as majority of them are rajputs.

Also why are you being so rude? Internet warrior I suppose?

The Doda district is a mixed kashmiri-dogri region. But no region of mixed kashmiri-pothohari exists. Moreover dogras have a huge brahmin population which is related to brahmin population of kashmir valley, it is not just rajput only area.

 

[INDIC]

@INDIC @Jaggu @jatt+gutts
I'm not sure about your claim. I also don't think Punjabis look identical to Dogras on either sides of the border. This is the map of Dogri speakers

Btw more Dogras (from Jammu theatre- that's why guys look so goofy)

It is reminding me old days of Doordarshan. Girl in the first and second picture has very good look.

 

[jatt+gutts]

Ok now we know who they are. We also have gujjars like them in Pakistan, but in our area gujjars are settled and own land just like jats. Its likely they didnt even knew what was happening around 47, they should have migrated to Pakistan back then.

indian Punjabi gujjars ar somewhat like this..unfortunately don have pictures of them in net..but once you cross wagah border via bus you will see them living at shamlat jameen on the sides of highway

 

[jandk]

The Doda district is a mixed kashmiri-dogri region. But no region of mixed kashmiri-pothohari exists. Moreover dogras have a huge brahmin population which is related to brahmin population of kashmir valley, it is not just rajput only area.

Yes dogras are mostly Rajputs and Brahmins. I believe both are equally numerous or maybe there are slightly more Rajputs than Brahmins. I am dogra Brahmin.
Also don't forget jammu has a lot of people from muzaffarnagar, mirpuris, poonch etc. Hindus that moved from there. So overlap between po.k and dogras is not surprising

 

[ghoul]

The Doda district is a mixed kashmiri-dogri region. But no region of mixed kashmiri-pothohari exists. Moreover dogras have a huge brahmin population which is related to brahmin population of kashmir valley, it is not just rajput only area.

Dogra brahmins are not dardic like Kashmiris are. Brahmins are found all over Indian sub-continent. Sanjay Dutt's father for example is a Potohari brahmin. My point is Dogras have nothing to do with Punjabis from Gujranwala and Kashmiris. The only people that might be related to Dogras are the rajput tribes of AJK and Potohar. Nuff said.

 

[Shabaz Sharif]

indian Punjabi gujjars ar somewhat like this..unfortunately don have pictures of them in net..but once you cross wagah border via bus you will see them living at shamlat jameen on the sides of highway

Yes these gujjars look like gujjars from Kashmir region in Pakistan. Both have nomadic life style.

 

[Shahmir]

Dogra brahmins are not dardic like Kashmiris are. Brahmins are found all over Indian sub-continent. Sanjay Dutt's father for example is a Potohari brahmin. My point is Dogras have nothing to do with Punjabis from Gujranwala and Kashmiris. The only people that might be related to Dogras are the rajput tribes of AJK and Potohar. Nuff said.

Jammu is merely 30/40 km away from Sialkot , Pothohari regions are 300 km away from jammu, you can live in your self created illusion but jammu is more accessable from Sialkot than from pothohar region, enough said.

As for as Brahmins of jammu are concerned , some of them are related to kashmiri brahmins while others not.

 

[INDIC]

This map is 100% wrong for Dogra speakers, to much area of west punjab included. Here is proper map of Punjabi dialects.

In central punjab, around our areas. There is group of people, others call them "changers" i think. They collect kachra, nomadic life style? Have very light features, speak punjabi. Which caste/tribe they belong to?

I had told you once the map is wrong, Bagri is a Rajasthani dialect which sounds very Rajasthani instead of Punjabi.

 

[Shabaz Sharif]

I had told you once the map is wrong, Bagri is a Rajasthani dialect which sounds very Rajasthani instead of Punjabi.

This map isnt wrong just because Bagri is included there for more information. Bagri isnt considered punjabi dialect anyway. Now bug off, especially someone who think Dogri is dialect of hindi lol

 

[ghoul]

Jammu is merely 30 KM away from Sialkot , Pothohari regions are 300 km away from jammu, you can live in your self created illusion but jammus is more accessable from Sialkot than from pothohar region, enough said.

Strong self hate mate. Marketing yourself as some ethnicity different than your own. How are Sialkotis and gujranwala people more "dogra" than mair minhas of Chakwal, and Raja Pervez Ashraf from Gujar Khan? Just because Dogras are lighter complexioned, you want to be considered a Dogra haha.

 

[INDIC]

This map isnt wrong just because Bagri is included there for more information. Bagri isnt considered punjabi dialect anyway. Now bug off, especially someone who think Dogri is dialect of hindi lol

Who said Dogri is a dialect of Hindi, are you confusing Dogri of Jammu with Pahari of Himachal.

 

[Shahmir]

Strong self hate mate. Marketing yourself as some ethnicity different than your own. How are Sialkotis and gujranwala people more "dogra" than mair minhas of Chakwal, and Raja Pervez Ashraf from Gujar Khan? Just because Dogras are lighter complexioned, you want to be considered a Dogra haha.

I am not saying people from Gujranwala or Sialkot are from dogras, I would actually look down upon them. People of Gujranwala/sialkot/Gujrat are pure punjabis mostly jatts/gujjars/arain etc. I am just stating the fact that they are more accessible from Sialkot region than pothohar regardless of some minhas tribe migrating here and there from jammu to pothohar.

 

[ghoul]

I am not saying people from Gujranwala or Sialkot are from dogras, I would actually look down upon them. People of Gujranwala/sialkot are pure punjabis mostly jatts/gujjars/arain etc. I am just stating the fact that they are more accessible from Sialkot region than pothohar regardless of some minhas tribe migrating here and there from jammu to pothohar.

Oh ok, I thought your point was that people from Gujranwala belt look similar to Dogras. They do look somewhat similar, but not really. Dogras are on average lighter skinned, probably due to high altitude, cold weather etc. The first native victoria cross in the british army was a dogra rajput from Chakwal; Khudadad Khan:

 

[JammuWarrior]

I am not saying people from Gujranwala or Sialkot are from dogras, I would actually look down upon them. People of Gujranwala/sialkot/Gujrat are pure punjabis mostly jatts/gujjars/arain etc. I am just stating the fact that they are more accessible from Sialkot region than pothohar regardless of some minhas tribe migrating here and there from jammu to pothohar.

There are Muslim Dogras in West Punjab and they are known as Rajahs.

 

[Shabaz Sharif]

Oh ok, I thought your point was that people from Gujranwala belt look similar to Dogras. They do look somewhat similar, but not really. Dogras are on average lighter skinned, probably due to high altitude, cold weather etc. The first native victoria cross in the british army was a dogra rajput from Chakwal; Khudadad Khan:

this one?